UFO Disclosure
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26-09-2015, 06:18 PM
RE: UFO Disclosure
(26-09-2015 06:15 PM)WhiskeyDebates Wrote:  
(26-09-2015 05:30 PM)Free Wrote:  Yep, you are asking for a UFO to sit down on your lawn, and 5 little green men come out and say, "Hey man, got any good drugs?"

Smokin
So you don't understand what I'm asking for. Awesome.

So in your mind there is nothing between "anonymous hearsay" and "aliens landing on your law" as far as evidence goes. Awesome.

Yes, I do.

But, I will give you one chance to tell me exactly what would qualify as evidence of alien visitation on earth.

Go.

How can anyone become an atheist when we are all born with no beliefs in the first place? We are atheists because we were born this way.
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26-09-2015, 06:20 PM
RE: UFO Disclosure
(26-09-2015 06:18 PM)Free Wrote:  But, I will give you one chance to tell me exactly what would qualify as evidence of alien visitation on earth.

Go.

The actual, verified presence of a craft that exceeds human knowledge of engineering.

This is not complicated.

"Owl," said Rabbit shortly, "you and I have brains. The others have fluff. If there is any thinking to be done in this Forest - and when I say thinking I mean thinking - you and I must do it."
- A. A. Milne, The House at Pooh Corner
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26-09-2015, 06:20 PM
RE: UFO Disclosure
(26-09-2015 06:17 PM)Unbeliever Wrote:  
(26-09-2015 06:11 PM)Free Wrote:  No, there is absolutely not one single stitch of evidence that a singularity EVER existed.

NONE.

Oh, shut up.

(26-09-2015 06:11 PM)Free Wrote:  Are you telling me that the Big Bang THEORY is now conclusively proven as fact?

Nice attempt to dodge the issue. Whether or not the Big Bang theory is actually correct or not is irrelevant. The point is that there is actual evidence supporting it. It is formulated in accordance with this evidence. It is not accepted on claim alone.

Your pet idea has no such support.

(26-09-2015 06:11 PM)Free Wrote:  Your ass just got handed to you.

You are a very, very silly person.

Oh you are SOOOO fucking cornered, aren't you?

So tell me again, are you trying to say that the Big Bang THEORY is now a 100% fact?

Yes or no?

How can anyone become an atheist when we are all born with no beliefs in the first place? We are atheists because we were born this way.
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26-09-2015, 06:24 PM
RE: UFO Disclosure
(26-09-2015 06:11 PM)Free Wrote:  
(26-09-2015 06:08 PM)Unbeliever Wrote:  And, again, you straw man blatantly.

There is actual evidence of the Big Bang, Free. Continuing to stick your fingers in your ears and play silly games with refusing to admit this does nothing but make you look like still more of a fool.

No, there is absolutely not one single stitch of evidence that a singularity EVER existed.

NONE.

Are you telling me that the Big Bang THEORY is now conclusively proven as fact?

Is that what you now need to say, "Unbeliever?"

Your ass just got handed to you.

Free......define theory for us as it exists in your head.

When valour preys on reason, it eats the sword it fights with.
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26-09-2015, 06:50 PM
RE: UFO Disclosure
(26-09-2015 06:24 PM)WhiskeyDebates Wrote:  
(26-09-2015 06:11 PM)Free Wrote:  No, there is absolutely not one single stitch of evidence that a singularity EVER existed.

NONE.

Are you telling me that the Big Bang THEORY is now conclusively proven as fact?

Is that what you now need to say, "Unbeliever?"

Your ass just got handed to you.

Free......define theory for us as it exists in your head.

In relation to this discussion:

"The Big Bang theory is the prevailing cosmological model for the universe from the earliest known periods through its subsequent large-scale evolution.

The model accounts for the fact that the universe expanded from a very high density and high temperature state, and offers a comprehensive explanation for a broad range of observed phenomena, including the abundance of light elements, the cosmic microwave background, large scale structure, and Hubble's Law."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Bang

In relation to this discussion, the Big Bang theory is determined by what is OBSERVED <--- need a neon sign for this anecdotal evidence?

Therefore, if 12 scientists got together and OBSERVED a new phenomena that would be consistent with the Big Bang theory, and then told the reporter in a newspaper all about it, would you believe them?

How fucked up is your argument now?

How can anyone become an atheist when we are all born with no beliefs in the first place? We are atheists because we were born this way.
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26-09-2015, 07:07 PM (This post was last modified: 26-09-2015 07:16 PM by WhiskeyDebates.)
RE: UFO Disclosure
(26-09-2015 06:50 PM)Free Wrote:  
(26-09-2015 06:24 PM)WhiskeyDebates Wrote:  Free......define theory for us as it exists in your head.

In relation to this discussion:

"The Big Bang theory is the prevailing cosmological model for the universe from the earliest known periods through its subsequent large-scale evolution.

The model accounts for the fact that the universe expanded from a very high density and high temperature state, and offers a comprehensive explanation for a broad range of observed phenomena, including the abundance of light elements, the cosmic microwave background, large scale structure, and Hubble's Law."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Bang

In relation to this discussion, the Big Bang theory is determined by what is OBSERVED <--- need a neon sign for this anecdotal evidence?

Therefore, if 12 scientists got together and OBSERVED a new phenomena that would be consistent with the Big Bang theory, and then told the reporter in a newspaper all about it, would you believe them?

How fucked up is your argument now?

If they presented absolutely no demonstrable evidence to support the claim they are making? No I would not belive that they had observed anything I would withhold belief until the evidence was presented.

