Poll: What is your opinion of Vaccines/Vaccine Policy?
Vaccines saved the world. Bring them on.
I don't entirely trust big pharma, but vaccines have done more good than harm.
Some vaccines are effective and useful. Some are not.
Vaccines are of questionable value, like many pharmaceuticals, but I might want one if an epidemic hits.
Vaccines cause more health problems than they prevent. Parents and individuals should have the right to refuse any/all of them.
Vaccines are part of a population-reduction conspiracy on the part of the global elite and are intended to sterilize/kill as many as possible.
[Show Results]
 
Vaccine (Public Health) Policy Needs to Be Challenged
Post Reply
 
Thread Rating:
  • 0 Votes - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
05-05-2014, 09:16 PM
RE: Vaccine (Public Health) Policy Needs to Be Challenged
(05-05-2014 09:00 PM)Taqiyya Mockingbird Wrote:  Fucking idiot.

Fucking retard.

If there's an award for least interesting, intelligent, or challenging retorts on this forum, it's all yours. As usual, you say nothing of impact or value.

If you have a position, why not state it explicitly and support it with sources? Are you afraid I'll respond with the same level of vitriolic vapor as you offer? I assure you I would bring something more challenging than "fucking retard".
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
05-05-2014, 10:22 PM
RE: Vaccine (Public Health) Policy Needs to Be Challenged
Well...here's some news from my country about how Anti-vaccination groups are viewed.

And their reply/view of our court's decision.

http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles/index.html?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=facebook#3avn

Much cheers to all.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
05-05-2014, 11:12 PM (This post was last modified: 06-05-2014 09:27 AM by Taqiyya Mockingbird.)
RE: Vaccine (Public Health) Policy Needs to Be Challenged
(05-05-2014 09:16 PM)Magellan35 Wrote:  
(05-05-2014 09:00 PM)Taqiyya Mockingbird Wrote:  Fucking idiot.

Fucking retard.

If there's an award for least interesting, intelligent, or challenging retorts on this forum, it's all yours. As usual, you say nothing of impact or value.

Oh, look -- the fucking retard skips right over the points that destroy its claims and resorts to crying Purity Raped over adult language. No surprise here.


Quote:If you have a position, why not state it explicitly and support it with sources?

Yes, and there it is, again the fucktard attempts to shift the burden of proof. My position is that you have failed to meet your burden of proof. Everyone here can see that, including you. My sources are YOUR POSTS and YOUR FAILURE TO MEET YOUR BURDEN OF PROOF AND TO CONVINCE ANYONE HERE OF YOUR BATSHIT CLAIMS QED.


Quote:Are you afraid

I am afraid of NOTHING.


Quote:...I'll respond with the same level of vitriolic vapor as you offer?

I don't give a fuck WHAT you try to do, as you continue augering in with your failed batshit anti-vax claims in tow.


Quote:I assure you I would bring something more challenging than "fucking retard".

Am I supposed to be impressed? HoboLaughat

It's Special Pleadings all the way down!


Magic Talking Snakes STFU -- revenantx77


You can't have your special pleading and eat it too. -- WillHop
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
06-05-2014, 08:39 AM
RE: Vaccine (Public Health) Policy Needs to Be Challenged
Hey Taq,

I have given abundant data, numerous sources, and clear exposition regarding deficiencies within the system that claims to have public health and child welfare as its primary motivations.

Regarding measles alone, one of the chief vaccine developers in the U.S. says, "[The measles vaccine] cannot be administered to those who are immunocompromised, who have allergies to vaccine components, or who are pregnant [among other limitations, leaving] a large enough segment of the population susceptible and unprotected from measles such that cases will continue to occur.”

