U.S. Supreme Court free speech ruling
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26-06-2017, 09:05 PM
RE: U.S. Supreme Court free speech ruling
(24-06-2017 07:21 AM)Lord Dark Helmet Wrote:  
(23-06-2017 09:32 PM)GenesisNemesis Wrote:  The only reason I disagree is because throughout his campaign he kept saying some very far-right things.

Like what?

“When Mexico sends its people, they’re not sending their best. They’re not sending you. They’re not sending you. They’re sending people that have lots of problems and they’re bringing those problems with us. They’re bringing drugs, they’re bringing crime, they’re rapists, and some, I assume, are good people.”
--announcing candidacy, June 16, 2015

“I would build a great wall. And nobody builds walls better than me, believe me. And I’ll build them very inexpensively. I will build a great great wall on our southern border and I’ll have Mexico pay for that wall.” --announcing candidacy, June 16, 2015

"I could stand in the middle of Fifth Avenue and shoot somebody, and I wouldn't lose any voters, okay? It's, like, incredible." –Sioux Center, Iowa, January 23, 2016

"If she [Hillary Clinton] gets to pick her judges – nothing you can do, folks. Although, the Second Amendment people. Maybe there is. I don’t know." –Wilmington, North Carolina, Aug. 9, 2016

“I’m in total support of waterboarding. It has to be within the law, but I have to expand the law.” -- January 26, 2017

--
Dr H

"So, I became an anarchist, and all I got was this lousy T-shirt."
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26-06-2017, 11:22 PM (This post was last modified: 26-06-2017 11:27 PM by JesseB.)
RE: U.S. Supreme Court free speech ruling
(22-06-2017 11:49 PM)Robvalue Wrote:  Personally, I think that people empower "offensive" words and phrases by making such a huge deal about them. Words aren't magical. It's the intent behind them that matters, in my opinion. By loading them up with so much taboo, they end up being defined as being offensive. In a later time, when people have given up caring about the word itself, no one gives a damn about it. Instead they've moved onto others words that they load up.

Agreed, here's a little story on the thought.

Personally I think the cure to this idiotic madness is teaching biology. The entire thing is silly stupid and sad from beginning to end. We're all Humans that's all we've ever been and all we'll ever be (though a new species may and likely will arise from us one day). But getting back to my original point.

I'm not white, I'm not Mexican. My mother and her family came from Mexico, my fathers family came from Scotland I think, not really sure there since they don't care and neither do I and they came to this country generations before my mom and grandma (so anyone that remembers is LONG dead). I've been called many "racial slurs" in my life, funny there's racial slurs against white people yet no one seems to mention or care. I get called both racial slurs for being "Mexican" and being "white" depending on who's talking to me, and more often than not both groups will call me a "Mutt." Those that want to scream about offence seem to think "historical oppression is a valid argument, the reclassify me as "white" and hate me just as much as anyone else for the race they push on me. I'm not responsible for my fathers drunk ass or my mom's actions either nor am I responsible for anything their parents have done and so on implying otherwise is insane, frankly wrong bordering on evil, and crazy. And I look at others the same way, each person stands on their own individual merit and what they can earn under their own power. And frankly I don't ask for much, don't call me stupid or treat me like shit and I'll get along with ya pretty well.

Although racial slurs have never bothered me (at least when directed at me specifically), there are real things that do bother me and I'll put an example below

I was once working in a shop as a sales rep and a repair tech, my co workers were all from various parts of South America as far as their claimed family linage and whatever. However I am "Half" Mexican. The only thing a white supremacist hates worse than a black person is a "half" white, and I've encountered a LOT of this in my life. People switch between both Mexican racial slurs and white racial slurs and calling me a mutt since technically I have no race so the race thing is stupid to me. However the reality is it isn't just white supremacists who think/act/talk like that. I'm equally hated by Mexicans and others for not being a "real" Mexican. So my co workers decided my new nickname was "mutt" and that's what they called me. It was the only thing they ever called me by. I didn't particularly like it but then they clearly didn't particularly like me. One of the girls there would come and sit on the arm of my chair, she was dating one of the other techs and was clearly trying to lure me into an inappropriate situation to try and get me fired, I repeatedly had to kick her out of my cubical and ask her to leave me alone. Her boyfriend treated me like I wasn't even human. The bosses we're rarely around. It wasn't the phrase "mutt" that bothered me so much as the clear contempt and hatred. I mean fuck my best friend calls me an asshole, that sure as hell does't bother me. Frankly sometimes he's quite right about that lol. It wasn't fun working there despite loving my job (it was the first job I had where I got to work with tech instead of working around dangerous equipment, nothing made me happier than fixing shit with my headphones on not having to deal with people).

