WTF Happened to the "Feminism" Movement?
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28-02-2016, 09:34 PM
RE: WTF Happened to the "Feminism" Movement?
(28-02-2016 09:28 PM)carol Wrote:  
(28-02-2016 09:17 PM)Unbeliever Wrote:  I'm talking specifically about the Tumblr crowd, not the actual feminist movement as a whole. Tumblr "feminism" is just bullying and misandry using the label of a politically-unimpeachable movement.

I don't deny that there are feminists who actually care about this issue. I don't even deny that they are doing everything they can. I'm just pointing out that the issues most people have with "feminism" today stem from the toxic, immature branch-culture that has co-opted the name.

I don't disagree with any of your points. I just assumed that the phrase "Tumblr feminist" was clearer than it apparently was.

I had to look at xanga, livejournal, and tumblr to understand just a little bit about what you were talking about. ( I googled them with feminism as a term) I found it depressing, because one of the strengths of the old feminist movement I had been involved with was the constant interaction, questioning and debating involved. That is essential for people who want to learn and grow. Without interaction and challenging assumptions, any movement can stagnate. I was saddened to read some very stupid posts. I agree with your opinion about the more childish and self involved posts I read.

However, (and this is not addressed to you, as you made your thoughts very clear) I also think that the idea of judging a movement based upon individual blogs may not be wise- how many of these people are actually contributing members in a group, doing something for human rights? Does the media itself attract shallow, narcissistic woman? Although a blog can be mildly interesting, it is also very boring, because it is the interaction between people that causes them to rethink old positions. Perhaps the serious thinkers are not always found in xanga,tumblr, and livejournal.

I've never even heard of Xanga Blink sounds like a board game. Nor live journal either. I don't think I want to either. No

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28-02-2016, 09:43 PM
RE: WTF Happened to the "Feminism" Movement?
(28-02-2016 09:34 PM)Heatheness Wrote:  
(28-02-2016 09:28 PM)carol Wrote:  I had to look at xanga, livejournal, and tumblr to understand just a little bit about what you were talking about. ( I googled them with feminism as a term) I found it depressing, because one of the strengths of the old feminist movement I had been involved with was the constant interaction, questioning and debating involved. That is essential for people who want to learn and grow. Without interaction and challenging assumptions, any movement can stagnate. I was saddened to read some very stupid posts. I agree with your opinion about the more childish and self involved posts I read.

However, (and this is not addressed to you, as you made your thoughts very clear) I also think that the idea of judging a movement based upon individual blogs may not be wise- how many of these people are actually contributing members in a group, doing something for human rights? Does the media itself attract shallow, narcissistic woman? Although a blog can be mildly interesting, it is also very boring, because it is the interaction between people that causes them to rethink old positions. Perhaps the serious thinkers are not always found in xanga,tumblr, and livejournal.

I've never even heard of Xanga Blink sounds like a board game. Nor live journal either. I don't think I want to either. No

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28-02-2016, 09:45 PM
RE: WTF Happened to the "Feminism" Movement?
(28-02-2016 09:22 PM)Heatheness Wrote:  Oh okay, sorry, I don't know what tumbler is either. Is that like a twitter thing, I don't do that either. Sadcryface I barely do FB.

Is it on the net or txt thing on your phone, some of this stuff I just have no interest in so I never looked it up. Sorry, I didn't get the relevance.

Tumblr is a free blogging platform that uses Twitter's hashtag system to organize its content. Any given post is tagged as the creator thinks appropriate, then broadcast across all blogs subscribed to that tag.

Because it's rather new, most of its users are millenials at the earliest - most commonly, entitled college or high school students who have never struggled for anything in their lives and don't actually understand the political issues they claim to be advocating. It has become fashionable for "feminist" Tumblr uses to be virulently anti-male, to the point that nearly all ostensibly-feminist posts there are also tagged #misandry.

The same site is also a huge hive of idiots blogging about supposed racism, oppression of transsexuals, and how "gender is an exploration". It's called "identity politics", but what it boils down to is that if you are white, male, cisgender, or (God help you) all of the above, you are instantly considered a rapist, racist, misogynist, and any number of other things besides, based solely on factors outside of your control. The Tumblr crowd's approach to politics is disturbingly similar to the Catholic church's idea of original sin - if you are part of a certain group, you are automatically unclean and can never be clean, and they are completely justified in treating you like dirt.

