View of the afterlife in Job
Post Reply
 
Thread Rating:
  • 0 Votes - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
06-08-2015, 10:41 AM
View of the afterlife in Job
I've recently been reading Ehrman's textbook on the Bible (very good), and I have a question for other Bible-skeptics on this forum regarding the view of the afterlife in the poetic dialogues in Job. Ehrman states how there was no view of an afterlife, citing Job 14:10-14:

"But mortals die, and are laid low; humans expire, and where are they? As waters fail from a lake, and a river wastes away and dries up, so mortals lie down and do not rise again; until the heavens are no more, they will not awake or be roused out of their sleep. O that you would hide me in Sheol, that you would conceal me until your wrath is past, that you would appoint me a set time, and remember me! If mortals die, will they live again? All the days of my service I would wait until my release should come."

However, if Job doesn't have a view of the afterlife (I agree), how are we Bible skeptics to understand Job 19:25-27? "For I know that my Redeemer lives, and that at the last he will stand upon the earth; and after my skin has been thus destroyed, then in my flesh I shall see God, whom I shall see on my side, and my eyes shall behold, and not another." Does this imply life after death?
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
06-08-2015, 10:50 AM
RE: View of the afterlife in Job
Didn't Ehrman wrote that Book of Job has two different authors? If so then discrepancy would be easy to understand: another author, another perspective.

The first revolt is against the supreme tyranny of theology, of the phantom of God. As long as we have a master in heaven, we will be slaves on earth.

Mikhail Bakunin.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 2 users Like Szuchow's post
06-08-2015, 10:57 AM
RE: View of the afterlife in Job
Trying to find sense in the bible just strikes me as utterly pointless. The thing is like a textbook that in Chapter 1 says 2 + 2 = 5, without any explanation from whence that equation was derived, then later in Chapter 3 says 2 + 2 = 17.84 and 2/3, again without any explanation for its derivation or unorthodox representation, and ALL of its chapters and verses are similarly impenetrable. You just to put the thing down and say "why bother?"

It's 2015. Libraries across the world are filled with mega-trillions of words written by millions of educated brilliant minds - why the !@#$!!% give an ancient trifling million words set down in ignorance the least credence when on any topic therein the contemporary literature supercedes it by billions of words and the proof of scientific inquiry by learned competent scientists whose findings corroborate each other?
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 7 users Like Airportkid's post
06-08-2015, 10:58 AM
RE: View of the afterlife in Job
I thought the ancient Jews believed in the resurrection (and not the one involving Jesus). The Sadducees were set apart in that they didn't believe in the resurrection. I even learned a corny pun about it.

The Sadducees didn't believe in the resurrection, and that's sad, you see.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes RobbyPants's post
06-08-2015, 11:13 AM (This post was last modified: 06-08-2015 11:30 AM by Szuchow.)
RE: View of the afterlife in Job
(06-08-2015 10:58 AM)RobbyPants Wrote:  I thought the ancient Jews believed in the resurrection (and not the one involving Jesus). The Sadducees were set apart in that they didn't believe in the resurrection. I even learned a corny pun about it.

The Sadducees didn't believe in the resurrection, and that's sad, you see.

It appears they believed in some form of afterlife.

In Biblia w ręku ateisty by Helena Eilstein (no english edition) I found something* about death being final death, i.e. when Adam and Eve eat fruit they are condemned to death after which there will be no ressurection and they will be turned into dust; death is the end. Authoress also claims that Yahwist don't know about immortal soul connected with body.

*p. 177

The first revolt is against the supreme tyranny of theology, of the phantom of God. As long as we have a master in heaven, we will be slaves on earth.

Mikhail Bakunin.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes Szuchow's post
06-08-2015, 11:26 AM (This post was last modified: 06-08-2015 12:20 PM by jennybee.)
RE: View of the afterlife in Job
Here's what it says in my Bible Commentary (written by scholars): The Israelite afterlife was similar to beliefs found in Mesopotamia and Canaan. The belief was that once you died--you pass through a desert, mountains, river, and then down through seven gates of the netherworld. The belief at the time was that the sun (god) passed through the netherworld (on it's way to rise each day). [btw--this is consistent with Job 38:19 as God asks him, "What is the way to the dwelling of light, and darkness—where is its place?" i.e. The sun *goes* somewhere.] There were god(s) in the netherworld called Nergal and Ereshkigal. If you didn't go to this area when you died you would wander the earth as a spirit. Reference: The IVP Bible Commentary by Walton, Matthews, & Chavalas.

The OT was written during a time when the Israelites were making a transition from polytheism to monotheism. (This is why you see things like *let us* in the Tower of Babel passage and the golden calf incident.) It could very well be that Job was referring to the gods Nergal and Ereshkigal. This is just my speculation, however.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 7 users Like jennybee's post
06-08-2015, 11:30 AM
RE: View of the afterlife in Job
(06-08-2015 11:26 AM)jennybee Wrote:  Nergal and Ereshkigal

Those are some cool names right there. How do we end up with boring ol' "God" ? Weeping

We'll love you just the way you are
If you're perfect -- Alanis Morissette
(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 4 users Like morondog's post
06-08-2015, 11:32 AM
RE: View of the afterlife in Job
(06-08-2015 11:30 AM)morondog Wrote:  
(06-08-2015 11:26 AM)jennybee Wrote:  Nergal and Ereshkigal

Those are some cool names right there. How do we end up with boring ol' "God" ? Weeping

God damn it sounds kinda better than Ereshkigal damn it. Also it can be pronounced way more easily Wink

The first revolt is against the supreme tyranny of theology, of the phantom of God. As long as we have a master in heaven, we will be slaves on earth.

Mikhail Bakunin.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 4 users Like Szuchow's post
06-08-2015, 11:34 AM
RE: View of the afterlife in Job
Also, don't forget the Bible has been translated over and over again. Here is what Job 19:25-27 says in the Torah:

"But I know that my Redeemer lives, and the last on earth, He will endure.
And after my skin, they have cut into this, and from my flesh I see judgment.
That I see for myself, and my eyes have seen and not a stranger; my kidneys are consumed within me."
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes jennybee's post
06-08-2015, 11:39 AM
RE: View of the afterlife in Job
Possibly what Job was talking about re: judgment in passage:



Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
Post Reply
Forum Jump: