Poll: What is your opinion of Vaccines/Vaccine Policy?
Vaccines saved the world. Bring them on.
I don't entirely trust big pharma, but vaccines have done more good than harm.
Some vaccines are effective and useful. Some are not.
Vaccines are of questionable value, like many pharmaceuticals, but I might want one if an epidemic hits.
Vaccines cause more health problems than they prevent. Parents and individuals should have the right to refuse any/all of them.
Vaccines are part of a population-reduction conspiracy on the part of the global elite and are intended to sterilize/kill as many as possible.
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Vaccine (Public Health) Policy Needs to Be Challenged
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28-04-2014, 06:06 PM
RE: Vaccine (Public Health) Policy Needs to Be Challenged
Alot of hubub is about thiomersal .http://www.nps.org.au/old/medicines/vaccines_immunisation/faqs_about_vaccines/mercury_thiomersal_in_vaccines_for_children

Some of the claims are alarming, will investigate. BBL.
So far a little digging reveals anti-vax claims are for chemicals no longer in use or perverse data mining which does not match reality.

Theism is to believe what other people claim, Atheism is to ask "why should I".
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28-04-2014, 06:38 PM (This post was last modified: 28-04-2014 08:41 PM by Chas.)
RE: Vaccine (Public Health) Policy Needs to Be Challenged
(28-04-2014 04:40 PM)Magellan35 Wrote:  http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17643770; http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21945263

First one: page not found.

Second one:
PubMed Wrote:CONCLUSIONS:

Trivalent influenza virus vaccination elicits a measurable inflammatory response among pregnant women. There is sufficient variability in response for testing associations with clinical outcomes. As adverse perinatal health outcomes including pre-eclampsia and preterm birth have an inflammatory component, a tendency toward greater inflammatory responding to immune triggers may predict risk of adverse outcomes, providing insight into biological mechanisms underlying risk. The inflammatory response elicited by vaccination is substantially milder and more transient than seen in infectious illness, arguing for the clinical value of vaccination. However, further research is needed to confirm that the mild inflammatory response elicited by vaccination is benign in pregnancy.

Do you even read this stuff? If so, you don't understand it.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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28-04-2014, 06:40 PM (This post was last modified: 28-04-2014 11:02 PM by Magellan35.)
RE: Vaccine (Public Health) Policy Needs to Be Challenged
(28-04-2014 06:06 PM)sporehux Wrote:  So far a little digging reveals anti-vax claims are for chemicals no longer in use or perverse data mining which does not match reality.

True. Bear in mind though the fact that they are still in use in many parts of the world, and that an industry's past behaviour can be an indication of its present ethics.
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28-04-2014, 06:41 PM
RE: Vaccine (Public Health) Policy Needs to Be Challenged
(28-04-2014 06:38 PM)Chas Wrote:  
(28-04-2014 04:40 PM)Magellan35 Wrote:  http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17643770; http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21945263

First one: page not found.

Second one:
PubMed Wrote:CONCLUSIONS:

Trivalent influenza virus vaccination elicits a measurable inflammatory response among pregnant women. There is sufficient variability in response for testing associations with clinical outcomes. As adverse perinatal health outcomes including pre-eclampsia and preterm birth have an inflammatory component, a tendency toward greater inflammatory responding to immune triggers may predict risk of adverse outcomes, providing insight into biological mechanisms underlying risk. The inflammatory response elicited by vaccination is substantially milder and more transient than seen in infectious illness, arguing for the clinical value of vaccination. However, further research is needed to confirm that the mild inflammatory response elicited by vaccination is benign in pregnancy.

Do you even read this stuff? If so, you don't understand it.
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28-04-2014, 06:42 PM
RE: Vaccine (Public Health) Policy Needs to Be Challenged
(28-04-2014 06:41 PM)Magellan35 Wrote:  
(28-04-2014 06:38 PM)Chas Wrote:  First one: page not found.

