Unreasonsble
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16-07-2015, 08:30 AM
RE: Unreasonsble
(16-07-2015 08:22 AM)ideasonscribe Wrote:  
(16-07-2015 08:20 AM)Chas Wrote:  There is no evidence of the existence of any gods, so it is still broken thinking.

Then everyone that believes in multiple external universes is using broken thinking.

True. Scientists propose hypotheses - that does not imply that they believe them.

What they believe is that there is some reason to consider those hypotheses.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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16-07-2015, 08:31 AM (This post was last modified: 16-07-2015 08:36 AM by Bucky Ball.)
RE: Unreasonsble
(16-07-2015 08:22 AM)ideasonscribe Wrote:  
(16-07-2015 08:20 AM)Chas Wrote:  There is no evidence of the existence of any gods, so it is still broken thinking.

Then everyone that believes in multiple external universes is using broken thinking.

Non-sequitur.
There are coherent definitions and evidence for at least one universe.
There have been ways proposed to test the idea that there may be others.
This link actually was not proven correct (the WMAP data did not show what they hoped to find, but at least they proposed a way to test the hypothesis).
There is not now, nor ever will be a way to test for any "god", (whatever that means).
http://www.technologyreview.com/view/421...universes/

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16-07-2015, 08:35 AM
RE: Unreasonsble
(16-07-2015 08:30 AM)Chas Wrote:  
(16-07-2015 08:22 AM)ideasonscribe Wrote:  Then everyone that believes in multiple external universes is using broken thinking.

True. Scientists propose hypotheses - that does not imply that they believe them.

What they believe is that there is some reason to consider those hypotheses.

But wouldn't you still have the same approach against a person who hypothesized the existence of 'god' (whatever they mean by that)?

Believing that there is some reason to consider that hypothesis?

“What you believe to be true will control you, whether it’s true or not.”

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16-07-2015, 08:40 AM (This post was last modified: 16-07-2015 08:53 AM by Bucky Ball.)
RE: Unreasonsble
(16-07-2015 08:35 AM)ideasonscribe Wrote:  
(16-07-2015 08:30 AM)Chas Wrote:  True. Scientists propose hypotheses - that does not imply that they believe them.

What they believe is that there is some reason to consider those hypotheses.

But wouldn't you still have the same approach against a person who hypothesized the existence of 'god' (whatever they mean by that)?

Believing that there is some reason to consider that hypothesis?

You need to define "belief".
You're equivocating the word "belief".
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equivocation
Science has reasons (preliminary data/observations) to propose an hypothesis.
The same does not apply to the gods.
Religious faith and belief and scientific "hunches" are not the same thing.

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16-07-2015, 08:42 AM
RE: Unreasonsble
(16-07-2015 07:24 AM)ideasonscribe Wrote:  
(16-07-2015 07:20 AM)BlackMason Wrote:  You do realise that your friends statement is actually a self refuting claim? Her judgement IS being affected by the fact that she is comforted by the idea of god.

Except that in this quote, she stated "if it doesn't affect my judgment negatively"
Some people find benefit in believing in god. It's not always a negative thing to simply believe in the existence of god. That is a false stigma.

You don't understand the breadth of what I've said. It could be the case that her judgement is being affected negatively by assuming a position of comfort due to her belief in a god. She could misread a situation thinking that she is fine because she thinks god will bail her out (as many believers do) and he doesn't. She is harmed. Her judgement was affected negatively because her judgement was impaired. You understand?

8000 years before Jesus, the Egyptian god Horus said, "I am the way, the truth, the life."
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16-07-2015, 08:50 AM
RE: Unreasonsble
(16-07-2015 08:42 AM)BlackMason Wrote:  
(16-07-2015 07:24 AM)ideasonscribe Wrote:  Except that in this quote, she stated "if it doesn't affect my judgment negatively"
Some people find benefit in believing in god. It's not always a negative thing to simply believe in the existence of god. That is a false stigma.

You don't understand the breadth of what I've said. It could be the case that her judgement is being affected negatively by assuming a position of comfort due to her belief in a god. She could misread a situation thinking that she is fine because she thinks god will bail her out (as many believers do) and he doesn't. She is harmed. Her judgement was affected negatively because her judgement was impaired. You understand?

Yeah, I understand now. I misread you on that one.

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16-07-2015, 08:53 AM
RE: Unreasonsble
(16-07-2015 08:40 AM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  You need to define "belief".
You're equivocating the word "belief".
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equivocation
Science has reasons (preliminary data/observations) to propose an hypothesis.
The same does not apply to the gods.
Religious faith and belief have no place in science.

Well then I do not believe in god. At least not in that sense.
So I suppose in a sense I am an atheist.
Who knew.

Though when I say 'believe', I am usually referring to someone stating that they believe something to be the case.
Other times, I am referring to someone stating they believe something makes more sense than the alternatives.
In my case, I am the latter. Which I guess does make me an atheist after all...
Fuck it.

“What you believe to be true will control you, whether it’s true or not.”

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16-07-2015, 08:55 AM
RE: Unreasonsble
But it can't be the case that I am an atheist because I don't fully lack belief in god. Well, or I sort of do, but don't?

Fuck I hate life!

“What you believe to be true will control you, whether it’s true or not.”

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16-07-2015, 08:56 AM
RE: Unreasonsble
(16-07-2015 08:55 AM)ideasonscribe Wrote:  But it can't be the case that I am an atheist because I don't fully lack belief in god. Well, or I sort of do, but don't?

Fuck I hate life!

No you don't.
You have a beautiful kid, and a wife.

The god shit ... you will get over it.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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16-07-2015, 08:59 AM
RE: Unreasonsble
(16-07-2015 08:56 AM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  
(16-07-2015 08:55 AM)ideasonscribe Wrote:  But it can't be the case that I am an atheist because I don't fully lack belief in god. Well, or I sort of do, but don't?

Fuck I hate life!

No you don't.
You have a beautiful kid, and a wife.

The god shit ... you will get over it.

My kid is beautiful as shit.
And if by "get over", you mean to say that I will eventually believe is completely false, then I was already there in reference to the religious deities. So yeah, I'm in a crappy situation of a self-identity crisis. I hate it..

“What you believe to be true will control you, whether it’s true or not.”

—Jeremy LaBorde
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