Urgent! Jennybee is leaving!
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29-01-2017, 08:39 PM
RE: Urgent! Jennybee is leaving!
(28-01-2017 11:25 PM)jennybee Wrote:  
(28-01-2017 10:31 PM)Aractus Wrote:  Nutritionists are generally expected to work within their client's preferences - even if their clients refuse to eat whole food groups. If they refuse to practice that way they could be dropped from NSA (or the equivalent Nutrition Society in your country).


Any decent nutritionist will tell you dietary supplements are considered a last resort. It's very difficult to find and recognise good quality supplements in the first place, without laboratory tests. I actually would not know where to start, and if you need to take a supplement I'd point you to a practising nutritionist that has lab information on-hand.

The most common nutrient deficiency in Australia is iron deficiency in women. Without animal products or supplementation it can be impossible to meet iron needs, even if eating iron-fortified bread and cereal daily. When it comes to supplements, many people find them unpleasant to take, and can find it difficult to find one that they can take. We also know nutrient absorption form all types of supplements is significantly lower (with the exception of B12) than from natural food sources, meaning if you need 18mg of iron per day from meat, then you'll need more than that from a supplement. And how much you need will be different to other people, so you might only need 9mg of iron per day for example, while another female your age might need 18mg, a small number of people will even need more.

So supplementation is far from a simple thing, it needs to be individually designed for people to meet their specific needs. If you just go and buy supplements off the shelf you'll be doing yourself more harm than good.


That is evidence is how they designed AGTHE/MyPlate etc. One evidence document for AGTHE is here, I'll give you some examples from it:
  • "Consumption of at least two serves a week (of fish) is associated with reduced risk of mortality from cardiovascular disease, and with reduced incidence of cardiovascular disease." - Grade C evidence (Good evidence)
  • "Consumption of fish more than once per week is associated with a reduced risk of developing dementia in older adults." - Grade B evidence (Very good evidence)

DASH is also designed this way (evidence-based). There is no vegan diet that has been designed around the evidence, and that's what I mean by the evidence base.

I'll actually give you one more example:
  • "Compared to infants who are formula fed, being breastfed is associated with reduced risk of becoming obese in childhood, adolescence, and early adulthood." - Grade A evidence (Excellent evidence).

You might already know that, but look at what people find out when they "investigate the evidence for themselves":





That's a video I saw a while ago, and what she's saying is shockingly wrong. You can ask a practising nutritionist if you don't believe me, but soy formula is designed primarily for infants that have an allergy to cow's milk and need formula because breastmilk is unavailable, it's not designed for people to raise their infants vegan. But unfortunately people do that.


By all means post the studies you have read. I'm not trying to insult you at all, I'd much rather have a civilised dialogue. Most people have very strongly held beliefs about food that differ from the evidence, and I don't think, know, or care whether I'm right or wrong, which is what I said on AF back in 2014. I only care about evidence-based practise. According to one of my lecturers, only about 20% of clinicians follow evidence-based practise (they are in fact often very sceptical and critical of new evidence)! A vegan diet is simply not built off evidence-based practise, omega3 fatty acids in fish is a good example of where we have very good or excellent quality evidence (I can't remember off hand) for some of their protective health benefits, but no one has yet shown that an omega3 supplement will give you the same health benefit.

*sigh* I can't even get away from this in a thread dedicated just for me Undecided

First, you are not my nutritionist. Second, I am a very healthy vegan, and I try to do everything I can to be as healthy as possible which is why I go to my own nutritionist/dietitian. Third, I said *nicely* that while I was willing to post studies I have looked at re: veganism for you if you were interested, I was not looking to have a debate or dialogue about this because I'm just kind of done with this topic right now.

It's good to see you have grown a thicker ... rind. Big Grin

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Science is not a subject, but a method.
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29-01-2017, 09:07 PM
RE: Urgent! Jennybee is leaving!
(29-01-2017 08:09 PM)RocketSurgeon76 Wrote:  
(29-01-2017 07:54 PM)KUSA Wrote:  She would be a good mother.

Well if there's a baby in her stomach, it means she ate one.

Jennybee's a Vegan, but sometimes you have to put your atheist rituals first. Laugh out load

For the vegan atheist:

[Image: 34068E2300000578-3584016-New_cake_Mr_Gra...258977.jpg]

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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29-01-2017, 11:11 PM
RE: Urgent! Jennybee is leaving!
(29-01-2017 09:07 PM)Chas Wrote:  
(29-01-2017 08:09 PM)RocketSurgeon76 Wrote:  Well if there's a baby in her stomach, it means she ate one.

