Was my response to theist too harsh?
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24-04-2016, 05:47 AM
RE: Was my response to theist too harsh?
(24-04-2016 04:53 AM)Tomasia Wrote:  
(23-04-2016 07:02 AM)Chas Wrote:  Those are entirely unrelated issues.

Consistency question number 2:

Do we know whether infants are able to contemplate their existence, where they can from, unlike other animals for whom we claim don't know?

You stupid fuck. I already told you, children do not form a theory of mind until around age 4; and we know this because we can and have tested it. Chimpanzees and Gorillas who are taught sign language, never use it to ask us questions. Infants, much like our great ape cousins, are incapable of conceptualizing minds (with access to information they lack) outside of their own. Therefore they cannot conceptualize anything that would come close to a definition of 'god', which are all at the very least seen as beings outside of the self. Unless you want to define 'god' as 'yourself', infants are incapable of conceptualizing it.

And defining 'god' as the 'self' is a meaningless definition for a 'god', reducing it to a mere synonym. Congrats.

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24-04-2016, 05:49 AM
RE: Was my response to theist too harsh?
(24-04-2016 05:47 AM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  
(24-04-2016 04:53 AM)Tomasia Wrote:  Consistency question number 2:

Do we know whether infants are able to contemplate their existence, where they can from, unlike other animals for whom we claim don't know?

You stupid fuck. I already told you, children do not form a theory of mind until around age 4; and we know this because we can and have tested it. Chimpanzees and Gorillas who are taught sign language, never use it to ask us questions. Infants, much like our great ape cousins, are incapable of conceptualizing minds (with access to information they lack) outside of their own. Therefore they cannot conceptualize anything that would come close to a definition of 'god', which are all at the very least seen as beings outside of the self. Unless you want to define 'god' as 'yourself', infants are incapable of conceptualizing it.

And defining 'god' as the 'self' is a meaningless definition for a 'god', reducing it to a mere synonym. Congrats.

At 4 I became an atheist. Smile

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24-04-2016, 05:52 AM
RE: Was my response to theist too harsh?
(22-04-2016 01:16 PM)SitaSky Wrote:  I don't think your response was harsh at all, it's simply the truth. If a child born in India get's brought up thinking that Krishna is real and Brahma is the creator of all existence and a child born in the US is raised to believe Jesus is real and Yahweh created everything how is that any different? Clearly both babies had to be told what to believe at some point, they weren't born that way seeking their God.

What may sound harsh to theists is saying something like "You know Heaven isn't real, there's no reason to believe we go anywhere after our brains die so you'll never see your dearly departed loved ones ever again." Something like that is is still true but it's more emotional for them and also unnecessary, a belief in an afterlife isn't necessarily tied to a religion or a God belief and they are often intertwined but once it comes down to the question of God then simply stating "There is no God." isn't any more harsh than saying "There is a God." Also indoctrination is a real thing, there is no debating that, children and even adults need to be told what this God is and how much he loves you to truly believe in it, we are not born just believing it.
Indoctrination is a real thing, but it is not the sole reason or any reason whatsoever for the Faith of some.
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24-04-2016, 05:57 AM
RE: Was my response to theist too harsh?
(24-04-2016 05:46 AM)popsthebuilder Wrote:  
(22-04-2016 08:57 AM)Commonsensei Wrote:  First line of the link.

"Do chimpanzees engage in religious behaviors? To date this question remains unanswered."

Signs of morning or repeating practices in the more intuitive species such as Elephants or Chimps, and the like don't have any baring if they believe in a god or not. Nor do I feel it can be used to say they have a religious practice.

If so dose the salmon returning to it's nesting ground every year only to die a religious practice? Migration of sea turtles, birds and the like are these due to a "higher power" guiding them or is it part of their nature?
Both.

Why do people always assume that nature and the course there of isn't the product of a creative force?


You win pops. Let's instead assume it's all creative.

So what now? Where are all of the Ice Fairies who go around creating all of the icicles and snow flakes? Please point us to the Earth Golem who raised up the great Rockies, or the Water Djinn that carved out the Grand Canyon! Could you pick out of a lineup the particular extraterrestrial alien species that experiment on our ape ancestors and created homo sapiens?


