UFO Disclosure
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13-09-2015, 08:21 PM
RE: UFO Disclosure
(13-09-2015 08:01 PM)Unbeliever Wrote:  
(13-09-2015 07:49 PM)Free Wrote:  Not sure why this is any more "ridiculous" than how you and others view the concept of interstellar aliens visiting earth.

You can't see how the idea of a technologically-advanced species existing alongside us on Earth, presumably for at least thousands of years, without anyone noticing might be considered ridiculous?

Where are you posting from? More relevantly, what are you smoking while you do it?

Has it occurred to you that according to the history of UFO reports that they possibly have been noticed?

You sit there in your ignorance of this subject and claim something to be ridiculous without ever actually studying this subject?

Of the literally millions of UFO reports that have been made throughout history, I find it implausible that every last one of them is false.

Your problem is you do not have enough "honest" interest in this subject to actually study it in an effort to formulate a truly honest and valued opinion on it.

It's just too "ridiculous" for you, isn't it?

Big Grin

How can anyone become an atheist when we are all born with no beliefs in the first place? We are atheists because we were born this way.
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13-09-2015, 08:28 PM
RE: UFO Disclosure
(13-09-2015 08:21 PM)Free Wrote:  Has it occurred to you that according to the history of UFO reports that they possibly have been noticed?

Do you understand the difference between seeing something you cannot identify and finding evidence of another technologically-advanced civilization existing on Earth without anyone's knowledge?

Once again, your arguments are completely nonsensical.

(13-09-2015 08:21 PM)Free Wrote:  You sit there in your ignorance of this subject and claim something to be ridiculous without ever actually studying this subject?

I have, actually. You assume that I haven't because I actually understand what I studied, and thus came to a different conclusion.

(13-09-2015 08:21 PM)Free Wrote:  Of the literally millions of UFO reports that have been made throughout history, I find it implausible that every last one of them is false.

No one has ever claimed that every UFO report is false. You simply do not understand the difference between seeing something unidentified in the sky and finding evidence of non-human manned aircraft.

"Owl," said Rabbit shortly, "you and I have brains. The others have fluff. If there is any thinking to be done in this Forest - and when I say thinking I mean thinking - you and I must do it."
- A. A. Milne, The House at Pooh Corner
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13-09-2015, 08:34 PM (This post was last modified: 13-09-2015 08:40 PM by Free.)
RE: UFO Disclosure
(13-09-2015 08:28 PM)Unbeliever Wrote:  
(13-09-2015 08:21 PM)Free Wrote:  Has it occurred to you that according to the history of UFO reports that they possibly have been noticed?

Do you understand the difference between seeing something you cannot identify and finding evidence of another technologically-advanced civilization existing on Earth without anyone's knowledge?

Once again, your arguments are completely nonsensical.

(13-09-2015 08:21 PM)Free Wrote:  You sit there in your ignorance of this subject and claim something to be ridiculous without ever actually studying this subject?

I have, actually. You assume that I haven't because I actually understand what I studied, and thus came to a different conclusion.

(13-09-2015 08:21 PM)Free Wrote:  Of the literally millions of UFO reports that have been made throughout history, I find it implausible that every last one of them is false.

No one has ever claimed that every UFO report is false. You simply do not understand the difference between seeing something unidentified in the sky and finding evidence of non-human manned aircraft.

I totally get it. You need a little green man or else everything else sucks. Without that little green man, not even a possibility is permitted to exist. No circumstantial evidence can actually be evidence to you, for without that little green man the entire history of UFOs is absolutely meaningless, pointless, worthless, and undeserving of any degree of recognition whatsoever.

Well then, go into your little world and wait for your little green man to join you.

Meanwhile, I will continue to search for the truth regarding these claims, and like so many other people such as scientists et al, I will continue to believe in the possibility they exist. After all, we wouldn't be spending hundreds of millions of dollars to search for extraterrestrial life if we didn't "believe" it existed.

I believe it exists. I have reason for my beliefs.

You do not, and that's fine.

Big Grin

How can anyone become an atheist when we are all born with no beliefs in the first place? We are atheists because we were born this way.
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13-09-2015, 08:46 PM
RE: UFO Disclosure
(13-09-2015 08:34 PM)Free Wrote:  I totally get it. You need a little green man or else everything else sucks.

No. I just need something other than non sequitur assertions about hypothetical explanations for unverified anecdotes.

"Owl," said Rabbit shortly, "you and I have brains. The others have fluff. If there is any thinking to be done in this Forest - and when I say thinking I mean thinking - you and I must do it."
- A. A. Milne, The House at Pooh Corner
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13-09-2015, 08:55 PM
RE: UFO Disclosure
(13-09-2015 08:46 PM)Unbeliever Wrote:  
(13-09-2015 08:34 PM)Free Wrote:  I totally get it. You need a little green man or else everything else sucks.

