Trump shared classified info to Russians
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28-05-2017, 06:00 AM
RE: Trump shared classified info to Russians
(28-05-2017 02:05 AM)morondog Wrote:  From the outside, there's a strain of US politics that seems to have a very simplistic message:
  • We are the best.
  • We maintain our position as the best by military force.
  • Everyone hates us because of that, and because they're not the best.
  • If we ever look weak, it's all over. We won't be the best any more.
  • So we must keep our military strong at all costs.
  • On the other hand, poor people just weigh us down.
  • They must be punished.

It's weirdly effective. The notion that a good government is one that works on behalf of its citizens to raise their standard of living and achieves foreign policy aims primarily through diplomacy and trade seems not to even register. USA must play international cop, that's the only position you guys - especially your conservative crowd - seem to be psychologically OK with. And like a some cops, there's evidence that your country is not the paragon of virtue that a lot of people seem to wish-believe it is.

That's it, in a nutshell. You did forget "And we're totally doing all this military stuff for humanitarian reasons, because we're The Good Guys™, and not just to exploit other countries' resources, maintain the supply lines for that exploitation, or make sure any country that thinks we shouldn't be able to exploit them knows that we'll simply bomb them back to the stone age to 'regime change' their leadership like we did to their neighbors."

"Theology made no provision for evolution. The biblical authors had missed the most important revelation of all! Could it be that they were not really privy to the thoughts of God?" - E. O. Wilson
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28-05-2017, 06:23 AM
RE: Trump shared classified info to Russians
(28-05-2017 02:05 AM)morondog Wrote:  From the outside, there's a strain of US politics that seems to have a very simplistic message:
  • We are the best.
  • We maintain our position as the best by military force.
  • Everyone hates us because of that, and because they're not the best.
  • If we ever look weak, it's all over. We won't be the best any more.
  • So we must keep our military strong at all costs.
  • On the other hand, poor people just weigh us down.
  • They must be punished.

It's weirdly effective. The notion that a good government is one that works on behalf of its citizens to raise their standard of living and achieves foreign policy aims primarily through diplomacy and trade seems not to even register. USA must play international cop, that's the only position you guys - especially your conservative crowd - seem to be psychologically OK with. And like a some cops, there's evidence that your country is not the paragon of virtue that a lot of people seem to wish-believe it is.

There is currently only one answer that has a chance in hell to change that - Bernie.

[Image: dobie.png]Science is the process we've designed to be responsible for generating our best guess as to what the fuck is going on. Girly Man
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28-05-2017, 06:46 AM
RE: Trump shared classified info to Russians
(28-05-2017 06:23 AM)Dom Wrote:  
(28-05-2017 02:05 AM)morondog Wrote:  From the outside, there's a strain of US politics that seems to have a very simplistic message:
  • We are the best.
  • We maintain our position as the best by military force.
  • Everyone hates us because of that, and because they're not the best.
  • If we ever look weak, it's all over. We won't be the best any more.
  • So we must keep our military strong at all costs.
  • On the other hand, poor people just weigh us down.
  • They must be punished.

It's weirdly effective. The notion that a good government is one that works on behalf of its citizens to raise their standard of living and achieves foreign policy aims primarily through diplomacy and trade seems not to even register. USA must play international cop, that's the only position you guys - especially your conservative crowd - seem to be psychologically OK with. And like a some cops, there's evidence that your country is not the paragon of virtue that a lot of people seem to wish-believe it is.

There is currently only one answer that has a chance in hell to change that - Bernie.

As much as I love Bernie, between his scorched earthers and Hillary's scorched earthers, whom WERE NOT the majority of either camp, I don't think it would be a good idea for either of them to run again. I think unfortunately there is too much division for that to work.

We need fresh people who can unite liberals not divide them.

I think this time around we need to pound on the swing states and expand beyond the suburbs. I really hate that my fellow liberals forget our party exists in all 50 states.

Maybe an Oprah/Duckworth, Cobert/MichelleObama Warren/Michelle.

I think Bernie would be great at DNC chair and is still great for pulling the party back to the left where it needs to be, but I think far too much of the bitterness and blame is still there between his camp and Hillary's.

Poetry by Brian37(poems by an atheist) Also on Facebook as BrianJames Rational Poet and Twitter Brianrrs37
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28-05-2017, 06:51 AM (This post was last modified: 28-05-2017 08:30 AM by GirlyMan.)
RE: Trump shared classified info to Russians
(27-05-2017 09:20 PM)Alla Wrote:  
GirlyMan Wrote:And how do you go about deciding which is which and who is who, dear Alla? I can lift a 1/4 ton off the ground but I know what it feels like to not be able to get out of bed the dread was so pervasive and permeating. How do you personally Alla, decide which is which and who is who?

Old people. They need help, it doesn't matter how strong they are.
Disabled people of any age. They need help, it doesn't matter how strong they are.
Single mothers. They need help.
People who are not old and who are not disabled and can not find job. They need help until they are able to support themselves. They have to look for job.
I think it is fair and compassionate to them and to those who work hard and pay taxes.

So you think because you work hard and pay taxes that I should somehow feel compassionate towards you? THAT I SHOULD SHOW COMPASSION FOR YOU BECAUSE YOU WORK HARD AND PAY TAXES. And your implicit intent is to diminish the compassion I feel towards the poor bastard receiving the benefits. Alla, you insult me by thinking I would be stupid enough to not immediately see through a most despicable attempt to deflect and manipulate my compassion. This is precisely the shit you accuse Satan of doing. And here I thought that you was at least a compassionate dolt, but now I know that you're just another fucking hypocritical ntiwit pretending to be a Christian so that you can think you're better than the next guy so God's gonna let you into heaven when even you know deep down that you are a flaming asshole who gives no shits about anyone or anything else other than saving your sorry soul not worth even staining the face of the earth let alone disgracing even the mere concept of heaven. There is no way you could be compassionate because you have no fucking idea what the word even means. You are not a Christian. You have no fucking clue what Jesus was even talking about. You are not anything like a Christian. The 40 year old varicocele on my left nut is more Christian than you. You are Sapphira, you are the reason the fourth act of the apostles failed. You destroy and subvert any attempt to actually realize and make manifest The Word of The Christ in flesh and blood.

That Alla, is how I feel about your malicious and malevolent attempt to deflect my compassion away from my brotherman in need towards your own selfish ass.

Idaho is right the State for you. Please stay there. I am truly sorry for your dying uninsured friend.

#sigh
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28-05-2017, 08:04 AM
RE: Trump shared classified info to Russians
I don't know what you did Alla but in all my time here I don't think I've ever seen Girly as cross as this. Shocking
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28-05-2017, 08:06 AM
RE: Trump shared classified info to Russians
(28-05-2017 08:04 AM)adey67 Wrote:  I don't know what you did Alla but in all my time here I don't think I've ever seen Girly as cross as this. Shocking

I thought the same thing. There is no one on this board more forgiving and willing to look for the good in people than our Girlyman.

See here they are the bruises some were self-inflicted and some showed up along the way. - JF
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28-05-2017, 08:25 AM
RE: Trump shared classified info to Russians
(28-05-2017 06:00 AM)RocketSurgeon76 Wrote:  
(28-05-2017 02:05 AM)morondog Wrote:  From the outside, there's a strain of US politics that seems to have a very simplistic message:
  • We are the best.
  • We maintain our position as the best by military force.
  • Everyone hates us because of that, and because they're not the best.
  • If we ever look weak, it's all over. We won't be the best any more.
  • So we must keep our military strong at all costs.
  • On the other hand, poor people just weigh us down.
  • They must be punished.

It's weirdly effective. The notion that a good government is one that works on behalf of its citizens to raise their standard of living and achieves foreign policy aims primarily through diplomacy and trade seems not to even register. USA must play international cop, that's the only position you guys - especially your conservative crowd - seem to be psychologically OK with. And like a some cops, there's evidence that your country is not the paragon of virtue that a lot of people seem to wish-believe it is.

