To evaluate Christianity, is the true key the Pentateuch?
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29-05-2015, 06:52 AM
RE: To evaluate Christianity, is the true key the Pentateuch?
(28-05-2015 05:12 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  Never read that book, but despite what Islam claims, Allah developed from a different Babylonian god than Yahweh, (Sin). Never realized that Ashera was Yahweh's mother also, but she was worshiped as his consort in a number of centers, (and there's archeological proof of that). The roots of Christianity are in ancient Judaism, in a way, but rest much more squarely in Apocalyptic (much later), Judaism.

So basically, you're saying that Christianity would be at least one more step removed away from the Pentateuch by virtue of this? It could still trace it's roots back to that*, but it is not directly based on it.

* of course, those roots could be further traced back to older polytheistic origins, which could go back further, still...
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29-05-2015, 07:21 AM (This post was last modified: 29-05-2015 07:28 AM by Bucky Ball.)
RE: To evaluate Christianity, is the true key the Pentateuch?
(29-05-2015 06:52 AM)RobbyPants Wrote:  
(28-05-2015 05:12 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  Never read that book, but despite what Islam claims, Allah developed from a different Babylonian god than Yahweh, (Sin). Never realized that Ashera was Yahweh's mother also, but she was worshiped as his consort in a number of centers, (and there's archeological proof of that). The roots of Christianity are in ancient Judaism, in a way, but rest much more squarely in Apocalyptic (much later), Judaism.

So basically, you're saying that Christianity would be at least one more step removed away from the Pentateuch by virtue of this? It could still trace it's roots back to that*, but it is not directly based on it.

* of course, those roots could be further traced back to older polytheistic origins, which could go back further, still...

Yes in a way. Of course without "historic/mythic" Judaism as we know it, there would be no Christianity as we know it (duh), but the central foundational concepts in what developed into Apocalyptic Judism, (after the Pentateuch was assembled a few hundred years eariler, and the social developements that occurred after the *so called* Babylonian Exile), for example the "exaltation of heros", the diminishment of the family line as what constituted "immortality", the diminishment of the temple in Jerusalem as THE central worship site, the rise of "individualism", all which were not really present earlier, are what spawned Christinaity, (or at least was the necessary fertile ground which allowed for it to get invented and develop).

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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29-05-2015, 05:27 PM
RE: To evaluate Christianity, is the true key the Pentateuch?
The Old Testament is the Foundation of Christianity

New Testament authors borrowed the Jewish beliefs that there was only one all-knowing, all-powerful God, and that man’s purpose was to serve this entity and impress him with how they treated each other.

The New Testament authors also sourced many ideas from the Septuagint when inventing Jesus’ stories, such as the concept of the Messiah, which they adopted and adapted.

It is probable that Christianity was originally created to undermine Judaism.

Without the Jewish script, there would be no Christianity today as we know it.

Despite this, many Christians regard the Old Testament as a mere, and relatively unimportant, prologue to the New Testament, largely because Paul, the Fathers of the Church, and others watered down the importance of Judaism.

Yet can today’s true believer, the purist who believes in the word of God, brush aside the Old Testament? The Jewish authors thought their rules were to last forever:

“You are to observe the statutes and ritual, the law and the commandments which he has given you in writing and to which you are always to conform” (2 Kings 17:37, NJB.)

In the New Testament, the author of James, who may well have been Jesus’ brother, wrote:

“You see, anyone who keeps the whole of the Law but trips up on a single point, is still guilty of breaking it all” (James 2:10, NJB.)

Jesus, supposedly Christianity’s supreme source of wisdom, said

“Do not imagine that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets. I have come not to abolish but to complete them” (Matt. 5:17, NJB.)

“It is easier for heaven and earth to disappear than for one little stroke to drop out of the Law” (Luke 16:17, NJB.)

When teaching in the temple, Jesus said,

“Did not Moses give you the Law? And yet not one of you keeps the Law!” (John 7:19, NJB.)

Jesus also said

“... scripture cannot be set aside” (John 10:35, NJB.)

Jesus and his brother James clearly taught people to obey the Jewish Law.

“The Law” consisted of five books: Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers, and Deuteronomy. Compared to the ancient versions in the Dead Sea Scrolls they are remarkably unchanged since Jesus’ time. The Law contains instructions to kill adulterers, female fornicators, homosexuals and witches. Permission is given to rape women and girls and smash babies onto rocks. If a man raped a Jewish virgin, he must buy her from her father and marry her. If a girl did not scream loud enough when being raped, she was to be killed. One’s daughter could be sold as a sex slave. If a Jewish girl could not produce the bloody sheets from her wedding night she was to be stoned. People were encouraged to own slaves, and could beat them to death, as long as they did it slowly.

Welcome to the reality of Old Testament Law, as promoted by Jesus!

“Oh no! This is not what Jesus would have taught”

I hear Christians protest. Yet Jews like Jesus would have regarded Scripture as the law. Jesus said that he did not reinvent God’s doctrine:

“Jesus answered them: ‘My teaching is not from myself: it comes from the one who sent me’” (John 7:16, NJB.)

“The Father and I are one” (John 10:30, NJB.)

Jesus considered himself a chip off the old block.

Jesus often threatened violence and readily condemned people to hell. This aggressive attitude was almost certainly copied by Gospel authors from Scripture.

Most modern Churchmen try to claim the Jewish law is no longer relevant. They are echoing Paul’s teaching. Paul undermined the authority of Jewish scripture:

“If that first covenant had been faultless, there would have been no room for a second one to replace it” (Heb. 8:7, NJB.) Note the circularity of his argument.

“Since, as we see it, a person is justified by faith and not by doing what the Law tells him to do” (Rom. 3:28, NJB.)

“Christ redeemed us from the curse of the Law” (Gal. 3:13, NJB.)

Paul unambiguously contradicted Jesus. This is a fundamental issue raised time and time again by objective readers of the Bible: the differences between Jesus’ Judaism and Paul’s Christianity.

There is an obvious explanation. Paul never met Yeshua. (the “road to Damascus” story told in Acts is a myth.) What is more, Paul knew nothing about Jesus the preacher’s teachings, because Paul wrote long before Gospel authors documented Jesus’ injunctions.

There are some other quotations, also from Jesus, in which he contradicted himself by denigrating a literal interpretation of the Law. It can be argued that there were too many authors putting words in Jesus’ mouth.

It is interesting to consider whether Christianity is the Roman government's version of Judaism, and Islam is some arab war lords' version of Judaism. Both groups realised that using scripture, as per the Jews, was a powerful way to control people.
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