I only worked there a few months, I was feeling powerless to stop them from bothering me constantly (which really was all I wanted, I go to work to do my job not socialize, I've never had a "friend" on any job site I've ever been to because I'm not there to make friends, I'm there to work. That's it). So one afternoon I was talking with the girl that worked the front desk (the one that kept invading my space), she called me a mutt and without thinking I said, "You know Mexicans are decedent from Spaniards and natives in south America, by your standards we're all "Mutts."

But again I'd point to basic biology 101. There's no fucking such thing as "race" and certainly no such thing as a "pure race" of any kind regardless of skin color, we're all hodgepodge descendants from the same pool of genetic material hundreds of thousands of years ago. There wasn't a "White race" and a "Black race" that popped up, those delineations happened over time long after we started spreading out, but at a genetic level we're all the fucking same species and that's the only real delineation here, anything else is stupid people making parading their sheer ignorance.

YUP she instantly burst into tears screaming running for the bosses office and I was promptly fired for being a racist. It was in fact wrongful termination and I could have sued but to what end? Get my old job back and have to deal with those racist fucks? Fuck that shit, so I went back to working with dangerous equipment, my job after that was making flammable welding gasses for Air Liquide. It is also the only time in my life I've ever been fired from any job. It's just as well they were making me not want to come into work anymore anyway.

As for the 1st Amendment, it's there for a fucking reason and it's sad that people need that reason explained to them. I'm glad at least those on the Supreme Court understand. The correct ruling and one we really need right now with all the crazy left and right wing wanna be fascist dictators who would like nothing more than to kill anyone who doesn't think like them.

DLJ Wrote:And, yes, the principle of freedom of expression works both ways... if someone starts shit, better shit is the best counter-argument.
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26-06-2017, 11:29 PM
RE: U.S. Supreme Court free speech ruling
Understand the past, live and deal and fix in the present, and look to a better future.

DLJ Wrote:And, yes, the principle of freedom of expression works both ways... if someone starts shit, better shit is the best counter-argument.
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27-06-2017, 02:40 PM
RE: U.S. Supreme Court free speech ruling
(26-06-2017 11:22 PM)JesseB Wrote:  But again I'd point to basic biology 101. There's no fucking such thing as "race"

Ashley Montagu was saying that more than 70 years ago.

Montagu's ideas weren't too popular; it was another half-century before anyone seriously took them on.

Finally, though, we do have a few others rising to the challenge.

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27-06-2017, 02:56 PM
RE: U.S. Supreme Court free speech ruling
(27-06-2017 02:40 PM)Dr H Wrote:  
(26-06-2017 11:22 PM)JesseB Wrote:  But again I'd point to basic biology 101. There's no fucking such thing as "race"

Ashley Montagu was saying that more than 70 years ago.

Montagu's ideas weren't too popular; it was another half-century before anyone seriously took them on.

Finally, though, we do have a few others rising to the challenge.

I didn't know any of that... It just seemed obvious to me as a kid. People always said I was stupid but I was around a lot of biology as a child because of my dad's work (and him having me assist with putting together microscopes at bio labs and at home, free labor lol), I've never been able to understand how it's so hard for people to grasp the concept. One day I'll have to check out these books, thanks for sharing Smile

For any who are curious, my dad is both a microscope sales rep, and a young earth creationist..... /facepalm

YUP that's why I say he's an idiot. He's around the science all damn day and still can't understand it.

DLJ Wrote:And, yes, the principle of freedom of expression works both ways... if someone starts shit, better shit is the best counter-argument.
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28-06-2017, 08:44 PM
RE: U.S. Supreme Court free speech ruling
(27-06-2017 02:56 PM)JesseB Wrote:  One day I'll have to check out these books, thanks for sharing Smile
de nada. Teaching is my vocation; I share books as naturally as breathing. Wink

Quote:For any who are curious, my dad is both a microscope sales rep, and a young earth creationist..... /facepalm
I don't know if I will ever understand that kind of cognitive dissonance, but it fascinates me.
It's one of the reasons I still seek out discussions with the religious.