"The answer, according to Dr. Poland, lies in our genes. Because of their genetic predisposition, some people will not respond to the current measles vaccine, even with additional boosters. By the same token, the genetic predisposition of others makes them susceptible to harm from the measles vaccine, leading to public wariness, including among the well educated. What is needed, suggests Dr. Poland, is for the public health establishment to accept that the current measles vaccine has so many drawbacks as to make it unworkable, and get on with the job of developing next-generation vaccines." --http://business.financialpost.com/2014/05/01/lawrence-solomon-vaccines-cant-prevent-measles-outbreaks/

If you can't wrap your head around the idea that everything in the world is not great, that science evolves and demands improvement of old institutions, and that public-private programs with even the best of intentions can fall into corrupt patterns to protect business as usual, no one can help you, especially me.

My views are not radical and they are shared by millions of people (and growing) who consider the evidence with an open mind. You are a precious Pollyanna hiding behind a sharp tongue. Your language doesn't offend me. What offends me is that it's all you have. Well, that and caps lock...

Do we need vaccines? In some places, where risk is high and quality of life is low, some vaccines make sense. Where quality of life is high, basic health is maintained, and other measures available to limit the duration and morbidity of a disease you statistically aren't likely to contract in the first place, an educated person should not be ridiculed for deciding not to vaccinate. Nor would I ridicule those who choose to vaccinate. It should be a choice, after all.

On the other hand, improving vaccines so they do not overwhelm the self-organized criticality of the immune system and lead to autoimmune disease(s) should be mandatory. Defending methods currently in use without opening oneself (and one's products) to reasonable criticism - as Paul Offit does in the Medline piece someone cited here - is unconscionable.

If you don't have the intellect to understand what I've said here, please respond with a bunch of nonsense to make it abundantly clear.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
06-05-2014, 09:35 AM
RE: Vaccine (Public Health) Policy Needs to Be Challenged
Strawman much, asshole?

I don't claim that "everything is great" or that what is in place is perfect. No one here does.





Your moronic "solution" -- to leave us all vulnerable to mass pandemics -- would get us all killed, you fucking idiot.

It's Special Pleadings all the way down!


Magic Talking Snakes STFU -- revenantx77


You can't have your special pleading and eat it too. -- WillHop
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 2 users Like Taqiyya Mockingbird's post
06-05-2014, 09:40 AM
RE: Vaccine (Public Health) Policy Needs to Be Challenged
http://www.cnn.com/2014/05/05/health/who-polio/

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
06-05-2014, 11:16 AM
RE: Vaccine (Public Health) Policy Needs to Be Challenged
Although I have not read the entire thread, I am astounded at the sheer idiocy.

You cannot use Science to disprove Science, first of all. Any studies you cite must be peer reviewed and be endorsed by a credible scientific college or they will be rejected outright.

Your message is dangerous, because it contains inaccurate information that jeopardizes the health of the GLOBAL population, if anyone is unable to see through your pseudo science nonsense.

I hate America's lawsuit culture....but I'm actually hoping that a parent sues an anti-vaxx parent for willfully and negligently exposing their child to a potentially deadly virus. The vulnerable depend on the herd immunity of the strong to protect them.

I'm currently trying to become pregnant and spending a great deal of money trying to do so. If I do get pregnant, and I am exposed to Measles through an unvaccinated child, and my fetus is miscarried, I would sue those parents for negligence. We all have a duty to not be a danger to other people. Period.

A little rudeness and disrespect can elevate a meaningless interaction to a battle of wills and add drama to an otherwise dull day - Bill Watterson
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
06-05-2014, 04:21 PM
RE: Vaccine (Public Health) Policy Needs to Be Challenged
(06-05-2014 11:16 AM)Cathym112 Wrote:  Although I have not read the entire thread, I am astounded at the sheer idiocy.

You cannot use Science to disprove Science, first of all. Any studies you cite must be peer reviewed and be endorsed by a credible scientific college or they will be rejected outright.

Your message is dangerous, because it contains inaccurate information that jeopardizes the health of the GLOBAL population, if anyone is unable to see through your pseudo science nonsense.

