Unintelligent Design
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03-01-2014, 07:18 PM
RE: Unintelligent Design
(03-01-2014 05:42 PM)Baruch Wrote:  I'm short sighted with Astigmatism - clearly not intelligent design.

In any case the ultimate in unintelligent design is God's congenitally deformed babies.
If a personal God existed then he doesn't put enough folic acid in the environment and creates babies with horrific birth defects like anencephaly and spina bifida. (caused by lack of folic acid in some cases)
http://www.spinabifida.net/wp-content/up...0b8dd2.jpg
[Image: 3461465263_2c250b8dd2.jpg]


This is not intelligent design !!!! Sloppy design. An Engineer would be sued for such sloppiness - & God gets of the hook.

The ULTIMATE in unintelligent design is Harlequins Ichtheosis.
https://images.encyclopediadramatica.es/...hyosis.jpg
[Image: Harlequin_Ichthyosis.jpg]

Of course we have natural explanations for why these occur based on our understanding of evolution and DNA and don't need Theodicy as an explanation.
However blaming sins or especially "original Sin" for the above genetic & congenital abnormalities can only come from a distorted deluded persons "faith" in utter nonsense.
I may not like the outcomes from the science of evolution - it may be cruel at times, but its far better (being the truth) than worshipping a barbarically cruel incompetent designer deity and pretending it is loving whilst it tortures.

This world is not perfect. Our bodies are not perfect. And this is the point.
In order to have progression we must learn to overcome hard things.
If we don't have to overcome anything we can not grow/progress/achieve/make something better(improve).

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03-01-2014, 09:46 PM
RE: Unintelligent Design
Quote:
(03-01-2014 07:18 PM)Alla Wrote:  This world is not perfect. Our bodies are not perfect. And this is the point.
In order to have progression we must learn to overcome hard things.
If we don't have to overcome anything we can not grow/progress/achieve/make something better(improve).

So Alla - your take on this topic is its fine to torture person A for the sake of helping person B "improve in life skills" and this is Gods great moral plan.

Just so I can improve my medicine, which takes a few hundred years God tortures people to test my success.
Just so I can become virtuous by treating sick people and help healing the sick, God provides enough tortured victims for myself to work on my virtues.

Oh and God is so kind as to make it really hard with biological systems being booby-trapped for extremely difficult success - for example cancer cells being similar enough to normal cells therefore making treatment extremely dangerous and add to the suffering and sometimes make things worse - thank the Lord for crude chemotherapy & radiation. Perhaps we should also thank the Lord for al the cases of faith healing which caused disease to worsen and neglect medical treatment - thank the Lord who's will is gratuitous torture.

...and for all the centuries of no success or improvement or virtues gained - then what ? Gods tortures of people just becomes a waste of time.
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03-01-2014, 10:03 PM
RE: Unintelligent Design
Quote:This world is not perfect. Our bodies are not perfect. And this is the point.
In order to have progression we must learn to overcome hard things.
If we don't have to overcome anything we can not grow/progress/achieve/make something better(improve).
[/quote]

What about cases when people born with these "hard" congenital deformities - Gods unintelligent design and are not able to "grow", "progress" or make anything better ?
What about when they go into depression, mental breakdown and finally commit suicide ? Are they going to get some extra Godly tortures for failing the test and quitting early without enough progress made ?

Again Alla - is it acceptable to torture person A in order to improve the potential virtue of person B ?

Art lessons in school are a little easy so in order for the teacher to toughen up the class she breaks a few fingers, pokes an eye out from a student and gives a few blows to the head for added brain injury to other students. Now the art class is harder and extra work for the kids to compensate for their injuries so the art class teacher can be praised and loved for her kindness. This Alla is the sort of God you are justifying - truly malevolent but your making out to be praiseworthy like the teacher in the analogy ?
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03-01-2014, 10:38 PM
RE: Unintelligent Design
http://www.thethinkingatheist.com/forum/...-RE-Design

There are some interesting ideas in this older thread

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03-01-2014, 11:24 PM
RE: Unintelligent Design
Thanks full circle - quite right, there are some simple solutions to a better more intelligent design eg regenerating teeth - rather than tooth decay. Sharks get them so why don't humans unless God as a vested interest in keeping dentists employed.

I mean what a stupid design for God to make teeth sensitive to acids ? Could he not think of a material less prone to decay. DIAMOND TEETH !!!!! YEhhh !

[Image: 1744320167_1378446173.jpg]

Now that's intelligent design !
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03-01-2014, 11:42 PM
RE: Unintelligent Design
We are perfect, except for the imperfections brought about by that bitch Eve eating that honey pot apple.
If that logic does not make sense to you, then congratulations.

Theism is to believe what other people claim, Atheism is to ask "why should I".
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04-01-2014, 08:35 AM
RE: Unintelligent Design
Quote:Alla: ...lots of problems and bad design. Then I have to do/fix lots of things. By doing/fixing lots of things I am LEARNING lots of things. Lack of something makes me more creative person. I am learning to do "miracles" from what I have. "Bad" design is for the purpose to become more creative, more intelligent, more knowledgeable, more productive. Creating things, fixing things also brings happiness.

Alla - I have worked in the neuropharmacology field and I can tell you first hand that designing badly damaged brains IS NOT GOOD for becoming more creative, intelligent or more knowledgeable !!!! eg Gods grand design of a baby with anencephaly (pictured below)- large parts of brain missing. Seriously Fu**ed up design !
If a good designer was interested in humans becoming more creative, intelligent and knowledgeable there are far better brain modifications & improvements which can be made !!!
[Image: anencephaly5re8.jpg]


Hardly the best example of Gods creative offspring destined for intelligence !
Quote Alla...
Quote:Bad" design is for the purpose to become more creative, more intelligent, more knowledgeable, more productive.[/b] Creating things, fixing things also brings happiness.[/

If I am a manufacturer and gave you badly designed table, you ought to get a refund not make excuses of how useful the table might be even if the table has knife like edges to cut your children to pieces.
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04-01-2014, 04:54 PM
RE: Unintelligent Design
(03-01-2014 04:48 PM)Alla Wrote:  I can buy a house that is ready to move-in. I don't have to do anything.

But I can buy a house with lots of problems and bad design. Then I have to do/fix lots of things. By doing/fixing lots of things I am LEARNING lots of things.

Lack of something makes me more creative person. I am learning to do "miracles" from what I have.

"Bad" design is for the purpose to become more creative, more intelligent, more knowledgeable, more productive.
Creating things, fixing things also brings happiness.

So things working perfectly is evidence of Intelligent Design and things working imperfectly is evidence of Intelligent Design. Sounds like you're trying to have your cake and eat it too.

I'm sure this line of reasoning goes over great at the oncology ward.

(03-01-2014 07:14 PM)Alla Wrote:  Different hardship brings different experiences.
Part of the plan is: this life suppose to be hard.

Brought to you by the "I'm doing this for your own good" school of abuse.

Want a better human? Build a better human. Don't torture them into it. The Creator that you describe is incompetent, insane or both.
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04-01-2014, 05:09 PM
RE: Unintelligent Design
Pretty much everything about the mammalian digestive tract...and most likely other digestive tracts that I know significantly less about.

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05-01-2014, 03:42 PM
RE: Unintelligent Design
(04-01-2014 04:54 PM)Paleophyte Wrote:  
(03-01-2014 07:14 PM)Alla Wrote:  Different hardship brings different experiences.
Part of the plan is: this life suppose to be hard.

Brought to you by the "I'm doing this for your own good" school of abuse.

Want a better human? Build a better human. Don't torture them into it. The Creator that you describe is incompetent, insane or both.

Insanely incompetent.
Insanely abusive.
Non existant.

I vote for number 3, the other two are too frightening to contemplate.

Throughout history conversions happen at the point of a sword, deconversions at the point of a pen - FC

I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man's reasoning powers are not above the monkey's. - Mark Twain in Eruption
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