This is also where the concepts of "trigger warnings", "safe spaces", and so on come from; Tumblr users are notorious for diagnosing themselves with PTSD, depression, and the kitchen sink, then demanding that other users "check their privilege" and place a "trigger warning" on any content which might trigger a "relapse" into these horribly debilitating conditions. These "trigger warnings" can be demanded for anything from the sound of gunfire to (and I am not kidding here) being outside, and the backlash against anyone who does not bow to the hive mind and put these idiotic things in place is immense.

It's something worth looking into, because it's becoming a growing issue in western feminism (and other groups, such as Black Lives Matter). These are people who do not understand the politics involved, and simply use the issues as a means to bludgeon everyone around them into submission and put themselves in a position of power. People outside Tumblr have taken to calling it the "Oppression Olympics"; the most artificially-marginalized group is the only one whose opinion is valid. It's becoming increasingly problematic, and interfering with operations in universities across America.

If you're looking for a quick-and-easy repository of examples, you can check out TumblrInAction, which is a subforum on Reddit dedicated to compiling examples of Tumblr "feminism" and its idiocy. Starting with the top of all time might be a good way to go, but don't bother with the comments. TIA users aren't any more rational, as a rule, than anyone else.

(28-02-2016 09:28 PM)carol Wrote:  I had to look at xanga, livejournal, and tumblr to understand just a little bit about what you were talking about. ( I googled them with feminism as a term) I found it depressing, because one of the strengths of the old feminist movement I had been involved with was the constant interaction, questioning and debating involved. That is essential for people who want to learn and grow. Without interaction and challenging assumptions, any movement can stagnate. I was saddened to read some very stupid posts. I agree with your opinion about the more childish and self involved posts I read.

It's incredibly depressing, yes. Tumblr is an echo chamber. Most of the community simply echoes one another's thoughts, becoming progressively more insular and aggressive towards outsiders as time goes on. Actual constructive discussion is not tolerated.

(28-02-2016 09:28 PM)carol Wrote:  However, (and this is not addressed to you, as you made your thoughts very clear) I also think that the idea of judging a movement based upon individual blogs may not be wise- how many of these people are actually contributing members in a group, doing something for human rights? Does the media itself attract shallow, narcissistic woman? Although a blog can be mildly interesting, it is also very boring, because it is the interaction between people that causes them to rethink old positions. Perhaps the serious thinkers are not always found in xanga,tumblr, and livejournal.

They definitely aren't, which is why I make a point of differentiating between Tumblr "activists" and real ones, whatever the cause they are advocating.

"Owl," said Rabbit shortly, "you and I have brains. The others have fluff. If there is any thinking to be done in this Forest - and when I say thinking I mean thinking - you and I must do it."
- A. A. Milne, The House at Pooh Corner
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28-02-2016, 09:56 PM
RE: WTF Happened to the "Feminism" Movement?
(28-02-2016 09:45 PM)Unbeliever Wrote:  
(28-02-2016 09:22 PM)Heatheness Wrote:  Oh okay, sorry, I don't know what tumbler is either. Is that like a twitter thing, I don't do that either. Sadcryface I barely do FB.

Is it on the net or txt thing on your phone, some of this stuff I just have no interest in so I never looked it up. Sorry, I didn't get the relevance.

Tumblr is a free blogging platform that uses Twitter's hashtag system to organize its content. Any given post is tagged as the creator thinks appropriate, then broadcast across all blogs subscribed to that tag.

Because it's rather new, most of its users are millenials at the earliest - most commonly, entitled college or high school students who have never struggled for anything in their lives and don't actually understand the political issues they claim to be advocating. It has become fashionable for "feminist" Tumblr uses to be virulently anti-male, to the point that nearly all ostensibly-feminist posts there are also tagged #misandry.

The same site is also a huge hive of idiots blogging about supposed racism, oppression of transsexuals, and how "gender is an exploration". It's called "identity politics", but what it boils down to is that if you are white, male, cisgender, or (God help you) all of the above, you are instantly considered a rapist, racist, misogynist, and any number of other things besides, based solely on factors outside of your control. The Tumblr crowd's approach to politics is disturbingly similar to the Catholic church's idea of original sin - if you are part of a certain group, you are automatically unclean and can never be clean, and they are completely justified in treating you like dirt.

