Vegetarian Athiests
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06-06-2013, 09:01 AM
RE: Vegetarian Athiests
(06-06-2013 05:59 AM)Stephen Charchuk Wrote:  
(05-06-2013 09:23 PM)bbeljefe Wrote:  Huh??? We produce too much food? Next, I'll wind up in a thread where someone is lamenting overpopulation and mass starvation...


Which the fuck is it? Do have to much or too little? I'm so confused.... Confused

Yes, you are very confused. That is apparent from the start. Maybe you're not getting enough Proper DHA for your brain? In the West we produce far too much food and consume it as well. This is not just too much meat, as was implied, but all foodstuffs as well and it has impacted our health in general. The irony is that 90% of the rest of the world doesn't produce enough food and this to has impacted their health as well. Having too much food is just as bad as not having enough in many ways. Its a paradox. This makes the vegetarian agenda less valid, much less valid.

I guess it depends upon the perspective you're looking from. If the argument is that we in the west produce too much food and those in the east produce too little, then let's get the surplus to them. After all, there are hundreds of charities dedicated to bringing food to the hungry of other nations.

But what about the waste argument? Why do we waste foods? And, of the foods we waste, what percentage of that could reasonably be stored and possibly transported to people who need it? Or just saved for later. Because if some of that waste is perishable by products of production, it can't be called useable foodstuff.

And back to the produce and eat too much argument... I disagree. I would argue that we produce too much unhealthy food and that the consumption of that unhealthy food causes over eating because it does not provide the nutrition one needs to actually feel "full". As I argued above (I think it was in this thread) against high fructose corn syrup, this mass produced, state subsidized sweetener causes negative health risks while at the same time it does not provide needed sugars. Therefore, a person can eat a food product sweetened with HFCS and not feel as though he has gotten the sugars that would normally be provided by that choice. So what happens? He eats another. But still, he doesn't get the sugars his body needs while at the same time, he's ingesting too much of a product that does the body harm.

Food production, distribution and quality is far too complicated a matter than to just argue that the US produces and eats too much food.

The beginning of wisdom is to call things by their right names. - Chinese Proverb
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06-06-2013, 09:15 AM (This post was last modified: 06-06-2013 09:30 AM by Stephen Charchuk.)
Re: RE: Vegetarian Athiests
(06-06-2013 09:01 AM)bbeljefe Wrote:  I guess it depends upon the perspective you're looking from. If the argument is that we in the west produce too much food and those in the east produce too little, then let's get the surplus to them. After all, there are hundreds of charities dedicated to bringing food to the hungry of other nations.

If only it were a perfect world. We do give them food but it doesn't work, and in many causes they want to kill us in their god's name as well. They resent us. You're kind of naive to think like that.

Quote:And back to the produce and eat too much argument... I disagree. I would argue that we produce too much unhealthy food and that the consumption of that unhealthy food causes over eating because it does not provide the nutrition one needs to actually feel "full".

Wrong we produce too much of ALL foods.

Quote:As I argued above (I think it was in this thread) against high fructose corn syrup, this mass produced, state subsidized sweetener causes negative health risks while at the same time it does not provide needed sugars. Therefore, a person can eat a food product sweetened with HFCS and not feel as though he has gotten the sugars that would normally be provided by that choice. So what happens? He eats another. But still, he doesn't get the sugars his body needs while at the same time, he's ingesting too much of a product that does the body harm.

Isn't sugar a plant product?

Quote:Food production, distribution and quality is far too complicated a matter than to just argue that the US produces and eats too much food.

Occam's Razor..... I fear that there is no hope for you.