No. I just need something other than non sequitur assertions about hypothetical explanations for unverified anecdotes.

No, you need a little green man, because all the circumstantial evidence available historically as well as in modern times is extremely extensive, and it's still not good enough for you.

The fact that scientists world-wide believe enough that ET exists to spend hundreds of millions of dollars looking for ET is not good enough for you.

You need that little green man or else you will just hand-wave the whole subject away.

I get that. I totally do. You would much rather perfect your "skepticism" to a fine art than risk an open mind. I totally get that too.

But me? I will risk it all, fearlessly, to find the truth.

Big Grin

How can anyone become an atheist when we are all born with no beliefs in the first place? We are atheists because we were born this way.
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13-09-2015, 08:58 PM
RE: UFO Disclosure
(13-09-2015 08:55 PM)Free Wrote:  No, you need a little green man, because all the circumstantial evidence available historically as well as in modern times is extremely extensive, and it's still not good enough for you.

Because precisely none of it is evidence for alien visitation.

This is why your argument is a god of the gaps variant. The absolute most that you have, even setting aside every other problem, is "we don't know, therefore aliens". It is god of the gaps in its purest form.

You don't have evidence of any sort, circumstantial or otherwise, for alien visitation. What you have is a series of unknowns that you crowbar aliens into.

(13-09-2015 08:55 PM)Free Wrote:  The fact that scientists world-wide believe enough that ET exists to spend hundreds of millions of dollars looking for ET is not good enough for you.

Again, you fail to appreciate the difference between "extraterrestrial life exists" and "extraterrestrials have visited Earth".

They are not equivalent, no matter how hard you try to make them so.

"Owl," said Rabbit shortly, "you and I have brains. The others have fluff. If there is any thinking to be done in this Forest - and when I say thinking I mean thinking - you and I must do it."
- A. A. Milne, The House at Pooh Corner
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13-09-2015, 09:06 PM
RE: UFO Disclosure
(13-09-2015 08:58 PM)Unbeliever Wrote:  
(13-09-2015 08:55 PM)Free Wrote:  No, you need a little green man, because all the circumstantial evidence available historically as well as in modern times is extremely extensive, and it's still not good enough for you.

Because precisely none of it is evidence for alien visitation.

Is that not just a matter of perspective? What you say isn't, while others insist that it possibly is?

You cannot enforce your beliefs upon anybody any more than they can impose theirs on you.

At the end of the day it all comes down to an opinion, and yours doesn't matter much at all to people like me because we have seen it all before.

You do not balance your skepticism with an ability to keep an open mind.

Quote:This is why your argument is a god of the gaps variant. The absolute most that you have, even setting aside every other problem, is "we don't know, therefore aliens". It is god of the gaps in its purest form.

If my argument said, "The evidence indicates the possibility of aliens, then by golly it's aliens" then you miight have a point.

But my argument says, and has always said, "All the circumstantial evidence indicates the possibility of aliens existing, so that possibility exists."

And that's what you so miserably failed to understand about my position.

Go find your little green man.

[Image: little-green-man-alien-26644187.jpg]

How can anyone become an atheist when we are all born with no beliefs in the first place? We are atheists because we were born this way.
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13-09-2015, 09:21 PM
RE: UFO Disclosure
(13-09-2015 09:06 PM)Free Wrote:  Is that not just a matter of perspective?

No.

(13-09-2015 09:06 PM)Free Wrote:  If my argument said, "The evidence indicates the possibility of aliens, then by golly it's aliens" then you miight have a point.

That is not what "god of the gaps" means.

(13-09-2015 09:06 PM)Free Wrote:  But my argument says, and has always said, "All the circumstantial evidence indicates the possibility of aliens existing, so that possibility exists."

That is not your argument. That is the motte that you flee to when confronted with facts.

"Owl," said Rabbit shortly, "you and I have brains. The others have fluff. If there is any thinking to be done in this Forest - and when I say thinking I mean thinking - you and I must do it."
- A. A. Milne, The House at Pooh Corner
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13-09-2015, 10:00 PM
RE: UFO Disclosure
(13-09-2015 08:55 PM)Free Wrote:  The fact that scientists world-wide believe enough that ET exists to spend hundreds of millions of dollars looking for ET is not good enough for you.

You know where those scientists are not looking for ET? Earth. Drinking Beverage

When valour preys on reason, it eats the sword it fights with.
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13-09-2015, 11:09 PM
RE: UFO Disclosure
Hey I have a question Free. What makes you so sure that this couldn't be done by humans? If you're gonna assert that an advanced super-race could co-exist on Earth without us noticing, *what if they were us*?

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(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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