This is also where the concepts of "trigger warnings", "safe spaces", and so on come from; Tumblr users are notorious for diagnosing themselves with PTSD, depression, and the kitchen sink, then demanding that other users "check their privilege" and place a "trigger warning" on any content which might trigger a "relapse" into these horribly debilitating conditions. These "trigger warnings" can be demanded for anything from the sound of gunfire to (and I am not kidding here) being outside, and the backlash against anyone who does not bow to the hive mind and put these idiotic things in place is immense.

It's something worth looking into, because it's becoming a growing issue in western feminism (and other groups, such as Black Lives Matter). These are people who do not understand the politics involved, and simply use the issues as a means to bludgeon everyone around them into submission and put themselves in a position of power. People outside Tumblr have taken to calling it the "Oppression Olympics"; the most artificially-marginalized group is the only one whose opinion is valid. It's becoming increasingly problematic, and interfering with operations in universities across America.

If you're looking for a quick-and-easy repository of examples, you can check out TumblrInAction, which is a subforum on Reddit dedicated to compiling examples of Tumblr "feminism" and its idiocy. Starting with the top of all time might be a good way to go, but don't bother with the comments. TIA users aren't any more rational, as a rule, than anyone else.

(28-02-2016 09:28 PM)carol Wrote:  I had to look at xanga, livejournal, and tumblr to understand just a little bit about what you were talking about. ( I googled them with feminism as a term) I found it depressing, because one of the strengths of the old feminist movement I had been involved with was the constant interaction, questioning and debating involved. That is essential for people who want to learn and grow. Without interaction and challenging assumptions, any movement can stagnate. I was saddened to read some very stupid posts. I agree with your opinion about the more childish and self involved posts I read.

It's incredibly depressing, yes. Tumblr is an echo chamber. Most of the community simply echoes one another's thoughts, becoming progressively more insular and aggressive towards outsiders as time goes on. Actual constructive discussion is not tolerated.

(28-02-2016 09:28 PM)carol Wrote:  However, (and this is not addressed to you, as you made your thoughts very clear) I also think that the idea of judging a movement based upon individual blogs may not be wise- how many of these people are actually contributing members in a group, doing something for human rights? Does the media itself attract shallow, narcissistic woman? Although a blog can be mildly interesting, it is also very boring, because it is the interaction between people that causes them to rethink old positions. Perhaps the serious thinkers are not always found in xanga,tumblr, and livejournal.

They definitely aren't, which is why I make a point of differentiating between Tumblr "activists" and real ones, whatever the cause they are advocating.

JFC, it made me tired just to read what it's about let alone go there. My mind boggles at the prospect. Shocking No thanks. I have heard of Reddit but never been there either, I thought it was a blog spot, but as I said I barely can stand FB bitching let alone other formats. I think I'll be ignorant of this kind of social media.

But thanks for clearing up the "trigger warning" thing, I wondered where that came from (not to hurt anyone's feelings but I do not agree with the "post a trigger warning" stuff, so I avoid FB pages that use that format).

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28-02-2016, 10:04 PM
RE: WTF Happened to the "Feminism" Movement?
Another thing worth noting is that Tumblr feminism is, if not the origin of, then at least the thing that made "you cannot be sexist against men" a commonplace thing to say.

It is the Tumblr crowd's position that misandry does not exist (though they use the term "ironically" for any man-hating post), because America is a patriarchy, all women are oppressed, and you cannot be sexist towards someone who is oppressing you. In the same way, they argue that you cannot be racist against white people, and many other similar things besides.

Yes, it is exactly as stupid as it sounds. What makes it worrying is that the idea is gaining traction; most Tumblr users are of the age where they are just gaining the ability to vote, as well as gaining access to various areas where they can spread their toxicity to many more people. This is what I was talking about when I mentioned that it's beginning to interfere with universities; as colleges are hot spots for Tumblrite populations, a lot of colleges across the country are currently running into issues in dealing with students trying to force these ideas onto others.

As an example, the University of Missouri is currently - or was recently, at least, I'm not sure on if the issue has been resolved yet - dealing with a series of strikes by black students and organizations, which have made several demands of the staff.

