Veritas?
Post Reply
 
Thread Rating:
  • 0 Votes - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
02-06-2014, 07:25 AM
RE: Veritas?
(02-06-2014 07:03 AM)true scotsman Wrote:  Jeremy I showed you why your reasoning is subjective because of it's inward looking stance rather than being outward looking to the real world. Now I am going to prove to you that your Christian world view has nothing whatsoever to do with the truth.

I showed you how your Christian worldview contradicts the four axioms which the concept "objective truth" presupposes. Now I want you to prove any proposition you would like to choose, it doesn't have to be god, but any proposition but only using the tools your Christian "philosophy" gives you. I'm not going to let you steal from my philosophy any more. So here is my challenge:

Prove any proposition you would like to choose to be objectively true without using any of the following concepts:

Logic. You can't use logic because it presupposes the four axioms that your Christian worldview denies.

You can't use words. Words are symbols that represent concepts and concepts presuppose the four axioms that your Christian worldview denies.

You can make sounds as long as they don't convey any meaning since meaning presupposes the four axioms that your Christian worldview denies.

On second thought you can't use any sounds because sensory perception presupposes the four axioms that your Christian worldview denies.

That also means that you can't use body language either for the same reason.

You're left with mental telepathy to try to......oh, no that is out as well because that presupposes the concept "consciousness" that your Christian worldview denies exists.

OK are you ready to take the challenge? Let's go.

But silent farts are still OK, right?

Dodgy

Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
02-06-2014, 07:39 AM
RE: Veritas?
(02-06-2014 07:25 AM)DLJ Wrote:  
(02-06-2014 07:03 AM)true scotsman Wrote:  Jeremy I showed you why your reasoning is subjective because of it's inward looking stance rather than being outward looking to the real world. Now I am going to prove to you that your Christian world view has nothing whatsoever to do with the truth.

I showed you how your Christian worldview contradicts the four axioms which the concept "objective truth" presupposes. Now I want you to prove any proposition you would like to choose, it doesn't have to be god, but any proposition but only using the tools your Christian "philosophy" gives you. I'm not going to let you steal from my philosophy any more. So here is my challenge:

Prove any proposition you would like to choose to be objectively true without using any of the following concepts:

Logic. You can't use logic because it presupposes the four axioms that your Christian worldview denies.

You can't use words. Words are symbols that represent concepts and concepts presuppose the four axioms that your Christian worldview denies.

You can make sounds as long as they don't convey any meaning since meaning presupposes the four axioms that your Christian worldview denies.

On second thought you can't use any sounds because sensory perception presupposes the four axioms that your Christian worldview denies.

That also means that you can't use body language either for the same reason.

You're left with mental telepathy to try to......oh, no that is out as well because that presupposes the concept "consciousness" that your Christian worldview denies exists.

OK are you ready to take the challenge? Let's go.



But silent farts are still OK, right?

Dodgy

Let me think about that.........Yes as long as they are imaginary silent farts. No darn it because the concept "imagination" also presupposes the four axioms that his Christian worldview denies.

Do not lose your knowledge that man's proper estate is an upright posture, an intransigent mind and a step that travels unlimited roads. - Ayn Rand.

Don't sacrifice for me, live for yourself! - Me

The only alternative to Objectivism is some form of Subjectivism. - Dawson Bethrick
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes true scotsman's post
02-06-2014, 09:51 AM
RE: Veritas?
(01-06-2014 09:38 PM)evenheathen Wrote:  
(01-06-2014 09:16 PM)Taqiyya Mockingbird Wrote:  yea....

and if i beat your loved one until their eyes fell out of their sockets you would say i had done nothing really wrong.

yea....

I really believe that.

Good point, which also points to the fact that mother bears should recognize and accept Jesus as their Lord and savior, because the instinct to protect your loved ones isn't in any way due to a naturally evolved sense of empathy. It's obviously due to the objective rules of a being existing outside of anything we can really know (for some reason we can know why it's important to protect our progeny, but will never know for certain whether the great mamma bear in the sky exists or not, we gotta go on "feels").

Your whole "atheism has to ignore morals" schtick is really old, dude.


Somehow you misattributed that piece of shit to me... harumpf!

It's Special Pleadings all the way down!


Magic Talking Snakes STFU -- revenantx77


You can't have your special pleading and eat it too. -- WillHop
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
02-06-2014, 11:43 AM
RE: Veritas?
(02-06-2014 09:51 AM)Taqiyya Mockingbird Wrote:  
(01-06-2014 09:38 PM)evenheathen Wrote:  Good point, which also points to the fact that mother bears should recognize and accept Jesus as their Lord and savior, because the instinct to protect your loved ones isn't in any way due to a naturally evolved sense of empathy. It's obviously due to the objective rules of a being existing outside of anything we can really know (for some reason we can know why it's important to protect our progeny, but will never know for certain whether the great mamma bear in the sky exists or not, we gotta go on "feels").

Your whole "atheism has to ignore morals" schtick is really old, dude.


Somehow you misattributed that piece of shit to me... harumpf!

I sure did, dude. Sorry, drunk posting for the fail! Blush

Fixed it for ya.

But now I have come to believe that the whole world is an enigma, a harmless enigma that is made terrible by our own mad attempt to interpret it as though it had an underlying truth.