Second one:

Do you even read this stuff? If so, you don't understand it.

Inflammation is one response to vaccine. Not the only one. I said vaccines cause inflammation. Do you know how to read, period?
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28-04-2014, 08:19 PM
RE: Vaccine (Public Health) Policy Needs to Be Challenged
Another thing: Inflammation is an indication of high cytokine production in response to presence of a substance or antigen that produces a strong immune reaction. High cytokine counts are linked to numerous birth defects and complications.

Clearly, a pregnant woman should avoid anything that causes significant inflammation, including deliberately inducing it with a vaccine, if the principle of primum non nocere (first do no harm) is applied.
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28-04-2014, 08:36 PM
RE: Vaccine (Public Health) Policy Needs to Be Challenged
(28-04-2014 08:19 PM)Magellan35 Wrote:  Another thing: Inflammation is an indication of high cytokine production in response to presence of a substance or antigen that produces a strong immune reaction. High cytokine counts are linked to numerous birth defects and complications.

Clearly, a pregnant woman should avoid anything that causes significant inflammation, including deliberately inducing it with a vaccine, if the principle of primum non nocere (first do no harm) is applied.

Name all the vaccinations that are normally given to pregnant women. I know of not one. Your point is a strawman. There is NOT ONE.
Just more proof you have NO experience in clinical medicine, you have no clue what your are talking about, and you are totally incompetent to even begin discussing this subject.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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28-04-2014, 08:42 PM
RE: Vaccine (Public Health) Policy Needs to Be Challenged
(28-04-2014 06:42 PM)Magellan35 Wrote:  
(28-04-2014 06:41 PM)Magellan35 Wrote:  

Inflammation is one response to vaccine. Not the only one. I said vaccines cause inflammation. Do you know how to read, period?

The inflammatory response elicited by vaccination is substantially milder and more transient than seen in infectious illness, arguing for the clinical value of vaccination.

Re-read that, you delusional twat.

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28-04-2014, 09:02 PM
RE: Vaccine (Public Health) Policy Needs to Be Challenged
Since most of the antivax crowd sCREAM Autism as their smoking gun, I thought i'd go to the horses mouth and see what the autism society has to say on the issue: surely they would know autism better then most:

" FROM autismsciencefoundation.org
A decade ago most researchers agreed that we needed to study vaccines in relation to autism. We had to reconcile the fact that the number of vaccines children were receiving was increasing, and at the same time, the number of children who were being diagnosed with autism also was on the rise.
Fortunately this was a question that could be studied – and answered – by science. We looked at children who received vaccines and those who didn’t, or who received them on a different, slower schedule. There was no difference in their neurological outcomes.
Multiple studies have been completed which investigated the measles, mumps and rubella vaccination in relation to autism. Researchers have also studied thimerosal, a mercury-based preservative, to see if it had any relation to autism.
The results of studies are very clear; the data show no relationship between vaccines and autism. Read the studies themselves below and browse our recommended reading list."


http://www.autismsciencefoundation.org/a...cines.html


I call ignorant on the issue, but I have good reason to take the word of 99% of the scientific/medical community, the autism organisations and the WHO (world health organisation) that compulsory vaccinations are good for society.

Theism is to believe what other people claim, Atheism is to ask "why should I".
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28-04-2014, 09:38 PM
RE: Vaccine (Public Health) Policy Needs to Be Challenged
(28-04-2014 09:02 PM)sporehux Wrote:  I call ignorant on the issue, but I have good reason to take the word of 99% of the scientific/medical community, the autism organisations and the WHO (world health organisation) that compulsory vaccinations are good for society.

BUT THAT'S ALL A CONSPIRACY MAAAAAN, WAKE UP SHEEPLE BIG PHARMA IS EXPLOITING YOU TO MAKE REPTILOID FEEDSTOCK!!1!one!

Yeah.

Or something.

... this is my signature!
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