I hate America's lawsuit culture....but I'm actually hoping that a parent sues an anti-vaxx parent for willfully and negligently exposing their child to a potentially deadly virus. The vulnerable depend on the herd immunity of the strong to protect them.

I'm currently trying to become pregnant and spending a great deal of money trying to do so. If I do get pregnant, and I am exposed to Measles through an unvaccinated child, and my fetus is miscarried, I would sue those parents for negligence. We all have a duty to not be a danger to other people. Period.

Let's use your situation as an example of how to apply reason to the decision-making process.

You want to have a baby, so you start looking at the odds of coming across a pathogen that might harm you or your child. That is wise. Let's take measles as an example.

Before introduction of the measles vaccine, there were 3-4 million cases of this very infectious disease per year in the U.S., with 95%–98% of children infected by age 18 (risk of becoming infected is approximately 90% per exposure for the unvaccinated, but for this exercised let's say it's 100%), and it was considered an inevitable rite of passage. In the years before the vaccine, of the 3-4 million for whom the disease was reported (many cases were so asymptomatic or mild that they went unreported), 450 people died, which placed the odds of death at 450/3,000,000, or a .015% chance of your child dying from measles, IF exposed.

Even that number is high, since the pre-vaccine mortality rate for measles by comparison with the U.S. population of 189,241,798 (in 1963) was actually .000237% .

Add to that the fact that if you, as the mother, have measles antibodies, you can pass them on to your infant to lower the risk even further. If, in spite of living in a country with access to good nutrition, clean water and public sanitation, your child contracts measles anyway, high doses of vitamin A (vitamin A deficiency has long been known to be the primary reason for measles morbidity/mortality where standards of living are poor) and decent nursing will aid in rapid recovery, with decades-long immunity as a result. Remember, your child can get measles even if vaccinated, so be prepared: "During the 1989-1991 U.S. outbreaks, 20% to 40% of those affected had received one to two doses. In a 2011 outbreak in Canada, over 50% of the 98 individuals had received two doses of measles vaccine." - http://business.financialpost.com/2014/0...outbreaks/

You can do the math and stop living in terror, or you can get the vaccine before you get pregnant, have a simple blood test done to make sure you have plenty of measles antibody to (hopefully) lower your risk of measles during pregnancy, and worry about whether or not the risk of contracting measles is equal to the risk of a vaccine that may be creating an autoimmune response in you that might show up just in time to make motherhood much less fun.

It's your choice, but please don't pretend I'm just spouting pseudoscience and abdicate your responsibility to act upon available information.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
06-05-2014, 04:27 PM (This post was last modified: 06-05-2014 04:33 PM by Peebothuhul.)
RE: Vaccine (Public Health) Policy Needs to Be Challenged
Edit: Just saw your lateast post after adding mine own.

(06-05-2014 04:21 PM)Magellan35 Wrote:  Before introduction of the measles vaccine, there were 3-4 million cases of this very infectious disease per year in the U.S., with 95%–98% of children infected by age 18 (risk of becoming infected is approximately 90% per exposure for the unvaccinated, but for this exercised let's say it's 100%), and it was considered an inevitable rite of passage. In the years before the vaccine, of the 3-4 million for whom the disease was reported (many cases were so asymptomatic or mild that they went unreported), 450 people died, which placed the odds of death at 450/3,000,000, or a .015% chance of your child dying from measles, IF exposed.

Even that number is high, since the pre-vaccine mortality rate for measles by comparison with the U.S. population of 189,241,798 (in 1963) was actually .000237% .

Add to that the fact that if you, as the mother, have measles antibodies, you can pass them on to your infant to lower the risk even further. If, in spite of living in a country with access to good nutrition, clean water and public sanitation, your child contracts measles anyway, high doses of vitamin A (vitamin A deficiency has long been known to be the primary reason for measles morbidity/mortality where standards of living are poor) and decent nursing will aid in rapid recovery, with decades-long immunity as a result. Remember, your child can get measles even if vaccinated, so be prepared: "During the 1989-1991 U.S. outbreaks, 20% to 40% of those affected had received one to two doses. In a 2011 outbreak in Canada, over 50% of the 98 individuals had received two doses of measles vaccine." - http://business.financialpost.com/2014/0...outbreaks/

Might I ask specifically where you came across the above information?

Here's something I find rather alarming/scary posted via a 'facebook' link.

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=...154&type=1

Kind of relevant, given the topic under discussion.

Much cheers to all
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
06-05-2014, 04:34 PM
RE: Vaccine (Public Health) Policy Needs to Be Challenged
(06-05-2014 04:21 PM)Magellan35 Wrote:  
(06-05-2014 11:16 AM)Cathym112 Wrote:  Although I have not read the entire thread, I am astounded at the sheer idiocy.

You cannot use Science to disprove Science, first of all. Any studies you cite must be peer reviewed and be endorsed by a credible scientific college or they will be rejected outright.

Your message is dangerous, because it contains inaccurate information that jeopardizes the health of the GLOBAL population, if anyone is unable to see through your pseudo science nonsense.

I hate America's lawsuit culture....but I'm actually hoping that a parent sues an anti-vaxx parent for willfully and negligently exposing their child to a potentially deadly virus. The vulnerable depend on the herd immunity of the strong to protect them.

I'm currently trying to become pregnant and spending a great deal of money trying to do so. If I do get pregnant, and I am exposed to Measles through an unvaccinated child, and my fetus is miscarried, I would sue those parents for negligence. We all have a duty to not be a danger to other people. Period.

Let's use your situation as an example of how to apply reason to the decision-making process.

You want to have a baby, so you start looking at the odds of coming across a pathogen that might harm you or your child. That is wise. Let's take measles as an example.

Before introduction of the measles vaccine, there were 3-4 million cases of this very infectious disease per year in the U.S., with 95%–98% of children infected by age 18 (risk of becoming infected is approximately 90% per exposure for the unvaccinated, but for this exercised let's say it's 100%), and it was considered an inevitable rite of passage. In the years before the vaccine, of the 3-4 million for whom the disease was reported (many cases were so asymptomatic or mild that they went unreported), 450 people died, which placed the odds of death at 450/3,000,000, or a .015% chance of your child dying from measles, IF exposed.

Even that number is high, since the pre-vaccine mortality rate for measles by comparison with the U.S. population of 189,241,798 (in 1963) was actually .000237% .

Add to that the fact that if you, as the mother, have measles antibodies, you can pass them on to your infant to lower the risk even further. If, in spite of living in a country with access to good nutrition, clean water and public sanitation, your child contracts measles anyway, high doses of vitamin A (vitamin A deficiency has long been known to be the primary reason for measles morbidity/mortality where standards of living are poor) and decent nursing will aid in rapid recovery, with decades-long immunity as a result. Remember, your child can get measles even if vaccinated, so be prepared: "During the 1989-1991 U.S. outbreaks, 20% to 40% of those affected had received one to two doses. In a 2011 outbreak in Canada, over 50% of the 98 individuals had received two doses of measles vaccine." - http://business.financialpost.com/2014/0...outbreaks/

You can do the math and stop living in terror, or you can get the vaccine before you get pregnant, have a simple blood test done to make sure you have plenty of measles antibody to (hopefully) lower your risk of measles during pregnancy, and worry about whether or not the risk of contracting measles is equal to the risk of a vaccine that may be creating an autoimmune response in you that might show up just in time to make motherhood much less fun.

It's your choice, but please don't pretend I'm just spouting pseudoscience and abdicate your responsibility to act upon available information.

Yet more proof Magellan is totally incompetent to even begin discussing the subject. Here's some REAL stats, (as you see he just made his up).
http://www.cdc.gov/measles/about/complications.html

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 2 users Like Bucky Ball's post
Post Reply
Forum Jump: