Utah teachers attend free concealed weapons training class.
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29-12-2012, 07:08 PM
RE: Utah teachers attend free concealed weapons training class.
(29-12-2012 07:04 PM)germanyt Wrote:  What people dont' get is that it's not mandatory to carry a concealed weapon in class. They are taking the class so that if they choose to they will be qualified to do so. A school district in Texas has been allowing concealed weapons for years and they've never had an incident. The simple fact that teachers have the ability to carry will deter criminals from attempting anything at that particular school The reason schools get the shootings they do is because they are easy targets. Criminals know that no one on campus is going to be able to do anything to stop them. If you allow teachers to carry then you remove the certainty that criminals have.

My point is, if someone really wants to cause harm -- they will regardless of who might or might not be carrying a gun. Average people aren't in a daily position to defend themselves with a gun. It's not an everyday occurrence. And I would highly doubt that most people would actually think to pull their weapon, in fact most people's first thought is to get the fuck away from the crazy person,

I just don't see it making a difference.
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29-12-2012, 07:14 PM
RE: Utah teachers attend free concealed weapons training class.
(29-12-2012 06:49 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  I really tend to disagree, especially grammar school. The first priority should be to protect the children, not play hero with a gun. But really that's just my not-so-humble-opinion.


But the children weren't protected, not were the teachers.

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29-12-2012, 07:15 PM
RE: Utah teachers attend free concealed weapons training class.
(29-12-2012 06:50 PM)Red Tornado Wrote:  
(29-12-2012 06:49 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  I really tend to disagree, especially grammar school. The first priority should be to protect the children, not play hero with a gun. But really that's just my not-so-humble-opinion.
I'd think it'd be better if policemen had the guns, not every teacher. But that's me, I mean they are getting training so it's better than nothing, but it just doesn't sit well with me.


By the time the police got there, 27 people were dead.

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29-12-2012, 07:16 PM
RE: Utah teachers attend free concealed weapons training class.
(29-12-2012 07:04 PM)germanyt Wrote:  What people dont' get is that it's not mandatory to carry a concealed weapon in class. They are taking the class so that if they choose to they will be qualified to do so. A school district in Texas has been allowing concealed weapons for years and they've never had an incident. The simple fact that teachers have the ability to carry will deter criminals from attempting anything at that particular school The reason schools get the shootings they do is because they are easy targets. Criminals know that no one on campus is going to be able to do anything to stop them. If you allow teachers to carry then you remove the certainty that criminals have.
Friendly fire? Even soldiers hit their own. Training doesn't mean being incident-free. And this is one district, within a small town, for one school. This is small scale, which speaks more as a generalization rather than a statistical proof.

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29-12-2012, 07:17 PM
RE: Utah teachers attend free concealed weapons training class.
I mean, it's a ridiculous question to begin with 'but what if the teachers snap and have a mental breakdown?' well they shouldn't be near kids to begin with if they are mentally unstable.
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29-12-2012, 07:20 PM
RE: Utah teachers attend free concealed weapons training class.
(29-12-2012 07:14 PM)Chas Wrote:  But the children weren't protected, not were the teachers.

Which is why the focus would be on making the schools more secure, locking people that want to do harm out, or even slowing them down for police to get there. It would reduce death better relying on a member of staff getting an incapacitating shot off.

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29-12-2012, 07:28 PM
RE: Utah teachers attend free concealed weapons training class.
(29-12-2012 07:14 PM)Chas Wrote:  
(29-12-2012 06:49 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  I really tend to disagree, especially grammar school. The first priority should be to protect the children, not play hero with a gun. But really that's just my not-so-humble-opinion.


But the children weren't protected, not were the teachers.

Because a guy heavily armed with an assault weapon. The door to the school was locked and I seem to recall a "guard" type person was killed along with the school principal.

Again, I doubt under those shocking conditions the first response is to get away. Not pull a gun and try to shoot. The teacher in that classroom full of babies, was probably killed first -- because she was the biggest threat....it's terrifying to think about it -- and from what I've read (admittedly not much), it wasn't very long -- how long does it take with a semi automatic weapon to mow people down?

There was a shooting recently, days before in fact the school shooting, at a mall less than a mile from my house. I walked through the door just as shots were fired. People screamed. I grabbed my son and walked out. Our local news station interviewed a guy who claimed to have a gun, and considered shooting the guy -- he said he didn't because he worried about hitting other people.

I don't know. As I said earlier, average people don't have the need to pull a gun everyday....school shootings are very rare..I just worry that shit like that lulls people into a false sense of security.
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29-12-2012, 07:29 PM
RE: Utah teachers attend free concealed weapons training class.
(29-12-2012 07:08 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  
(29-12-2012 07:04 PM)germanyt Wrote:  What people dont' get is that it's not mandatory to carry a concealed weapon in class. They are taking the class so that if they choose to they will be qualified to do so. A school district in Texas has been allowing concealed weapons for years and they've never had an incident. The simple fact that teachers have the ability to carry will deter criminals from attempting anything at that particular school The reason schools get the shootings they do is because they are easy targets. Criminals know that no one on campus is going to be able to do anything to stop them. If you allow teachers to carry then you remove the certainty that criminals have.

My point is, if someone really wants to cause harm -- they will regardless of who might or might not be carrying a gun. Average people aren't in a daily position to defend themselves with a gun. It's not an everyday occurrence. And I would highly doubt that most people would actually think to pull their weapon, in fact most people's first thought is to get the fuck away from the crazy person,

I just don't see it making a difference.
That's what the training is for, to prepare you to react in a way that could save lives in the event that something were to happen. There's a difference between self-defense training and just putting a gun in the drawer.

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29-12-2012, 07:37 PM
RE: Utah teachers attend free concealed weapons training class.
(29-12-2012 07:15 PM)Chas Wrote:  
(29-12-2012 06:50 PM)Red Tornado Wrote:  I'd think it'd be better if policemen had the guns, not every teacher. But that's me, I mean they are getting training so it's better than nothing, but it just doesn't sit well with me.


By the time the police got there, 27 people were dead.

Yes within MINUTES of walking through the door. It wasn't hours of standoff. He went there with intent to do harm. He did it quickly, reports vary, but most agree it was not much time passed after killing the first person and shooting himself. Just a few minutes. Do you think his own mother had time to react when he shot her in her bed?

I'm not against guns. I'm against people's knee-jerk reactions to violence. What Utah is doing is a knee-jerk reaction to something tragic no one foresaw or could prevent.
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29-12-2012, 07:38 PM (This post was last modified: 29-12-2012 07:44 PM by Momsurroundedbyboys.)
RE: Utah teachers attend free concealed weapons training class.
(29-12-2012 07:29 PM)Phaedrus Wrote:  
(29-12-2012 07:08 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  My point is, if someone really wants to cause harm -- they will regardless of who might or might not be carrying a gun. Average people aren't in a daily position to defend themselves with a gun. It's not an everyday occurrence. And I would highly doubt that most people would actually think to pull their weapon, in fact most people's first thought is to get the fuck away from the crazy person,

I just don't see it making a difference.
That's what the training is for, to prepare you to react in a way that could save lives in the event that something were to happen. There's a difference between self-defense training and just putting a gun in the drawer.

It is not in anyway extensive training. The military goes through weeks of training.
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