UN War Crimes Commission files about Shoah made public.
Post Reply
 
Thread Rating:
  • 0 Votes - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
29-06-2017, 03:16 AM
UN War Crimes Commission files about Shoah made public.
Previously ignored and hard to access, the Holocaust files kept by the UN War Crimes Commission (UNWCC) have finally been made publicly available, potentially debunking many assumptions about the Nazi genocide of the European Jews.

I wonder how these files will expand our knowledge of Holocaust and what overall impact they will have. Don't expect some fundamental change, it's not like Final Solution was secret that Allies discovered after the war ended. Numerous books on the subject made mention of information leaks which made sure that Allies know. Still, one can help but wonder what exactly was hidden for so long.


Second article here.

The first revolt is against the supreme tyranny of theology, of the phantom of God. As long as we have a master in heaven, we will be slaves on earth.

Mikhail Bakunin.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 2 users Like Szuchow's post
29-06-2017, 03:48 AM
RE: UN War Crimes Commission files about Shoah made public.
Fake news! Sleepy

Its all fake fakefake fakefakefake fakefakefakefakefakefake

Ceterum censeo, religionem delendam esse
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
29-06-2017, 05:06 PM
RE: UN War Crimes Commission files about Shoah made public.
(29-06-2017 03:16 AM)Szuchow Wrote:  Previously ignored and hard to access, the Holocaust files kept by the UN War Crimes Commission (UNWCC) have finally been made publicly available, potentially debunking many assumptions about the Nazi genocide of the European Jews.

I wonder how these files will expand our knowledge of Holocaust and what overall impact they will have. Don't expect some fundamental change, it's not like Final Solution was secret that Allies discovered after the war ended. Numerous books on the subject made mention of information leaks which made sure that Allies know. Still, one can help but wonder what exactly was hidden for so long.


Second article here.

Thanks, Szuchow.

I've always wondered exactly what became of the "Angel of Death", August Miete. Some sources say that he died in prison in 1978; others that he was released in 1980. Always seemed odd that nobody could say for sure.

Not that these documents will help with that; too early. But the Nazis dismantled and attempted to hide the Treblinka death camp before the war was over; these records may shed some light on what the Allies knew about Treblinka, and when they knew it.

--
Dr H

"So, I became an anarchist, and all I got was this lousy T-shirt."
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
29-06-2017, 05:22 PM
RE: UN War Crimes Commission files about Shoah made public.
(29-06-2017 05:06 PM)Dr H Wrote:  
(29-06-2017 03:16 AM)Szuchow Wrote:  Previously ignored and hard to access, the Holocaust files kept by the UN War Crimes Commission (UNWCC) have finally been made publicly available, potentially debunking many assumptions about the Nazi genocide of the European Jews.

I wonder how these files will expand our knowledge of Holocaust and what overall impact they will have. Don't expect some fundamental change, it's not like Final Solution was secret that Allies discovered after the war ended. Numerous books on the subject made mention of information leaks which made sure that Allies know. Still, one can help but wonder what exactly was hidden for so long.


Second article here.

Thanks, Szuchow.

I've always wondered exactly what became of the "Angel of Death", August Miete. Some sources say that he died in prison in 1978; others that he was released in 1980. Always seemed odd that nobody could say for sure.

Not that these documents will help with that; too early. But the Nazis dismantled and attempted to hide the Treblinka death camp before the war was over; these records may shed some light on what the Allies knew about Treblinka, and when they knew it.

No problem. I found this by accident and decided to share.

As for Treblinka it is interesting question, but one partly answered - http://www.deathcamps.org/reinhard/allies.html

Excerpts of note:

On 25 November 1942, The New York Times published information received from the Polish Government in Exile that mentioned Belzec, Sobibor and Treblinka. In the same edition, the newspaper carried an item providing details of concrete buildings on the former Russian frontier used as gas chambers and of crematoria at Oswiecim (Auschwitz), as well as an estimate from Wise that the Jewish dead already numbered 2 million.

There were other reports in the OSS files. On 25 September 1943, the International Red Cross Committee had reported on ghetto clearances in Galicia, including a massacre of the Jewish population of Rawa Ruska in December 1942. There was a statement by an escapee from Treblinka, David Milgrom, dated 30 August 1943 and a report on shootings at Majdanek dated 24 February 1944 (Aktion Erntefest).

Cursory google search does not revealed more but I wouldn't be too surprised if Allies knew more. Maybe in year or two some new books will appear.

The first revolt is against the supreme tyranny of theology, of the phantom of God. As long as we have a master in heaven, we will be slaves on earth.

Mikhail Bakunin.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes Szuchow's post
29-06-2017, 05:32 PM
RE: UN War Crimes Commission files about Shoah made public.
I am sure Sean Spicer will come up with a great analogy.

"If we are honest—and scientists have to be—we must admit that religion is a jumble of false assertions, with no basis in reality.
The very idea of God is a product of the human imagination."
- Paul Dirac
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes The Organic Chemist's post
30-06-2017, 11:01 AM
RE: UN War Crimes Commission files about Shoah made public.
(29-06-2017 05:32 PM)The Organic Chemist Wrote:  I am sure Sean Spicer will come up with a great analogy.
"This stack of paper represents the Jews. And this stack here represents the Nazis...."

[Image: fdyq20.jpg]
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes LostLocke's post
30-06-2017, 01:58 PM
RE: UN War Crimes Commission files about Shoah made public.
(29-06-2017 05:22 PM)Szuchow Wrote:  
(29-06-2017 05:06 PM)Dr H Wrote:  Thanks, Szuchow.

I've always wondered exactly what became of the "Angel of Death", August Miete. Some sources say that he died in prison in 1978; others that he was released in 1980. Always seemed odd that nobody could say for sure.

Not that these documents will help with that; too early. But the Nazis dismantled and attempted to hide the Treblinka death camp before the war was over; these records may shed some light on what the Allies knew about Treblinka, and when they knew it.

No problem. I found this by accident and decided to share.

As for Treblinka it is interesting question, but one partly answered - http://www.deathcamps.org/reinhard/allies.html

Excerpts of note:

On 25 November 1942, The New York Times published information received from the Polish Government in Exile that mentioned Belzec, Sobibor and Treblinka. In the same edition, the newspaper carried an item providing details of concrete buildings on the former Russian frontier used as gas chambers and of crematoria at Oswiecim (Auschwitz), as well as an estimate from Wise that the Jewish dead already numbered 2 million.

There were other reports in the OSS files. On 25 September 1943, the International Red Cross Committee had reported on ghetto clearances in Galicia, including a massacre of the Jewish population of Rawa Ruska in December 1942. There was a statement by an escapee from Treblinka, David Milgrom, dated 30 August 1943 and a report on shootings at Majdanek dated 24 February 1944 (Aktion Erntefest).

Cursory google search does not revealed more but I wouldn't be too surprised if Allies knew more. Maybe in year or two some new books will appear.

It's appalling. Not only were the Allies aware of the mass killings around the ghettos by 1942, but it appears that by the end of that year they were well aware of at least some of the extermination camps. It's almost as it they just couldn't get themselves to believe what was happening, so they ignored it.

--
Dr H

"So, I became an anarchist, and all I got was this lousy T-shirt."
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
30-06-2017, 02:10 PM (This post was last modified: 30-06-2017 02:15 PM by Szuchow.)
RE: UN War Crimes Commission files about Shoah made public.
(30-06-2017 01:58 PM)Dr H Wrote:  
(29-06-2017 05:22 PM)Szuchow Wrote:  No problem. I found this by accident and decided to share.

As for Treblinka it is interesting question, but one partly answered - http://www.deathcamps.org/reinhard/allies.html

Excerpts of note:

On 25 November 1942, The New York Times published information received from the Polish Government in Exile that mentioned Belzec, Sobibor and Treblinka. In the same edition, the newspaper carried an item providing details of concrete buildings on the former Russian frontier used as gas chambers and of crematoria at Oswiecim (Auschwitz), as well as an estimate from Wise that the Jewish dead already numbered 2 million.

There were other reports in the OSS files. On 25 September 1943, the International Red Cross Committee had reported on ghetto clearances in Galicia, including a massacre of the Jewish population of Rawa Ruska in December 1942. There was a statement by an escapee from Treblinka, David Milgrom, dated 30 August 1943 and a report on shootings at Majdanek dated 24 February 1944 (Aktion Erntefest).

Cursory google search does not revealed more but I wouldn't be too surprised if Allies knew more. Maybe in year or two some new books will appear.

It's appalling. Not only were the Allies aware of the mass killings around the ghettos by 1942, but it appears that by the end of that year they were well aware of at least some of the extermination camps. It's almost as it they just couldn't get themselves to believe what was happening, so they ignored it.
Allies were aware of mass killings soon after it started if I recall correctly. Check here.

As for not believing there was matter of alleged Germans atrocities during WWI. People in power remembered it and sadly weren't so quick to believe.

If you want to know more I recommend Hilberg "The Destruction of European Jews", one of most complete works about Shoah.

The first revolt is against the supreme tyranny of theology, of the phantom of God. As long as we have a master in heaven, we will be slaves on earth.

Mikhail Bakunin.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
30-06-2017, 02:16 PM (This post was last modified: 30-06-2017 02:27 PM by abaris.)
RE: UN War Crimes Commission files about Shoah made public.
(29-06-2017 03:16 AM)Szuchow Wrote:  I wonder how these files will expand our knowledge of Holocaust and what overall impact they will have. Don't expect some fundamental change, it's not like Final Solution was secret that Allies discovered after the war ended. Numerous books on the subject made mention of information leaks which made sure that Allies know. Still, one can help but wonder what exactly was hidden for so long.

The reports on the "Einsatzgruppen" landed on Churchill's desk and it is known that he kept track on the numbers being killed. They knew about the death camps, such as Treblinka and Sobibor and the death factory that was Auschwitz. They bombed the factories next to Auschwitz, but they never bombed the camp itself. They had aerial reconnaissance photographs of the camp itself and knew what was going on there. The reasons given for not at least interrupting the process are many. More or less believable. The one about not wanting to kill prisoners being the least credible of all, since they already killed them by bombing the factories where they had to do slave labor and weren't allowed to take shelter. Apart from the fact that in this case bombing the gas chambers could have meant death for some but salvation for many at the time in question. Most of all the Hungarian jews, who were deported in the summer of '44 to be gassed at Auschwitz in their vast majority.

Maybe the new documents shed some new lights on the Holocaust, but I don't think we need to rewrite history because of them.

The descriptions on the photo are from 1978, but the photo is taken in 1944.

[Image: Luftaufklaerung-Auschwitz-Birkenau-2.jpg]

[Image: Labrador%20and%20Title.jpg]
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes abaris's post
Post Reply
Forum Jump: