Trump's rise = waning religion?
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08-04-2016, 10:28 PM
RE: Trump's rise = waning religion?
(08-04-2016 10:09 PM)dancefortwo Wrote:  Donald Trump is stumbling around in the Republican party creating havoc everywhere he steps and they don't know what to do now.

He's basically just saying out loud and in plain English all of the terrible shit the Republican used to hide being euphemisms. The problem isn't illegal aliens, it's those damn Mexican murder rapists!

He's a living embodiment of their hate an ignorance, just sans filter.

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08-04-2016, 10:46 PM
RE: Trump's rise = waning religion?
(08-04-2016 08:34 PM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  
(08-04-2016 08:25 PM)earmuffs Wrote:  Lol, no bloody way. Not a chance in dick hell are you guys gonna change the two party system.
The only people that could change it are the very people who don't want it changed, the two parties...

The democrats and republicans love the system, it's such a cash cow for them and even when they're not in power they're still the only other major party.
The only way it's getting changed is if you guys vote for a minor party but that's not gonna happen because the vast majority of Americans are fucking idiots (as evidence by the votes Trump and Hilary have) and don't think anything's wrong. They think the issue is the Mexicans and Muslims, not America.


Wrong. There is a contingency plan written into the Constitution itself that allows for the calling of independent conventions that can ratify Amendments to the Constitution and can entirely bypass Congress and the President. They either have been used, or the threat of their use, has pushed through things like woman's suffrage in the past. How do you think women who didn't have the right to vote got the right to vote? They were one state away from a successful convention and doing it themselves before Congress relented and passed the Amendment.

Interesting. I just assumed a party gave them the vote. We were the first country to give women the vote and I'm pretty sure that's just what we did, the party in power was like ummmm yea ok we'll let 'em vote.

How does this contingency plan work? Public vote?
Because again, that wouldn't work because the majority don't believe there's anything wrong with the system. I mean they voted for Trump and Hillary for christ sake, these aren't bright people.

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08-04-2016, 11:01 PM (This post was last modified: 09-04-2016 04:08 AM by EvolutionKills.)
RE: Trump's rise = waning religion?
(08-04-2016 10:46 PM)earmuffs Wrote:  
(08-04-2016 08:34 PM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  Wrong. There is a contingency plan written into the Constitution itself that allows for the calling of independent conventions that can ratify Amendments to the Constitution and can entirely bypass Congress and the President. They either have been used, or the threat of their use, has pushed through things like woman's suffrage in the past. How do you think women who didn't have the right to vote got the right to vote? They were one state away from a successful convention and doing it themselves before Congress relented and passed the Amendment.

Interesting. I just assumed a party gave them the vote. We were the first country to give women the vote and I'm pretty sure that's just what we did, the party in power was like ummmm yea ok we'll let 'em vote.

How does this contingency plan work? Public vote?
Because again, that wouldn't work because the majority don't believe there's anything wrong with the system. I mean they voted for Trump and Hillary for christ sake, these aren't bright people.

No, the vast majority agree the system is broken and needs fixing, but they also don't know how to fix it; apathy and ignorance is the great yolk of the people.

From Wikipedia...

A Convention to propose amendments to the United States Constitution, also called an Article V Convention, or Amendments Convention, called for by two-thirds (presently 34) of the state legislatures, is one of two processes authorized by Article Five of the United States Constitution whereby the Constitution, the nation's frame of government, may be altered. Amendments may also be proposed by the Congress with a two-thirds vote in both the House of Representatives and the Senate.

To become part of the Constitution, an amendment must be ratified by either—as determined by Congress—the legislatures of three-fourths (presently 38) of the states or State ratifying conventions in three-fourths of the states. Thirty-three amendments to the United States Constitution have been approved by Congress and sent to the states for ratification. Twenty-seven of these amendments have been ratified and are now part of the Constitution. As of 2016 the convention process has never been used for proposing constitutional amendments.