The time to belive claims is when they have been demonstrated factual.

You don't seem to get that the rest of us are not as credulous as you are.


The big bang theory has a preponderance of demonstrable, verifiable, and testable evidence that doesn't require me to list to ANY scientist opinion at all. It's not even remotely similar to what you have been trying to claim as true.


Oh and ANYONE with the desire and equipment can OBSERVE the evidence for the big bang and no one needs to listen to any scientist to confirm it. The big bang has independently variable evidence and yours does not. Can anyone observe the UFO over O'Hare?

They are not remotely the same thing.

When valour preys on reason, it eats the sword it fights with.
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26-09-2015, 07:09 PM
RE: UFO Disclosure
(26-09-2015 06:20 PM)Free Wrote:  Oh you are SOOOO fucking cornered, aren't you?

Not really. You're off in a corner, throwing punches at someone only you can see.

(26-09-2015 06:20 PM)Free Wrote:  So tell me again, are you trying to say that the Big Bang THEORY is now a 100% fact?

I repeat: it is irrelevant. It has never been relevant. That is not the issue.

The question is not whether or not the Big Bang theory is fact. The question is whether or not the Big Bang theory is rational - and I say that this is "the question" with the greatest possible quotation marks, since this is not and has never been about the Big Bang theory, but your pet hypothesis about alien visitation. This entire line of conversation is just an extended tu quoque fallacy.

Regardless, again, it isn't a question of whether it is fact or not. It is a question of whether or not it is rational - that is, whether or not there is supporting evidence.

In the Big Bang theory's case, there is.

In the case of alien visitation, there is not.

Why you fail to understand this very simple concept is beyond me.

"Owl," said Rabbit shortly, "you and I have brains. The others have fluff. If there is any thinking to be done in this Forest - and when I say thinking I mean thinking - you and I must do it."
- A. A. Milne, The House at Pooh Corner
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26-09-2015, 07:10 PM
RE: UFO Disclosure
(26-09-2015 06:50 PM)Free Wrote:  In relation to this discussion, the Big Bang theory is determined by what is OBSERVED <--- need a neon sign for this anecdotal evidence?

That is not what "anecdote" means.

Verifiable observation is evidence.

"I saw this thing once you guys, really, you gotta believe" is an anecdote.

Once again, and for the hundredth time, the thing that you keep ignoring is verification.

This is not complicated.

"Owl," said Rabbit shortly, "you and I have brains. The others have fluff. If there is any thinking to be done in this Forest - and when I say thinking I mean thinking - you and I must do it."
- A. A. Milne, The House at Pooh Corner
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26-09-2015, 07:25 PM
RE: UFO Disclosure
(26-09-2015 07:07 PM)WhiskeyDebates Wrote:  
(26-09-2015 06:50 PM)Free Wrote:  In relation to this discussion:

"The Big Bang theory is the prevailing cosmological model for the universe from the earliest known periods through its subsequent large-scale evolution.

The model accounts for the fact that the universe expanded from a very high density and high temperature state, and offers a comprehensive explanation for a broad range of observed phenomena, including the abundance of light elements, the cosmic microwave background, large scale structure, and Hubble's Law."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Bang

In relation to this discussion, the Big Bang theory is determined by what is OBSERVED <--- need a neon sign for this anecdotal evidence?

Therefore, if 12 scientists got together and OBSERVED a new phenomena that would be consistent with the Big Bang theory, and then told the reporter in a newspaper all about it, would you believe them?

How fucked up is your argument now?

If they presented absolutely no demonstrable evidence to support the claim they are making? No I would not belive that they had observed anything I would withhold belief until the evidence was presented.

Hey ... now we are getting somewhere ...

Quote:The time to belive claims is when they have been demonstrated factual.

If claims are demonstrated as factual, it is no longer a position of "belief," but rather a position of "knowledge."

A belief is what you have when the evidence of a claim is not enough to prove conclusiveness.

But if you know something with an absolute certainty of it being true, then that is not a belief; that is truth, or a fact.

Quote:You don't seem to get that the rest of us are not as credulous as you are.

That has nothing to do with the actual points in this discussion. If you not yet figured out what this discussion is really all about yet, then you shouldn't be here any more.


Quote:The big bang theory has a preponderance of demonstrable, verifiable, and testable evidence that doesn't require me to list to ANY scientist opinion at all. It's not even remotely similar to what you have been trying to claim as true.

It is absolutely and completely similar to what my position in this discussion is actually all about. So here is a question, and I expect an honest answer:

Pick One:

1. Do you believe in the Big Bang theory?
2. Do you know for a certainty that the Big Bang happened?

And also:

Are atheists also prone to beliefs?

1. Yes.
2. No.

Bowing

How can anyone become an atheist when we are all born with no beliefs in the first place? We are atheists because we were born this way.
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26-09-2015, 07:27 PM
RE: UFO Disclosure
(26-09-2015 07:25 PM)Free Wrote:  
Quote:The big bang theory has a preponderance of demonstrable, verifiable, and testable evidence that doesn't require me to list to ANY scientist opinion at all. It's not even remotely similar to what you have been trying to claim as true.

It is absolutely and completely similar to what my position in this discussion is actually all about.

No.

It is precisely the opposite of your obsession with alien visitation in every way that is relevant to this discussion.

Your continued deliberate ignorance regarding the way rationality and evidence work is not helping your case.

"Owl," said Rabbit shortly, "you and I have brains. The others have fluff. If there is any thinking to be done in this Forest - and when I say thinking I mean thinking - you and I must do it."
- A. A. Milne, The House at Pooh Corner
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