These demands include: the immediate dismissal of the college president, with all future presidents being selected by "a collective of students, staff, and faculty of diverse backgrounds"; that all students, faculty, and staff be put through mandatory "diversity training", which must be "vetted, maintained, and overseen by a board comprised of students, staff and faculty of color"; that the university increase the number of non-white staff members working on its campus by ten percent; and that the university must increase "funding, resources and personnel for the social justice centers on campus for the purpose of hiring additional professionals, particularly those of color, boosting outreach and programming across campus and increasing campus-wide awareness and visibility". You can read the full list of demands here.

Students at a New York private university are demanding that Yik Yak (basically Twitter under a different name) be "geofenced" (READ: censored and made inaccessible while on university grounds) away from the campus, because Yik Yak is anonymous and thus enables racism. Another student, Emma Sulkowicz of Columbia University, accused another student of raping her (he was later demonstrated innocent), and engaged in a multi-year piece of "performance art" she entitled "Carry That Weight", wherein she strapped the mattress she was allegedly raped on to her back and carried it everywhere on campus, ostensibly to protest the fact that her "rapist" was still walking around free. Tumblr feminist crowds are, of course, hailing this extended slander of an innocent as incredibly brave, and anyone who disagrees is labeled as a rapist themselves.

It's... getting very worrying. And it's something that American politics as a whole, not just feminism specifically, are really going to have to deal with in the coming years.

"Owl," said Rabbit shortly, "you and I have brains. The others have fluff. If there is any thinking to be done in this Forest - and when I say thinking I mean thinking - you and I must do it."
- A. A. Milne, The House at Pooh Corner
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28-02-2016, 10:12 PM
RE: WTF Happened to the "Feminism" Movement?
(28-02-2016 10:04 PM)Unbeliever Wrote:  Another thing worth noting is that Tumblr feminism is, if not the origin of, then at least the thing that made "you cannot be sexist against men" a commonplace thing to say.

It is the Tumblr crowd's position that misandry does not exist (though they use the term "ironically" for any man-hating post), because America is a patriarchy, all women are oppressed, and you cannot be sexist towards someone who is oppressing you. In the same way, they argue that you cannot be racist against white people, and many other similar things besides.

Yes, it is exactly as stupid as it sounds. What makes it worrying is that the idea is gaining traction; most Tumblr users are of the age where they are just gaining the ability to vote, as well as gaining access to various areas where they can spread their toxicity to many more people. This is what I was talking about when I mentioned that it's beginning to interfere with universities; as colleges are hot spots for Tumblrite populations, a lot of colleges across the country are currently running into issues in dealing with students trying to force these ideas onto others.

As an example, the University of Missouri is currently - or was recently, at least, I'm not sure on if the issue has been resolved yet - dealing with a series of strikes by black students and organizations, which have made several demands of the staff.

These demands include: the immediate dismissal of the college president, with all future presidents being selected by "a collective of students, staff, and faculty of diverse backgrounds"; that all students, faculty, and staff be put through mandatory "diversity training", which must be "vetted, maintained, and overseen by a board comprised of students, staff and faculty of color"; that the university increase the number of non-white staff members working on its campus by ten percent; and that the university must increase "funding, resources and personnel for the social justice centers on campus for the purpose of hiring additional professionals, particularly those of color, boosting outreach and programming across campus and increasing campus-wide awareness and visibility". You can read the full list of demands here.

Students at a New York private university are demanding that Yik Yak (basically Twitter under a different name) be "geofenced" (READ: censored and made inaccessible while on university grounds) away from the campus, because Yik Yak is anonymous and thus enables racism. Another student, Emma Sulkowicz of Columbia University, accused another student of raping her (he was later demonstrated innocent), and engaged in a multi-year piece of "performance art" she entitled "Carry That Weight", wherein she strapped the mattress she was allegedly raped on to her back and carried it everywhere on campus, ostensibly to protest the fact that her "rapist" was still walking around free. Tumblr feminist crowds are, of course, hailing this extended slander of an innocent as incredibly brave, and anyone who disagrees is labeled as a rapist themselves.

It's... getting very worrying. And it's something that American politics as a whole, not just feminism specifically, are really going to have to deal with in the coming years.