That's it, in a nutshell. You did forget "And we're totally doing all this military stuff for humanitarian reasons, because we're The Good Guys™, and not just to exploit other countries' resources, maintain the supply lines for that exploitation, or make sure any country that thinks we shouldn't be able to exploit them knows that we'll simply bomb them back to the stone age to 'regime change' their leadership like we did to their neighbors."

You totally made me think of Tyrant in season 1. Bassam, the American educated pediatrician who immigrated to flee his family's brutal dictatorship, is now talking with the US Special Envoy. He's realized to save his home country and its citizens from his brother's insane dictatorial rule causing a civil war, he has to launch a coup. So he asks the Special Envoy, Tucker, for help.

Tucker: The US is not in the business of regime change.

Bassam: Say that again with a straight face.

Need to think of a witty signature.
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28-05-2017, 08:46 AM
RE: Trump shared classified info to Russians
The focus on those who "work hard and pay taxes" and the active attempts to take our public health away from the poor and sick scares me, and not only because I am in the latter category. It is reminiscent of the "logic" behind most of the Nazi German policies for which the Reich became so infamous... the "parasites on society" versus the "good, hardworking folk of Germany" propaganda that caused Germans to blame their hardships on their fellow Germans, rather than the decisions of their leadership (and allied wealthy class) who had gotten them into the hardships in the first place.

Every time I go on XBox, now, I hear people in the voice chat using racial slurs and other Breitbart terms (e.g. calling me a "libtard" when I simply ask them not to call the former President a "monkey", as happened very recently), and just shit tons of general anger being directed against fellow Americans they have been trained to think of as different from them. That's why it worries me so much that everyone I talk about this seems so impervious to facts and figures on the subject-- if you look objectively at the stuff the Nazi leadership were telling the German people, it's obvious that it doesn't add up; however, there are a few million dead people who would call those "alternative facts" about supposed German freeloaders and secret-control-elites (in that case, the academics and Jews) more important than reality, since the Big Lie is what reaches the masses, it seems.

Now I'm not calling the current GOP or anyone else a Nazi, unless they actually hold Nazi/Supremacist sympathies. I am simply pointing out that the parallels between the type of thinking, or sociopolitical philosophy, that underlies most of what I hear coming out of the Heritage Foundation (etc) think tanks scares the shit out of the historian in me. Sad

"Theology made no provision for evolution. The biblical authors had missed the most important revelation of all! Could it be that they were not really privy to the thoughts of God?" - E. O. Wilson
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28-05-2017, 10:17 AM
RE: Trump shared classified info to Russians
(28-05-2017 08:46 AM)RocketSurgeon76 Wrote:  ... scares the shit out of the historian in me ...

The lesson we haven't learned from Hitler is that Hitler wasn't the problem. For all our cherished intelligence we are still in critical ways a colossally stupid species. It is the greatest and most obscene irony of our existence that so much of our ways and means of securing our existence has only made our existence terrifyingly uncertain.
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28-05-2017, 10:47 AM
RE: Trump shared classified info to Russians
(28-05-2017 10:17 AM)Airportkid Wrote:  
(28-05-2017 08:46 AM)RocketSurgeon76 Wrote:  ... scares the shit out of the historian in me ...

The lesson we haven't learned from Hitler is that Hitler wasn't the problem. For all our cherished intelligence we are still in critical ways a colossally stupid species. It is the greatest and most obscene irony of our existence that so much of our ways and means of securing our existence has only made our existence terrifyingly uncertain.
He was part of the problem. He seized the opportunity and made situation worse by his interference but some kind of authoritarian rule was likely (according to Richard Evans). Eugenics, social darwinism, antisemitism and nationalism existed independently of Hitler but he was able to make toxic mix from them.

The first revolt is against the supreme tyranny of theology, of the phantom of God. As long as we have a master in heaven, we will be slaves on earth.

Mikhail Bakunin.
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