Tis the season for virgin birth skepticism
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14-12-2013, 05:50 PM
RE: Tis the season for virgin birth skepticism
(14-12-2013 05:19 PM)Monster_Riffs Wrote:  
(14-12-2013 04:56 PM)Alla Wrote:  It may be. But we can ask ourselves another question: from whom did pagans borrow this concept?

I think the OP is investigating where Christianity borrowed the idea from. Not the other way around.
I understand this. But my point is this: if this idea was with pagans it doesn't mean that Christianity borrowed it. Or that house of Israel borrowed it.

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14-12-2013, 05:59 PM
RE: Tis the season for virgin birth skepticism
(14-12-2013 05:50 PM)Alla Wrote:  
(14-12-2013 05:19 PM)Monster_Riffs Wrote:  I think the OP is investigating where Christianity borrowed the idea from. Not the other way around.
I understand this. But my point is this: if this idea was with pagans it doesn't mean that Christianity borrowed it. Or that house of Israel borrowed it.

Sure, because there is no other evidence of them assimilating other religious beliefs or rituals into Christianity.Drinking Beverage

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14-12-2013, 06:03 PM
RE: Tis the season for virgin birth skepticism
(14-12-2013 02:21 PM)Mick Wrote:  There's a tremendous amount of misinformation out there - most of it spewed out by the Zeitgeist movie and the Acharya S/D.M. Murdock drivel that inspired it. So my question is - is there any RELIABLE information - by RESPECTED authors out there that would shed light on whether or not the virgin birth is a pagan concept?

It was her book 'The Christ Conspiracy, The Greatest Story Ever Sold' that put me on the search for other authors and got me to Dan Barker and on from there. I haven't read anything else of her's but I have respect for her in that it was her book that put me on the path I needed to be on.

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14-12-2013, 06:12 PM
RE: Tis the season for virgin birth skepticism
(14-12-2013 05:59 PM)Crulax Wrote:  
(14-12-2013 05:50 PM)Alla Wrote:  I understand this. But my point is this: if this idea was with pagans it doesn't mean that Christianity borrowed it. Or that house of Israel borrowed it.

Sure, because there is no other evidence of them assimilating other religious beliefs or rituals into Christianity.Drinking Beverage

Of course it's borrowed. The whole jesus story is an amalgamation of other myths that predate it. ... you seem to be trying to make a case along the lines of ... well the other cultures that had virgin birth myths before the jesus one are just stories but the house of Israel one is true.

Clearly I don't believe any of them but the more times it has travelled down through history the less likely it is to be true! ... Did you know as my alter ego THE MIGHTY ZEUS! I used to visit women as a shower of gold coins? NOW THAT my boy is STYLE! Big Grin

A man blames his bad childhood on leprechauns. He claims they don't exist, but yet still says without a doubt that they stole all his money and then killed his parents. That's why he became Leprechaun-Man

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14-12-2013, 06:19 PM
RE: Tis the season for virgin birth skepticism
(14-12-2013 05:46 PM)Alla Wrote:  Noah was not Hebrew. May be some descendants of Noah broke covenants with Yahweh(Jesus Christ) became pagans and borrowed some parts of the truth(Gospel)?

Noah was a myth, as any scholar knows.
The rest of your post is totally incoherently ignorant.

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14-12-2013, 06:25 PM
RE: Tis the season for virgin birth skepticism
(14-12-2013 06:19 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  
(14-12-2013 05:46 PM)Alla Wrote:  Noah was not Hebrew. May be some descendants of Noah broke covenants with Yahweh(Jesus Christ) became pagans and borrowed some parts of the truth(Gospel)?

Noah was a myth, as any scholar knows.
The rest of your post is totally incoherently ignorant.

Bits of doctrine borrowed here and there. A hint of insanity, the same drum banged over and over again. Just a hint of provocation. Very similar M.O to the young TTT methinks Smile

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14-12-2013, 10:22 PM
RE: Tis the season for virgin birth skepticism
(14-12-2013 05:46 PM)Alla Wrote:  Noah was not Hebrew. May be some descendants of Noah broke covenants with Yahweh(Jesus Christ) became pagans and borrowed some parts of the truth(Gospel)?

You are a gem. Don't ever change. Don't let us hardened atheists take away that doe-eyed innocence.

Give me your argument in the form of a published paper, and then we can start to talk.
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15-12-2013, 02:45 AM
RE: Tis the season for virgin birth skepticism
(14-12-2013 03:55 PM)Mick Wrote:  Having some well-documented examples of virgin birth myths outside of the Christian tradition would be useful in debates with Christians who think they originated the concept.

Nature originated the concept of parthenogenesis. Some species of reptiles are genuinely parthenogenetic.[1]

I don't know of any myths--besides the Christian--that include genuine parthenogenesis; they all involve some form of union. The mistranslation thesis that Bucky described is credibly-sourced and plausible.

Humans are imaginative creatures, not every artifact is entirely derivative. We do create some new things. Smile Pop-culture is recycled but bits-and-pieces get added and removed at each cycle.
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15-12-2013, 02:59 AM
RE: Tis the season for virgin birth skepticism
(14-12-2013 06:03 PM)Anjele Wrote:  It was her book 'The Christ Conspiracy, The Greatest Story Ever Sold' that put me on the search for other authors and got me to Dan Barker and on from there. I haven't read anything else of her's but I have respect for her in that it was her book that put me on the path I needed to be on.

Boo, hiss. Acharya S is pseudo-scholar. She has a cultish following. I remember a few years ago when her forum members were virtually singing hosannas to her and genuflecting to her as if she were some sort of prophet. Many years ago she summoned a bunch of her followers to gather on Dawkins' forum to act as meat puppets to promote her book "Suns of God". That ended tragically and comically for Acharya S and her drones. The vitriol and derision her meat puppets and book drew was quite funny.
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15-12-2013, 04:04 AM
RE: Tis the season for virgin birth skepticism
(15-12-2013 02:59 AM)Chippy Wrote:  
(14-12-2013 06:03 PM)Anjele Wrote:  It was her book 'The Christ Conspiracy, The Greatest Story Ever Sold' that put me on the search for other authors and got me to Dan Barker and on from there. I haven't read anything else of her's but I have respect for her in that it was her book that put me on the path I needed to be on.

Boo, hiss. Acharya S is pseudo-scholar. She has a cultish following. I remember a few years ago when her forum members were virtually singing hosannas to her and genuflecting to her as if she were some sort of prophet. Many years ago she summoned a bunch of her followers to gather on Dawkins' forum to act as meat puppets to promote her book "Suns of God". That ended tragically and comically for Acharya S and her drones. The vitriol and derision her meat puppets and book drew was quite funny.

Well, I did move on from her book rather quickly and found that there were/are many other authors to choose from. I haven't read anything else of hers and doubt that I ever will.

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