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06-06-2013, 09:24 AM (This post was last modified: 06-06-2013 10:19 AM by Scully.)
RE: Vegetarian Athiests
I guess I should stop using the baby burrito metaphor when I'm teaching new parents how to swaddle wrap their baby.... Evil_monster

. . . all the gods were stories we told the children to make them behave. ~ Thoros of Myr (Game of Thrones, Episode 3:06)
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06-06-2013, 09:54 AM
RE: Vegetarian Athiests
(06-06-2013 09:15 AM)Stephen Charchuk Wrote:  If only it were a perfect world. We do give them food but it doesn't work, and in many causes they want to kill us in their god's name as well. They resent us. You're kind of naive to think like that.

"They" don't know me, let alone want to kill me. "They" hate the US government for its rapacious treatment of them and their resources. While it is true that there are some deluded individuals who, like many Americans, attribute the acts of governments to the people they rule, they're not in the majority.

Quote:Wrong we produce too much of ALL foods.

Again, it depends on your perspective. Perhaps you could make a reasoned argument to shore up your assertion?

Quote:Isn't sugar a plant product?

Yes it is. But high fructose corn syrup is not a natural sugar and it does not contain the beneficial nutrients that natural sugars do. Hydrocodone is derived from the opium plant but it is not opium and thus, has remarkably different properties than naturally occurring opium poppies.

Quote:Occam's Razor..... I fear that there is no hope for you.

Again, perhaps you could present a reasoned argument. As opposed to leveling insults at me.

The beginning of wisdom is to call things by their right names. - Chinese Proverb
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06-06-2013, 10:18 AM
Re: RE: Vegetarian Athiests
(06-06-2013 06:08 AM)Stephen Charchuk Wrote:  
(05-06-2013 09:11 PM)Chas Wrote:  LR-308?

The rifle? I think that it would be more sporting with a bow. My oldest brother use to go with a musket as well. You can hunt earlier as well with these two than with a modern firearm.

It doesn't look like a 308, the magazine well looks normal size.

When I hunt, I'm not trying to prove anything. Whatever gets meat in the freezer and isn't illegal is game on. With that being said, my bow is older then I am.Dodgy
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06-06-2013, 11:30 AM
Re: RE: Vegetarian Athiests
(06-06-2013 10:18 AM)TheBlackKnight Wrote:  It doesn't look like a 308, the magazine well looks normal size.

When I hunt, I'm not trying to prove anything. Whatever gets meat in the freezer and isn't illegal is game on. With that being said, my bow is older then I am.Dodgy

I would think that my brother's musket is MUCH older than he is. Tongue

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06-06-2013, 05:26 PM
Re: Vegetarian Athiests
Is it a actual "musket"? Most were smoothbore, which I wouldn't take to the woods. Wounding shots and the inability for a quick 2nd shot = bad for the deer.
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06-06-2013, 05:31 PM
Re: RE: Vegetarian Athiests
(06-06-2013 05:26 PM)TheBlackKnight Wrote:  Is it a actual "musket"? Most were smoothbore, which I wouldn't take to the woods. Wounding shots and the inability for a quick 2nd shot = bad for the deer.

Still more sporting. Not like shooting ducks in a burrel... Rolleyes

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06-06-2013, 05:54 PM
RE: Vegetarian Athiests
(06-06-2013 05:31 PM)Stephen Charchuk Wrote:  
(06-06-2013 05:26 PM)TheBlackKnight Wrote:  Is it a actual "musket"? Most were smoothbore, which I wouldn't take to the woods. Wounding shots and the inability for a quick 2nd shot = bad for the deer.

Still more sporting. Not like shooting ducks in a burrel... Rolleyes

No, not sportsman-like. TBK has it right. Dodgy

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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07-06-2013, 01:09 AM
RE: Vegetarian Athiests
I've been a vegetarian for 4 years and will never go back. I am still friends with an ex-work colleague who has been a vegan for a dozen years and will give a stern reason for it. I've also talked with a native american who told me about eating dandelion leafs and roots. I've also read a talk by a Berkeley professor who has said he doesn't eat feedlot meat; he also thinks less than one percent of us vegetarians are correct. I've also met a few permaculture, I currently can't do it, people and would love to give it a venture.

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