~ Umberto Eco
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes evenheathen's post
02-06-2014, 01:08 PM
RE: Veritas?
(02-06-2014 07:03 AM)true scotsman Wrote:  Jeremy I showed you why your reasoning is subjective because of it's inward looking stance rather than being outward looking to the real world. Now I am going to prove to you that your Christian world view has nothing whatsoever to do with the truth.

I showed you how your Christian worldview contradicts the four axioms which the concept "objective truth" presupposes. Now I want you to prove any proposition you would like to choose, it doesn't have to be god, but any proposition but only using the tools your Christian "philosophy" gives you. I'm not going to let you steal from my philosophy any more. So here is my challenge:

Prove any proposition you would like to choose to be objectively true without using any of the following concepts:

Logic. You can't use logic because it presupposes the four axioms that your Christian worldview denies.

You can't use words. Words are symbols that represent concepts and concepts presuppose the four axioms that your Christian worldview denies.

You can make sounds as long as they don't convey any meaning since meaning presupposes the four axioms that your Christian worldview denies.

On second thought you can't use any sounds because sensory perception presupposes the four axioms that your Christian worldview denies.

That also means that you can't use body language either for the same reason.

You're left with mental telepathy to try to......oh, no that is out as well because that presupposes the concept "consciousness" that your Christian worldview denies exists.

OK are you ready to take the challenge? Let's go.

Well?

Do not lose your knowledge that man's proper estate is an upright posture, an intransigent mind and a step that travels unlimited roads. - Ayn Rand.

Don't sacrifice for me, live for yourself! - Me

The only alternative to Objectivism is some form of Subjectivism. - Dawson Bethrick
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
02-06-2014, 03:50 PM
RE: Veritas?
(02-06-2014 07:03 AM)true scotsman Wrote:  Jeremy I showed you why your reasoning is subjective because of it's inward looking stance rather than being outward looking to the real world. Now I am going to prove to you that your Christian world view has nothing whatsoever to do with the truth.

I showed you how your Christian worldview contradicts the four axioms which the concept "objective truth" presupposes. Now I want you to prove any proposition you would like to choose, it doesn't have to be god, but any proposition but only using the tools your Christian "philosophy" gives you. I'm not going to let you steal from my philosophy any more. So here is my challenge:

Prove any proposition you would like to choose to be objectively true without using any of the following concepts:

Logic. You can't use logic because it presupposes the four axioms that your Christian worldview denies.

You can't use words. Words are symbols that represent concepts and concepts presuppose the four axioms that your Christian worldview denies.

You can make sounds as long as they don't convey any meaning since meaning presupposes the four axioms that your Christian worldview denies.

On second thought you can't use any sounds because sensory perception presupposes the four axioms that your Christian worldview denies.

That also means that you can't use body language either for the same reason.

You're left with mental telepathy to try to......oh, no that is out as well because that presupposes the concept "consciousness" that your Christian worldview denies exists.

OK are you ready to take the challenge? Let's go.

Christianity denies the four axioms of logic?

How so?
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
02-06-2014, 04:07 PM
RE: Veritas?
(02-06-2014 03:50 PM)Jeremy E Walker Wrote:  Christianity denies the four axioms of logic?

4 axioms of logic? Dude there's not only a shitload more than 4 axioms of logic there's a shitload more than 4 different logics all with different axioms and rules of inference. You ain't had no proper training in formal logic has you?

#sigh
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes GirlyMan's post
02-06-2014, 04:31 PM
RE: Veritas?
(02-06-2014 04:07 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  
(02-06-2014 03:50 PM)Jeremy E Walker Wrote:  Christianity denies the four axioms of logic?

4 axioms of logic? Dude there's not only a shitload more than 4 axioms of logic there's a shitload more than 4 different logics all with different axioms and rules of inference. You ain't had no proper training in formal logic has you?

In case you were wondering, it is purely a coincidence that 'christian logic' is an anagram or 'aching clitoris'.

Drinking Beverage

Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 3 users Like DLJ's post
02-06-2014, 04:34 PM
Veritas?
(02-06-2014 04:07 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  
(02-06-2014 03:50 PM)Jeremy E Walker Wrote:  Christianity denies the four axioms of logic?

4 axioms of logic? Dude there's not only a shitload more than 4 axioms of logic there's a shitload more than 4 different logics all with different axioms and rules of inference. You ain't had no proper training in formal logic has you?

That's just classical logic. Plus, missed one:

Quote:1. Law of the excluded middle and Double negative elimination;
2. Law of noncontradiction, and the principle of explosion;
3. Monotonicity of entailment and Idempotency of entailment;
4. Commutativity of conjunction;
5. De Morgan duality: every logical operator is dual to another;
While not entailed by the preceding conditions, contemporary discussions of classical logic normally only include propositional and first-order logics.[4][5]

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Classical_logic

β€œIt is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts.”
― Sir Arthur Conan Doyle, Sherlock Holmes
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
02-06-2014, 04:41 PM
RE: Veritas?
(02-06-2014 04:31 PM)DLJ Wrote:  In case you were wondering, it is purely a coincidence that 'christian logic' is an anagram or 'aching clitoris'.

Drinking Beverage

Just checked with an online anagram generator and it is!

Oh I need to use this in bed sometime.

"Oh yeah baby give me some christian logic!"
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes Mathilda's post
Post Reply
Forum Jump: