Utah teachers attend free concealed weapons training class.
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30-12-2012, 07:49 PM
RE: Utah teachers attend free concealed weapons training class.
My kids have teachers that I barely trust with well-sharpeneded pencils. The day they arm the teachers and staff at my kids' school is the day I start homeschooling.
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30-12-2012, 07:52 PM
RE: Utah teachers attend free concealed weapons training class.
This is such a fuckin circle jerk anyway. The Republicans are screaming for armed guards in schools but will obstruct any legislation that would pay for it. Fuck everyone for letting them have a brand new distraction to keep us from truly seeing what they do (don't do) in office.
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30-12-2012, 07:54 PM
RE: Utah teachers attend free concealed weapons training class.
An armed and trained security guard was at Columbine. Just sayin.
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30-12-2012, 08:00 PM
RE: Utah teachers attend free concealed weapons training class.
(30-12-2012 07:54 PM)happy cricket Wrote:  An armed and trained security guard was at Columbine. Just sayin.
"He traded fire (that is, he drew fire) with Harris for an extended
period of time, during which Harris’s gun jammed. The deputy and the backup he
immediately called for exchanged fire with the shooters a second time and helped
begin the evacuation of students, all before the SWAT teams and the rest of the
cavalry arrived, and before Harris and Klebold killed themselves in the library.
Harris and Klebold had an assault plan — a sloppy plan, but a plan nonetheless.
They had dozens of IEDs, some of which detonated, others of which did not. And
there were two of them. In this highly chaotic tactical environment, the deputy
acted both bravely and prudently, and who knows how many lives he saved by
engaging Harris."

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30-12-2012, 08:04 PM
RE: Utah teachers attend free concealed weapons training class.
(30-12-2012 08:00 PM)Chas Wrote:  
(30-12-2012 07:54 PM)happy cricket Wrote:  An armed and trained security guard was at Columbine. Just sayin.
"He traded fire (that is, he drew fire) with Harris for an extended
period of time, during which Harris’s gun jammed. The deputy and the backup he
immediately called for exchanged fire with the shooters a second time and helped
begin the evacuation of students, all before the SWAT teams and the rest of the
cavalry arrived, and before Harris and Klebold killed themselves in the library.
Harris and Klebold had an assault plan — a sloppy plan, but a plan nonetheless.
They had dozens of IEDs, some of which detonated, others of which did not. And
there were two of them. In this highly chaotic tactical environment, the deputy de
acted both bravely and prudently, and who knows how many lives he saved by
engaging Harris."thing
The dude was a hero. I'm not implying anything otherwise. I'm just sayin' 12 kids still got killed. Imagine some old woman at the front of the classroom trying to calculate what is happening and trying to remember where her gun is when this shit goes down. Much less holding it straight and trying to fire. It's too much to expect from teachers.
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30-12-2012, 08:16 PM
RE: Utah teachers attend free concealed weapons training class.
(30-12-2012 08:04 PM)happy cricket Wrote:  
(30-12-2012 08:00 PM)Chas Wrote:  "He traded fire (that is, he drew fire) with Harris for an extended
period of time, during which Harris’s gun jammed. The deputy and the backup he
immediately called for exchanged fire with the shooters a second time and helped
begin the evacuation of students, all before the SWAT teams and the rest of the
cavalry arrived, and before Harris and Klebold killed themselves in the library.
Harris and Klebold had an assault plan — a sloppy plan, but a plan nonetheless.
They had dozens of IEDs, some of which detonated, others of which did not. And
there were two of them. In this highly chaotic tactical environment, the deputy de
acted both bravely and prudently, and who knows how many lives he saved by
engaging Harris."thing
The dude was a hero. I'm not implying anything otherwise. I'm just sayin' 12 kids still got killed. Imagine some old woman at the front of the classroom trying to calculate what is happening and trying to remember where her gun is when this shit goes down. Much less holding it straight and trying to fire. It's too much to expect from teachers.


That's pretty much a strawman argument.

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30-12-2012, 08:27 PM
RE: Utah teachers attend free concealed weapons training class.
I'm not a debate expert, I get what you are saying, but I don't entirely follow. I've never been one to throw out logical fallacies like pokemon during a discussion. How is it a strawman? The OP was about teachers being "trained to protect themselves" with concealed weapons.
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30-12-2012, 08:52 PM
RE: Utah teachers attend free concealed weapons training class.
(30-12-2012 08:27 PM)happy cricket Wrote:  I'm not a debate expert, I get what you are saying, but I don't entirely follow. I've never been one to throw out logical fallacies like pokemon during a discussion. How is it a strawman? The OP was about teachers being "trained to protect themselves" with concealed weapons.


And the ones that qualify will be allowed to carry weapons. Not "some old woman at the front of the classroom trying to calculate what is happening and trying to remember where her gun is when this shit goes down".

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Science is not a subject, but a method.
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30-12-2012, 08:57 PM
RE: Utah teachers attend free concealed weapons training class.
I hear you. It's still a scary thought to me. Lanza's mom probably would have qualified (yes, that was a strawman, lol).
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30-12-2012, 09:15 PM
RE: Utah teachers attend free concealed weapons training class.
(30-12-2012 05:51 PM)germanyt Wrote:  
(30-12-2012 05:35 PM)earmuffs Wrote:  And what about those robberies that were simply armed robbery but because the clerk decided to play hero got a shotgun shell to the face?
Hindsight is 20/20. I'm not gonna take it on faith that the robber won't shoot me after I empty the register. If I'm being held up with a gun I'm much rather take my chances by having a gun of my own than just hope for the best.
That is a statement of ignorance.
I accept that there is a few people that are just fucked up and will shoot a clerk anyway, the vast majority are there for a reason, that being money. There are numerous reasons why they're in that situation obviously, but the purpose is all the same, money.
So they go in get the money and leave.
But if they go in and a clerk pulls out a gun then suddenly it goes from pay day to survival except it's survival but still need that money. Not to mention the cases of the clerk just shooting the robber (to which no doubt most people would say 'good job", but that is also a statement of ignorance as you don't know these people's background etc..).

Things can remain relatively calm (as calm as armed robbery can be) if only one person has a gun, the moment you get opposing people with guns things escalate very quickly.
The pocket change in the till is not worth someones life, criminal or clerk.

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