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28-02-2016, 10:25 PM
RE: WTF Happened to the "Feminism" Movement?
(28-02-2016 10:04 PM)Unbeliever Wrote:  Another thing worth noting is that Tumblr feminism is, if not the origin of, then at least the thing that made "you cannot be sexist against men" a commonplace thing to say.

It is the Tumblr crowd's position that misandry does not exist (though they use the term "ironically" for any man-hating post), because America is a patriarchy, all women are oppressed, and you cannot be sexist towards someone who is oppressing you. In the same way, they argue that you cannot be racist against white people, and many other similar things besides.

Yes, it is exactly as stupid as it sounds. What makes it worrying is that the idea is gaining traction; most Tumblr users are of the age where they are just gaining the ability to vote, as well as gaining access to various areas where they can spread their toxicity to many more people. This is what I was talking about when I mentioned that it's beginning to interfere with universities; as colleges are hot spots for Tumblrite populations, a lot of colleges across the country are currently running into issues in dealing with students trying to force these ideas onto others.

As an example, the University of Missouri is currently - or was recently, at least, I'm not sure on if the issue has been resolved yet - dealing with a series of strikes by black students and organizations, which have made several demands of the staff.

These demands include: the immediate dismissal of the college president, with all future presidents being selected by "a collective of students, staff, and faculty of diverse backgrounds"; that all students, faculty, and staff be put through mandatory "diversity training", which must be "vetted, maintained, and overseen by a board comprised of students, staff and faculty of color"; that the university increase the number of non-white staff members working on its campus by ten percent; and that the university must increase "funding, resources and personnel for the social justice centers on campus for the purpose of hiring additional professionals, particularly those of color, boosting outreach and programming across campus and increasing campus-wide awareness and visibility". You can read the full list of demands here.

Students at a New York private university are demanding that Yik Yak (basically Twitter under a different name) be "geofenced" (READ: censored and made inaccessible while on university grounds) away from the campus, because Yik Yak is anonymous and thus enables racism. Another student, Emma Sulkowicz of Columbia University, accused another student of raping her (he was later demonstrated innocent), and engaged in a multi-year piece of "performance art" she entitled "Carry That Weight", wherein she strapped the mattress she was allegedly raped on to her back and carried it everywhere on campus, ostensibly to protest the fact that her "rapist" was still walking around free. Tumblr feminist crowds are, of course, hailing this extended slander of an innocent as incredibly brave, and anyone who disagrees is labeled as a rapist themselves.

It's... getting very worrying. And it's something that American politics as a whole, not just feminism specifically, are really going to have to deal with in the coming years.

Well, racism, sexism, are not things directed at a single specific thing but at a race or sex that is specific target, whether it a race or gender you share or not. I have men friends that are the absolute best feminists and I also know women (many repubs) that are terrible sexists towards their own gender. Which drives me insane to see women vote against their own best interests. But you can be sexist to men, in fact, denying that you can be sexist to men is actually being sexist to men. And though I'm white as paste I grew up in Kansas City in a greatly diverse community and have seen and heard much racism towards every race by every race.

People will be stupid and it seems the most stupid are also the loudest about it. I have no purchase for them and I certainly do not need anymore stupid people in my life. I'm glad I know nothing of this place. Thx for the heads up.

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28-02-2016, 10:26 PM
RE: WTF Happened to the "Feminism" Movement?
Edit. Nvm.
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28-02-2016, 10:30 PM
RE: WTF Happened to the "Feminism" Movement?
(28-02-2016 09:28 PM)carol Wrote:  Although a blog can be mildly interesting, it is also very boring, because it is the interaction between people that causes them to rethink old positions.

I disagree with that, blogging can be a wonderful way to get your message across and start an important discussion. In many cases your not simply spouting off your opinion, your also engaging in a conversation. Very often a single interesting topic can be picked up by many bloggers all bringing different ideas to the table. The bloggers will often form communities, when they post on a similar topic.

It can be like here with exchanging ideas and sharing information.


But as if to knock me down, reality came around
And without so much as a mere touch, cut me into little pieces

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28-02-2016, 10:34 PM
RE: WTF Happened to the "Feminism" Movement?
What's a blog?

NOTE: Member, Tomasia uses this site to slander other individuals. He then later proclaims it a joke, but not in public.
I will call him a liar and a dog here and now.
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