Jennybee's a Vegan, but sometimes you have to put your atheist rituals first. Laugh out load

For the vegan atheist:

[Image: 34068E2300000578-3584016-New_cake_Mr_Gra...258977.jpg]

I would eat and have likely eaten every bit of what that is composed of. I'd rather eat vegetables in that form than a bunch of cake and candy. Thumbsup
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30-01-2017, 01:52 AM
RE: Urgent! Jennybee is leaving!
(29-01-2017 06:58 PM)Aractus Wrote:  I'm pretty sure that before my post in this thread I have not upset Jenny. I feel terrible for upsetting her, it was not my intention, I want her to feel loved/appreciated/welcome on the forum and again my unreserved apologies go to her for not being more sensitive.

My point is that the insistence you've demonstrated in this very thread is exemplary of her point, not that you were the cause of this thread.
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30-01-2017, 02:24 AM
RE: Urgent! Jennybee is leaving!
Dammit Jenny, turn on your PMs so I can send you a hug

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30-01-2017, 06:40 AM
RE: Urgent! Jennybee is leaving!
(29-01-2017 06:58 PM)Aractus Wrote:  
(29-01-2017 11:26 AM)Thumpalumpacus Wrote:  Seriously, have you considered the thought that this exact behavior is why she doesn't feel comfortable around here? Get a fucking clue already.

I'm pretty sure that before my post in this thread I have not upset Jenny. I feel terrible for upsetting her, it was not my intention, I want her to feel loved/appreciated/welcome on the forum and again my unreserved apologies go to her for not being more sensitive.

Sincere respect to you for this, Thumbsup
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30-01-2017, 08:50 AM
RE: Urgent! Jennybee is leaving!
(28-01-2017 09:21 AM)ELK12695 Wrote:  [Image: 3d2412f0f90b36541df018872d6d6d5d8a51fb4a...265444.jpg]

Pfft, ridiculous! Nobody who leaves this place ever comes back! Oh wait... Blink


In all seriousness, though- Jennybee, I hope you don't go, and if you do- I hope you come back. In the short time I've been back, I've seen you to be a very positive and sweet influence on these forums. Whatever you do, though, I wish you all the happiness and fulfillment that life can possibly bring to you. Best wishes! Heart *offering hugs*
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30-01-2017, 09:20 AM
RE: Urgent! Jennybee is leaving!
(28-01-2017 08:28 AM)jennybee Wrote:  I know you understand, possibly more than anyone on here, what it feels like to be treated rudely on here for your lifestyle choices, when you are doing nothing but simply existing. To me, treating people like that is bullying behavior.

Like I mentioned to RS, this wasn't the first time, the first thread, etc. This has also happened to me in random threads. I've just had enough. I'm fine with constructive debates on veganism. For example, I just read the meat thread and Dom's last post (while I'm not going to respond to it because I'm done with that thread) is an example of a constructive debate, someone I would be more than willing to discuss things further with. I'm totally up for that. Stereotypes and nastiness, that I'm not okay with.

Do you expect the mean spirited to do things that are not mean jennybee? Do you expect a bully not to bully others? They will do so for it is in their nature, which nature has endowed them with.

Why then let such trivial banter? For there is nothing you can do to change their nature, and you should not let their mere words change your disposition. Why let what they say make you miserable? Especially when you are the one in full control of how you react to their nastiness? You should not huff and pout at how unfair others are treating you. Rather you should focus on what is in your nature, the goal you have set for yourself in life is right in front of you.

Do not let those standing at the side who bray like an ass get in the way of your goal. For you should walk right past them, and the distance should grow so great between you that their braying trails into oblivion and you can no longer hear them, and soon so shall the thoughts that they even brayed at you be swept into oblivion and the end of your journey is upon you.

You can run from the people on this forum. but wherever you go jennybee. There will always be those who bray like asses.
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30-01-2017, 10:01 AM
RE: Urgent! Jennybee is leaving!
Facepalm I'm lost for words. No
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30-01-2017, 10:53 AM
RE: Urgent! Jennybee is leaving!
(30-01-2017 09:20 AM)Celestial_Wonder Wrote:  Why then let such trivial banter? For there is nothing you can do to change their nature, and you should not let their mere words change your disposition. Why let what they say make you miserable? Especially when you are the one in full control of how you react to their nastiness? You should not huff and pout at how unfair others are treating you. Rather you should focus on what is in your nature, the goal you have set for yourself in life is right in front of you.

You really don't think you can change people?

I believe that we can. I believe that most of us can both teach and learn, and given sufficient justice and strength of personality, even those with bad natures (as you call it) can be shown a better place.

I'm writing this as a recovering alcoholic, who would never had turned to recovery without my ex- being loving and persistently pointing out to me what my alcoholism was doing to me and doing to us. To use a less-personal example, Dr King changed the way millions of Americans viewed race relations. There are other examples as well.

While I understand and agree with your point that we should own our emotions, that's only half the story, because other people often can and do manipulate them. Serenity is an ongoing process, not a mental destination that will always remain once you reach it once. When someone is aiming to knock you off-balance emotionally, it does take work, and sometimes space, to maintain emotional balance.
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