Similarly, the group Wolf PAC chose this method to promote its cause, which is to overturn the U.S. Supreme Court's decision in Citizens United v. FEC. Their resolution has passed in Vermont, California, Illinois, and New Jersey.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Convention...nstitution


So basically, if you can get enough individual state legislatures to agree with you, you can bypass the federal government and amend the Constitution directly. If the Supreme Court and Congress won't get money out of politics, enough people on the state level can; such as by specifically amending the Constitution to revert previous rulings like Citizens United.

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09-04-2016, 03:54 AM
RE: Trump's rise = waning religion?
(08-04-2016 12:16 PM)dancefortwo Wrote:  Here's an interesting article from the New York Times about Trump and the Religious Right titled:

"Donald Trump’s Rise Shows Religion Is Losing Its Political Power"

It's worth a read.

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/04/06/busine...il0=y&_r=1

No, Trump used religion to get votes too. Trump "The Bible is my favorite book". Religion started losing it's power long before he ran. The moron who wrote this crap is out of his mind.

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11-04-2016, 12:57 PM
RE: Trump's rise = waning religion?
(08-04-2016 08:30 PM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  Whether or not we can actually accomplish this without burning the whole house down is another matter entirely. We've turned from the brink before, we've survived the Great Depression, the Gilded Age, and a Civil War.

We are now entering the Gelded Age.


(08-04-2016 10:28 PM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  He's basically just saying out loud and in plain English all of the terrible shit the Republican used to hide being euphemisms. The problem isn't illegal aliens, it's those damn Mexican murder rapists!

He's a living embodiment of their hate an ignorance, just sans filter.

Exactly. I've described him before as using his outdoor voice instead of the dog whistles everyone else is using.
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13-04-2016, 12:42 PM
RE: Trump's rise = waning religion?
Dom nailed it. The four major candidates that are left are all their own unique mixture of incompetence, hatred, pandering and dishonesty. Not one quality candidate among them. Assuming 1 of the four sits in the white house a year from now, things will get bad, real bad. Bernie will ensure that the economy will flatline, Hillary, if she hasn't started a war, will widen the gap between the rich and the rest, Donald will alienate the world and may too cause a war and Ted will try to create a theocracy made in his own image. Truly we are fucked in the US of A.

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16-04-2016, 10:55 AM
RE: Trump's rise = waning religion?
(08-04-2016 10:09 PM)dancefortwo Wrote:  The Republican Party, or as I sometimes call it the Religious Party, set themselves up for this. They catered to the far religious right nut jobs for the last two decades while the rest of the US was going socially forward. It's their own damn fault. Donald Trump is stumbling around in the Republican party creating havoc everywhere he steps and they don't know what to do now.

I keep going back to the conservative senator from Arizona, Barry Goldwater's remark about the religious taking over the Republican party.

“Mark my word, if and when these preachers get control of the [Republican] party, and they're sure trying to do so, it's going to be a terrible damn problem. Frankly, these people frighten me. Politics and governing demand compromise. But these Christians believe they are acting in the name of God, so they can't and won't compromise. I know, I've tried to deal with them.”

He said that in 1994.
That's an interesting quote, especially when you consider how well it describes Republican candidate Ted Cruz. That religious nutjob thinks being a dealmaker and compromising across party lines for the sake of getting shit done are bad things.

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16-04-2016, 11:15 AM
RE: Trump's rise = waning religion?
Trump and Sanders are really 3rd and 4th party runners. They have little in common with the parties they run under, they just know that as 3rd and 4th party runners they don't have a chance under this system.

Trump is already pissed, trying to intimidate the republicans. He is close to exploding. He is staying true to the malignant narcissist categorization. Spontaneous combustion is not far away. (I hope, the sooner the better).

Sanders has the youth. I doubt he can totally pull off this nomination, but so far he has done a lot better than expected. He is a sign of future changes as the young gain more power.

I don't think the country is ready yet for a big change, but if we get Clinton and another 8 years of inertia, we are going to see a big change in the parties for the following election.

Trump and Sanders are doing us a big favor, they are setting precedent for non-party people to run successfully - they will both at least come awfully close to the nomination. This will encourage future possible candidates who are not party aligned to go ahead and run.

Revolutions (handing over of power) don't have to be bloody. They can be normal societal evolution. I do think that is what we are looking at here, it's a slower process but also one that causes little upheaval.

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