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"So, I became an anarchist, and all I got was this lousy T-shirt."
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28-06-2017, 09:27 PM (This post was last modified: 28-06-2017 09:34 PM by JesseB.)
RE: U.S. Supreme Court free speech ruling
(28-06-2017 08:44 PM)Dr H Wrote:  
(27-06-2017 02:56 PM)JesseB Wrote:  One day I'll have to check out these books, thanks for sharing Smile
de nada. Teaching is my vocation; I share books as naturally as breathing. Wink

Quote:For any who are curious, my dad is both a microscope sales rep, and a young earth creationist..... /facepalm
I don't know if I will ever understand that kind of cognitive dissonance, but it fascinates me.
It's one of the reasons I still seek out discussions with the religious.

Well.... my dad also thinks that the 6 year old (me) he used to bring to biology labs at universities across the US to set up multi million dollar microscopes was cognitively disabled. He told me so every day and worked hard to try and make me believe I was mentally handicapped. And he still does.

I've worked on inverted microscopes, electron scanning microscopes, laser dissecting microscopes, Pretty much every microscope Zeiss offered from the mid 1980's to 2000 (my dad worked for Zeiss). I've been to the NIH cancer research campus in Baltimore MD, OHSU, BYU... yea those are the ones I can remember off the top of my head. I know how to clean a microscope lens with Acetone without ruining the lens (it's tricky but you can't get a more clean clear image) and old school trick my dad taught me. But yea... according to him I'm low IQ mentally disabled. So.... I'm not surprised by the crazy levels of cognitive dissonance he has.

DLJ Wrote:And, yes, the principle of freedom of expression works both ways... if someone starts shit, better shit is the best counter-argument.
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28-06-2017, 09:57 PM
RE: U.S. Supreme Court free speech ruling
(26-06-2017 09:05 PM)Dr H Wrote:  
(24-06-2017 07:21 AM)Lord Dark Helmet Wrote:  Like what?

“When Mexico sends its people, they’re not sending their best. They’re not sending you. They’re not sending you. They’re sending people that have lots of problems and they’re bringing those problems with us. They’re bringing drugs, they’re bringing crime, they’re rapists, and some, I assume, are good people.”
--announcing candidacy, June 16, 2015

“I would build a great wall. And nobody builds walls better than me, believe me. And I’ll build them very inexpensively. I will build a great great wall on our southern border and I’ll have Mexico pay for that wall.” --announcing candidacy, June 16, 2015

"I could stand in the middle of Fifth Avenue and shoot somebody, and I wouldn't lose any voters, okay? It's, like, incredible." –Sioux Center, Iowa, January 23, 2016

"If she [Hillary Clinton] gets to pick her judges – nothing you can do, folks. Although, the Second Amendment people. Maybe there is. I don’t know." –Wilmington, North Carolina, Aug. 9, 2016

“I’m in total support of waterboarding. It has to be within the law, but I have to expand the law.” -- January 26, 2017

Wait... I just had a funny thought... Would it be "The Great Wall of Murica!"

DLJ Wrote:And, yes, the principle of freedom of expression works both ways... if someone starts shit, better shit is the best counter-argument.
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29-06-2017, 01:07 AM
RE: U.S. Supreme Court free speech ruling
Apparently even the Supreme Court can be overruled if someone tries hard enough to be offended.




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29-06-2017, 02:31 AM (This post was last modified: 29-06-2017 02:35 AM by JesseB.)
RE: U.S. Supreme Court free speech ruling
(29-06-2017 01:07 AM)Robvalue Wrote:  Apparently even the Supreme Court can be overruled if someone tries hard enough to be offended.




Pardon me for being stupid, but... how was the supreme court overruled? I don't get what you mean here...

I notice the fields of cotton in the background, you know my mom was a cotton picker, you can see it in her hands still. Well technically she was a migrant farm worker (aka a farm worker who came from Mexico usually who travels from farm to farm across the state through the various picking seasons) but one of the things she picked was cotton. It's pretty shitastic work.

DLJ Wrote:And, yes, the principle of freedom of expression works both ways... if someone starts shit, better shit is the best counter-argument.
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