Viral Memetic Infection.
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11-02-2012, 05:15 AM
Viral Memetic Infection.
Can we redesign this Viral Idea structure to be used to combat the one already rooted in the Theists mind?

Concocting the ultimate viral idea
What might a powerful viral idea look like? In other words, what elements would an idea that's equipped for survival and impact have?

Lets make some guesses about this hypothetical idea:

Untestable but ultimate rewards for believing and following idea correctly.
Untestable but ultimate punishments for not believing in or not following idea correctly.
Punishment for believing in other contrary ideas.
All good things that happen are thanks to belief in idea.
All bad things that happen are from lack of faith in idea or are good things in disguise.
Idea supported in large body of interpretable literature containing some historical grounding.
Reward for taking idea without evidence.
Everything in the world is evidence for idea.
Reward for convincing others of idea and for having many children.
Open to all races, ages, and sexes.
Solutions to fear of death, lack of control, loneliness, powerlessness, and insignificance.
Reward for outward appearance of happiness.
Reward for funding idea.
Reward for dedicating everything to idea.

Sound familiar to anyone?

Any additions to make this bad boy even more infectious?

P@rTy R0Ck!
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11-02-2012, 12:16 PM
RE: Viral Memetic Infection.
Only by reversing evolution by about 250,000 years to when we first started dreaming this stuff up. We are the decendents of the survivors who passed on the virus. It's in our DNA.

The old gods are dead, let's invent some new ones before something really bad happens.
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12-02-2012, 10:16 AM
RE: Viral Memetic Infection.
(11-02-2012 12:16 PM)Thomas Wrote:  Only by reversing evolution by about 250,000 years to when we first started dreaming this stuff up. We are the decendents of the survivors who passed on the virus. It's in our DNA.

I'm confused. You believe indoctrination into a religion is hardwired in our DNA?

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12-02-2012, 11:50 AM
RE: Viral Memetic Infection.
(12-02-2012 10:16 AM)theKaktusKoolerKid Wrote:  
(11-02-2012 12:16 PM)Thomas Wrote:  Only by reversing evolution by about 250,000 years to when we first started dreaming this stuff up. We are the decendents of the survivors who passed on the virus. It's in our DNA.

I'm confused. You believe indoctrination into a religion is hardwired in our DNA?

Not indoctrination, but superstition does seem to be a part of our evolutionary make up. I think it was Michael Shermer who gives the example of Lucy hanging out on the Savannah 3 million years ago. She hears a bustle in the hedgerow and becomes alarmed now. Is it a predator? It's better to assume the noise is a predator and be wrong than to assume it's nothing and be eaten. This turns into superstition which then paves the way to belief in the supernatural. The other trait that comes from evolution is the need for the young to trust authority. Lucy's kid needs to know it's not good to eat red berries, touch fire, get eaten by a wildebeest. The kid doesn't know this without trusting the elder's authority. In later millenia, the parent tells the kid God is watching and because the kid knows the parent is always right, they believe too.

It was just a fucking apple man, we're sorry okay? Please stop the madness Laugh out load
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12-02-2012, 02:29 PM
RE: Viral Memetic Infection.
(12-02-2012 11:50 AM)Erxomai Wrote:  
(12-02-2012 10:16 AM)theKaktusKoolerKid Wrote:  
(11-02-2012 12:16 PM)Thomas Wrote:  Only by reversing evolution by about 250,000 years to when we first started dreaming this stuff up. We are the decendents of the survivors who passed on the virus. It's in our DNA.

I'm confused. You believe indoctrination into a religion is hardwired in our DNA?

Not indoctrination, but superstition does seem to be a part of our evolutionary make up. I think it was Michael Shermer who gives the example of Lucy hanging out on the Savannah 3 million years ago. She hears a bustle in the hedgerow and becomes alarmed now. Is it a predator? It's better to assume the noise is a predator and be wrong than to assume it's nothing and be eaten. This turns into superstition which then paves the way to belief in the supernatural. The other trait that comes from evolution is the need for the young to trust authority. Lucy's kid needs to know it's not good to eat red berries, touch fire, get eaten by a wildebeest. The kid doesn't know this without trusting the elder's authority. In later millenia, the parent tells the kid God is watching and because the kid knows the parent is always right, they believe too.

Yes, I kinda agree with that. The probability of survival when you treat every indicator as a possible threat allows for you to be more vigilant. But where I disagree is that it is not superstition/belief but a very primitive form of intuition. Intuition doesn't mean that you have a predisposition that you are born with a belief in a higher power or born to believe your parents. It's just an absorption of nurture within nature. Experience's of situations. To say that you are genetically encoded to believe or be superstitious is a little much, I would say we are genetically encoded to learn and then make the best decision on what we know and understand in the world. Intuition. Where religion becomes a problem is that it has a poor foundation on why to be moral so it is sometime inconceivable to think that the world won't go into chaos without a deities guidance because you didn't learn why it's wrong to kill, just that it is because god says. If you imagine a world without a god and you're entire moral reasoning is based around, because he said so, your world will crumble and you imagine a very very dark world. It teaches the right thing with the wrong reason, it removes the reason.

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12-02-2012, 02:35 PM
RE: Viral Memetic Infection.
(12-02-2012 02:29 PM)theKaktusKoolerKid Wrote:  
(12-02-2012 11:50 AM)Erxomai Wrote:  
(12-02-2012 10:16 AM)theKaktusKoolerKid Wrote:  
(11-02-2012 12:16 PM)Thomas Wrote:  Only by reversing evolution by about 250,000 years to when we first started dreaming this stuff up. We are the decendents of the survivors who passed on the virus. It's in our DNA.

I'm confused. You believe indoctrination into a religion is hardwired in our DNA?

Not indoctrination, but superstition does seem to be a part of our evolutionary make up. I think it was Michael Shermer who gives the example of Lucy hanging out on the Savannah 3 million years ago. She hears a bustle in the hedgerow and becomes alarmed now. Is it a predator? It's better to assume the noise is a predator and be wrong than to assume it's nothing and be eaten. This turns into superstition which then paves the way to belief in the supernatural. The other trait that comes from evolution is the need for the young to trust authority. Lucy's kid needs to know it's not good to eat red berries, touch fire, get eaten by a wildebeest. The kid doesn't know this without trusting the elder's authority. In later millenia, the parent tells the kid God is watching and because the kid knows the parent is always right, they believe too.

Yes, I kinda agree with that. The probability of survival when you treat every indicator as a possible threat allows for you to be more vigilant. But where I disagree is that it is not superstition/belief but a very primitive form of intuition. Intuition doesn't mean that you have a predisposition that you are born with a belief in a higher power or born to believe your parents. It's just an absorption of nurture within nature. Experience's of situations. To say that you are genetically encoded to believe or be superstitious is a little much, I would say we are genetically encoded to learn and then make the best decision on what we know and understand in the world. Intuition. Where religion becomes a problem is that it has a poor foundation on why to be moral so it is sometime inconceivable to think that the world won't go into chaos without a deities guidance because you didn't learn why it's wrong to kill, just that it is because god says. If you imagine a world without a god and you're entire moral reasoning is based around, because he said so, your world will crumble and you imagine a very very dark world. It teaches the right thing with the wrong reason, it removes the reason.

Dawkins had a good description of this (Read here, for example) mechanism and explicates it in a couple of his books.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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12-02-2012, 06:06 PM
RE: Viral Memetic Infection.
(12-02-2012 02:35 PM)Chas Wrote:  
(12-02-2012 02:29 PM)theKaktusKoolerKid Wrote:  
(12-02-2012 11:50 AM)Erxomai Wrote:  
(12-02-2012 10:16 AM)theKaktusKoolerKid Wrote:  
(11-02-2012 12:16 PM)Thomas Wrote:  Only by reversing evolution by about 250,000 years to when we first started dreaming this stuff up. We are the decendents of the survivors who passed on the virus. It's in our DNA.

I'm confused. You believe indoctrination into a religion is hardwired in our DNA?

Not indoctrination, but superstition does seem to be a part of our evolutionary make up. I think it was Michael Shermer who gives the example of Lucy hanging out on the Savannah 3 million years ago. She hears a bustle in the hedgerow and becomes alarmed now. Is it a predator? It's better to assume the noise is a predator and be wrong than to assume it's nothing and be eaten. This turns into superstition which then paves the way to belief in the supernatural. The other trait that comes from evolution is the need for the young to trust authority. Lucy's kid needs to know it's not good to eat red berries, touch fire, get eaten by a wildebeest. The kid doesn't know this without trusting the elder's authority. In later millenia, the parent tells the kid God is watching and because the kid knows the parent is always right, they believe too.

Yes, I kinda agree with that. The probability of survival when you treat every indicator as a possible threat allows for you to be more vigilant. But where I disagree is that it is not superstition/belief but a very primitive form of intuition. Intuition doesn't mean that you have a predisposition that you are born with a belief in a higher power or born to believe your parents. It's just an absorption of nurture within nature. Experience's of situations. To say that you are genetically encoded to believe or be superstitious is a little much, I would say we are genetically encoded to learn and then make the best decision on what we know and understand in the world. Intuition. Where religion becomes a problem is that it has a poor foundation on why to be moral so it is sometime inconceivable to think that the world won't go into chaos without a deities guidance because you didn't learn why it's wrong to kill, just that it is because god says. If you imagine a world without a god and you're entire moral reasoning is based around, because he said so, your world will crumble and you imagine a very very dark world. It teaches the right thing with the wrong reason, it removes the reason.

Dawkins had a good description of this (Read here, for example) mechanism and explicates it in a couple of his books.

Thanks

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