Traditional Chinese Medicine
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30-04-2016, 07:50 PM
RE: Traditional Chinese Medicine
(30-04-2016 07:46 PM)Stevil Wrote:  
(30-04-2016 07:24 PM)dancefortwo Wrote:  I've had acupuncture several times. Now I know it's all placebo effect. It relaxes me and some scientists think it releases endorphins which ease pain. I'd probably get the same effect from a good massage but I can't stand people putting their hands all over me, well except for my husband, so once in awhile I go in and get an acupuncture treatment. The gal I go to has neat soft music and a little tinkling waterfall nearby and low lighting. Yeah, I gotta admit, it's all placebo effect. Blush
LOL
I hate massages too. Went on a holiday to Fiji a couple of years ago. Wanted to give my complimentary massage to my wife but they wouldn't let me transfer it to her. So wife talked me into having one with her.

I absolutely hated it. The massage lady kept telling me to relax, she kept going down low on my backside and I kept pulling my pants back up, she was pulling them down a bit low for my liking. At the end of it, when we were leaving the staff were all lined up and had smirks on their faces. I guess they thought it was funny seeing how uncomfortable I was about the whole ordeal.

I don't see any value in massage. It has no lasting effects, no medical benefit. May as well just sleep in or listen to some music if you want to relax, or play guitar, or paint or something..

BTW, I don't see how getting pins stuck into you can be relaxing. WTF!

Massage loosens muscles. If you suffer from cramping or involuntary muscle contractions or spasms it can be very helpful.

[Image: dobie.png]Science is the process we've designed to be responsible for generating our best guess as to what the fuck is going on. Girly Man
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30-04-2016, 07:53 PM
RE: Traditional Chinese Medicine
Blush
My biggest problem with massages in China was trying to hide my erection. They'd put me in this thin robe and then send some hot little Chinese girl in to work me over. No it wasn't a dirty massage or anything. I'm just a dirty, sexually repressed person Tongue

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30-04-2016, 08:22 PM
RE: Traditional Chinese Medicine
(30-04-2016 07:46 PM)Stevil Wrote:  
(30-04-2016 07:24 PM)dancefortwo Wrote:  I've had acupuncture several times. Now I know it's all placebo effect. It relaxes me and some scientists think it releases endorphins which ease pain. I'd probably get the same effect from a good massage but I can't stand people putting their hands all over me, well except for my husband, so once in awhile I go in and get an acupuncture treatment. The gal I go to has neat soft music and a little tinkling waterfall nearby and low lighting. Yeah, I gotta admit, it's all placebo effect. Blush
LOL
I hate massages too. Went on a holiday to Fiji a couple of years ago. Wanted to give my complimentary massage to my wife but they wouldn't let me transfer it to her. So wife talked me into having one with her.

I absolutely hated it. The massage lady kept telling me to relax, she kept going down low on my backside and I kept pulling my pants back up, she was pulling them down a bit low for my liking. At the end of it, when we were leaving the staff were all lined up and had smirks on their faces. I guess they thought it was funny seeing how uncomfortable I was about the whole ordeal.

I don't see any value in massage. It has no lasting effects, no medical benefit. May as well just sleep in or listen to some music if you want to relax, or play guitar, or paint or something..

BTW, I don't see how getting pins stuck into you can be relaxing. WTF!

The pins don't hurt at all. They're about the size of a hair and maybe go into the skin, I'd guess, 1/16th of an inch.......if that. And I don't think it matters where the hell they put the pins either. But you see, I know I'm fooling myself into the placebo effect of acupuncture. I realize this fully.

Massage is fabulous when one exercises a lot. It relaxes the muscles like nothing else does but I'm rather modest about strangers touching me. I used to get my husband to give me a foot massage when I danced on pointe and it was pure heaven.

Shakespeare's Comedy of Errors.... on Donald J. Trump:

He is deformed, crooked, old, and sere,
Ill-fac’d, worse bodied, shapeless every where;
Vicious, ungentle, foolish, blunt, unkind,
Stigmatical in making, worse in mind.
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30-04-2016, 08:27 PM
RE: Traditional Chinese Medicine
(30-04-2016 07:53 PM)yakherder Wrote:  Blush
My biggest problem with massages in China was trying to hide my erection. They'd put me in this thin robe and then send some hot little Chinese girl in to work me over. No it wasn't a dirty massage or anything. I'm just a dirty, sexually repressed person Tongue

My husband gets a massage once in awhile. He claims that the masseuse always lifts up the towel very quickly to check his groin area towards the end of the massage. He's had both male and female masseuses do this and wonders what the hell they're checking. Huh

Shakespeare's Comedy of Errors.... on Donald J. Trump:

He is deformed, crooked, old, and sere,
Ill-fac’d, worse bodied, shapeless every where;
Vicious, ungentle, foolish, blunt, unkind,
Stigmatical in making, worse in mind.
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30-04-2016, 08:27 PM
RE: Traditional Chinese Medicine
(30-04-2016 07:53 PM)yakherder Wrote:  Blush
My biggest problem with massages in China was trying to hide my erection. They'd put me in this thin robe and then send some hot little Chinese girl in to work me over. No it wasn't a dirty massage or anything. I'm just a dirty, sexually repressed person Tongue

I have had the opposite happen - I had no idea the massage I was gifted was a dirty massage. And the guy delivered a really nice full body massage, at the end I was totally relaxed. Then, with just a few moves he aroused me and I orgasmed. I never even realized what was happening until it happened. I was duly impressed, that guy had skills! Shy

[Image: dobie.png]Science is the process we've designed to be responsible for generating our best guess as to what the fuck is going on. Girly Man
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30-04-2016, 09:18 PM
RE: Traditional Chinese Medicine
(30-04-2016 08:27 PM)Dom Wrote:  
(30-04-2016 07:53 PM)yakherder Wrote:  Blush
My biggest problem with massages in China was trying to hide my erection. They'd put me in this thin robe and then send some hot little Chinese girl in to work me over. No it wasn't a dirty massage or anything. I'm just a dirty, sexually repressed person Tongue

I have had the opposite happen - I had no idea the massage I was gifted was a dirty massage. And the guy delivered a really nice full body massage, at the end I was totally relaxed. Then, with just a few moves he aroused me and I orgasmed. I never even realized what was happening until it happened. I was duly impressed, that guy had skills! Shy

You're a dirty, dirty girl.

There is only one really serious philosophical question, and that is suicide. -Camus
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30-04-2016, 11:23 PM
RE: Traditional Chinese Medicine
(30-04-2016 08:27 PM)Dom Wrote:  I have had the opposite happen - I had no idea the massage I was gifted was a dirty massage. And the guy delivered a really nice full body massage, at the end I was totally relaxed. Then, with just a few moves he aroused me and I orgasmed. I never even realized what was happening until it happened. I was duly impressed, that guy had skills! Shy
I think, for a self professed liberal amoralist(whatever that means)
I sometimes think that I am way too conservative with my own life.

Consider I think I shall call my past the "wasted years"
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01-05-2016, 12:12 AM
RE: Traditional Chinese Medicine
(30-04-2016 06:25 AM)SYZ Wrote:  The entire notion of traditional Chinese medicine having any relevancy or validity is unsupported by any empirical scientific evidence. Or to put it more succinctly; it's all bullshit.
...

Not so fast.

My local TCM outlets have many forms of dehydrated excrement ... not just bull.

I concur with EvoK's exposé above and St.Evil's parallel with religion... and I draw this conclusion:

It's been a few thousand year field trial (uncontrolled and then idealised). Memetic trial and error. So a small percentage will actually work and much will be placebo or snake-oil as we see with 'alternative' medicine in general.

Is it not worthwhile (if, as Girly notes, there may be gold in them thar hills) to apply modern analytics to these 'cures' to find the positives? For example, willow bark => salicylic acid.

St.Evil's real issue is in regard to his in-laws and their entrenched beliefs. As ever, the solution is education but as with attempting to convert a believer, a fact-dump ain't gonna do it...

"You don't believe because you just hate god anything you can't deconstruct!"

The patient (no pun intended) Street Epistemology approach is more likely to reap rewards.

Good luck.

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01-05-2016, 01:45 PM
RE: Traditional Chinese Medicine
(01-05-2016 12:12 AM)DLJ Wrote:  St.Evil's real issue is in regard to his in-laws and their entrenched beliefs. As ever, the solution is education but as with attempting to convert a believer, a fact-dump ain't gonna do it...

"You don't believe because you just hate god anything you can't deconstruct!"

The patient (no pun intended) Street Epistemology approach is more likely to reap rewards.

Good luck.
Yes, wife got angry when I told her that I researched it and told her some of the points from my research.

Angry, because she felt I was challenging and disrespecting her beliefs.
I tried to drum into her that it isn't "western" medicine, that instead it is "evidence" based medicine. I pointed out that Qi and Meridians aren't biological things, they aren't blood flow or lymph system or nervous system. They are made up concepts, not based on evidence.

She came up with an anecdote, her sister in law was having problems conceiving, tried "western" medicine, it didn't work, went to Chine and tried a hybrid "western" and TCM approach and it worked.
Of course I said we don't know which aspect worked, and that a one off anecdote is hardly supporting evidence. But that's the way it goes, there is always an anecdote success story.
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01-05-2016, 02:04 PM
RE: Traditional Chinese Medicine
(30-04-2016 09:18 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  
(30-04-2016 08:27 PM)Dom Wrote:  I have had the opposite happen - I had no idea the massage I was gifted was a dirty massage. And the guy delivered a really nice full body massage, at the end I was totally relaxed. Then, with just a few moves he aroused me and I orgasmed. I never even realized what was happening until it happened. I was duly impressed, that guy had skills! Shy

You're a dirty, dirty girl.

Tongue

[Image: dobie.png]Science is the process we've designed to be responsible for generating our best guess as to what the fuck is going on. Girly Man
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