Was 9/11 an inside job?
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25-02-2014, 09:30 AM
RE: Was 9/11 an inside job?
(25-02-2014 09:29 AM)cjlr Wrote:  
(25-02-2014 09:26 AM)Revenant77x Wrote:  Having a country play policeman/babysitter to the world whether they want it or not...

In theory that's what the UN is for.

In theory.

Thus why we are having this discussion.

(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  America is full of guns, but they're useless, because nobody has the courage to shoot an IRS agent in self-defense
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25-02-2014, 10:09 AM
RE: Was 9/11 an inside job?
(25-02-2014 09:30 AM)Revenant77x Wrote:  
(25-02-2014 09:29 AM)cjlr Wrote:  In theory that's what the UN is for.

In theory.

Thus why we are having this discussion.

... are you saying the UN did 9/11?

... this is my signature!
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25-02-2014, 10:11 AM
RE: Was 9/11 an inside job?
(25-02-2014 10:09 AM)cjlr Wrote:  
(25-02-2014 09:30 AM)Revenant77x Wrote:  Thus why we are having this discussion.

... are you saying the UN did 9/11?

Not bloody likely - they almost never agree on anything. Dodgy

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25-02-2014, 10:11 AM
RE: Was 9/11 an inside job?
(25-02-2014 10:09 AM)cjlr Wrote:  
(25-02-2014 09:30 AM)Revenant77x Wrote:  Thus why we are having this discussion.

... are you saying the UN did 9/11?

Not at all, I am saying the UN is generally as useful as tits on a bull. Unless NATO backs up a resolution it is worth less than the paper it is printed on.

(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  America is full of guns, but they're useless, because nobody has the courage to shoot an IRS agent in self-defense
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25-02-2014, 10:13 AM
RE: Was 9/11 an inside job?
(25-02-2014 09:29 AM)cjlr Wrote:  
(25-02-2014 09:26 AM)Revenant77x Wrote:  Having a country play policeman/babysitter to the world whether they want it or not...

In theory that's what the UN is for.

In theory.

The practice works in theory, but in practice the theory doesn't work. Drinking Beverage

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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25-02-2014, 01:18 PM
RE: Was 9/11 an inside job?
(25-02-2014 09:26 AM)Revenant77x Wrote:  
(25-02-2014 09:05 AM)morondog Wrote:  If you guys were doing it for the ostensible aims of promoting freedom etc. You know, the hippie shit that all the politicians like to talk about when war-mongering... then I could see a case for it. But... your leaders have not shown themselves to be the upstanding types that would be required to fulfill such a role... hence... we no likey. On the plus side, you and the rest of the powers like Europe telling people off a bit is all that stands between civilization and some seriously tribal shit going down in many parts of the world.

Which is the greater Evil? Having a country play policeman/babysitter to the world whether they want it or not or letting large portions of the world descend into anarchy while those that have the means to end the fighting do nothing?

If you really were playing policeman I'd say go ahead, but from what I see it's more protecting American interests than staving off anarchy or making everyone play nice. You guys surely ain't lily white. No one is. Fortunately *sometimes* stuff does work out OK and yes indeedy, there is a little more freedom and a little less oppression in some places thanks to you guys...

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(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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25-02-2014, 01:36 PM
RE: Was 9/11 an inside job?
(25-02-2014 01:18 PM)morondog Wrote:  
(25-02-2014 09:26 AM)Revenant77x Wrote:  Which is the greater Evil? Having a country play policeman/babysitter to the world whether they want it or not or letting large portions of the world descend into anarchy while those that have the means to end the fighting do nothing?

If you really were playing policeman I'd say go ahead, but from what I see it's more protecting American interests than staving off anarchy or making everyone play nice. You guys surely ain't lily white. No one is. Fortunately *sometimes* stuff does work out OK and yes indeedy, there is a little more freedom and a little less oppression in some places thanks to you guys...

I was presenting a hypothetical rather than making a claim that reality is in anyway reflective of that statement. The US is incredibly self-centered (though for national policy it is not necessarily a bad thing to prefer your own gains at the expense of other countries) and yes our enforcement of any form of international law tends to be where our interests are (Oil production being the biggest) but really we are just the new boss same as the old boss. It was not very different under the European Empires except they tended to be handled internally and a bit more brutally.

However America generally opposes Anarchy simply because it is bad for business. Also before everyone completely jags off on the America is a bully and mean blah blah blah remember we are feeding half the world. If America were to go 100% isolationist tomorrow it would be chaos, billions would starve. No we are not lily white but we are doing more for world peace than any one else right now.

(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  America is full of guns, but they're useless, because nobody has the courage to shoot an IRS agent in self-defense
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25-02-2014, 01:55 PM
RE: Was 9/11 an inside job?
Fair enough. I'm mostly pro-Merkins anyway. Was just responding to BnW's point about who says you can be the world's policeman... Certainly not denying that you guys do do a lot of good in the world, quite a fair amount in Africa, for which you are rewarded with not a lot...

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(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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26-02-2014, 09:01 PM
RE: Was 9/11 an inside job?
(25-02-2014 09:26 AM)Revenant77x Wrote:  Which is the greater Evil? Having a country play policeman/babysitter to the world whether they want it or not or letting large portions of the world descend into anarchy while those that have the means to end the fighting do nothing?

I think the problem with that question is it is built upon a false premise. It would be one thing if the US sat on its perch, scanning the world for evil, and showed up and saved the day like some kind of super hero. But, that's not how it works. We pick and choose where we will get involved based solely on our own interests. We talk about human rights and send troops into places like Iraq but go have a destablizing civil war or dictator in a part of the world that doesn't produce oil and see if the Marines swim up on your shores. Here's a hint - they won't.

The US has supported some very nasty governments. The Saudis are some of our best friends and they are all also major violators of women's rights. Mubarak in Egypt was a good friend of the US. He was also a tryant. We are not all that stands between the anarchy and stability. Politics and oil are a factor in everything we do. And, some of the politics in play is to ensure that whenever there is a problem, we are first on scene to decide if we want the case or not. For some reason, since the end of WWII, butting into other people's business has become a requirement for sustaining our massive global military presence.

It's time to pull back to our more xenophobic roots. Let someone else play traffic cop to the world. And, while we are at it, let someone else host the UN. Bunch of ungrateful freeloaders who double park all over the fucking east side of Manhatten and you can't even give them a ticket. Last time I was over there I saw some asshole with diplomatic plates parked in front of fire hydrant. The cops may not be able to give him a ticket or tow him, but they also didn't seem to mind when I keyed his door.

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