If we're going to assume a creative force, why should your 'god' get the credit? Drinking Beverage

Stupid cunt...

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24-04-2016, 06:08 AM (This post was last modified: 24-04-2016 06:11 AM by Tomasia.)
RE: Was my response to theist too harsh?
(24-04-2016 05:47 AM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  Chimpanzees and Gorillas who are taught sign language, never use it to ask us questions.

I don't recall what you told me, after awhile the various posters start to blur. So i'll have you clarify your position, to see if it's different than the ones other atheists here have expressed.

Consistency question #3:

So in your view chimpanzee and Gorillas, are not able to contemplate their origin, and where they came from? Unlike other atheists here who suggested we don't know one way or the other whether they do or not. And you base this on the fact that even after learning sign language they haven't formed such questions with it?

Do you believe that human beings are the only animal, able to contemplate such questions? That we're unique in this regard?

Quote:I already told you, children do not form a theory of mind until around age 4

Actually, it's been observed in children a few months of age:

http://www.livescience.com/10924-7-month...oints.html

"Tell me, muse, of the storyteller who has been thrust to the edge of the world, both an infant and an ancient, and through him reveal everyman." ---Homer the aged poet.

"In Him was life, and the life was the Light of men. The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it."
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24-04-2016, 06:12 AM
RE: Was my response to theist too harsh?
(24-04-2016 05:37 AM)Banjo Wrote:  
(24-04-2016 05:35 AM)Tomasia Wrote:  Why would we assume it was created?

To assume is to make an ass out of u and me.

Ok.

"Tell me, muse, of the storyteller who has been thrust to the edge of the world, both an infant and an ancient, and through him reveal everyman." ---Homer the aged poet.

"In Him was life, and the life was the Light of men. The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it."
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24-04-2016, 06:13 AM
RE: Was my response to theist too harsh?
(24-04-2016 06:08 AM)Tomasia Wrote:  
(24-04-2016 05:47 AM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  Chimpanzees and Gorillas who are taught sign language, never use it to ask us questions.

I don't recall what you told me, after awhile the various posters start to blur. So i'll have you clarify your position, to see if it's different than the ones other atheists here have expressed.

Consistency question #3:

So in your view chimpanzee and Gorillas, are not able to contemplate their origin, and where they came from? Unlike other atheists here who suggested we don't know one way or the other whether they do or not. And you base this on the fact that even after learning sign language they haven't formed such questions with it?

Do you believe that human beings are the only animal, able to contemplate such questions? That we're unique in this regard?

Quote:I already told you, children do not form a theory of mind until around age 4

Actually, it's been observed in children a few months of age:

http://www.livescience.com/10924-7-month...oints.html

Er, the posts exist. Go back and read them.

Not very bright, are you? I have chemo brain. What's your excuse?

NOTE: Member, Tomasia uses this site to slander other individuals. He then later proclaims it a joke, but not in public.
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24-04-2016, 06:14 AM
RE: Was my response to theist too harsh?
(24-04-2016 06:12 AM)Tomasia Wrote:  
(24-04-2016 05:37 AM)Banjo Wrote:  To assume is to make an ass out of u and me.

Ok.

Not a great or even good answer. All you have done is proven you have nothing.

NOTE: Member, Tomasia uses this site to slander other individuals. He then later proclaims it a joke, but not in public.
I will call him a liar and a dog here and now.
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24-04-2016, 06:29 AM
RE: Was my response to theist too harsh?
(24-04-2016 06:14 AM)Banjo Wrote:  
(24-04-2016 06:12 AM)Tomasia Wrote:  Ok.

Not a great or even good answer. All you have done is proven you have nothing.

I didn't even know there was a question in there.

"Tell me, muse, of the storyteller who has been thrust to the edge of the world, both an infant and an ancient, and through him reveal everyman." ---Homer the aged poet.

"In Him was life, and the life was the Light of men. The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it."
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24-04-2016, 06:30 AM
RE: Was my response to theist too harsh?
(24-04-2016 06:29 AM)Tomasia Wrote:  
(24-04-2016 06:14 AM)Banjo Wrote:  Not a great or even good answer. All you have done is proven you have nothing.

I didn't even know there was a question in there.

Facepalm

NOTE: Member, Tomasia uses this site to slander other individuals. He then later proclaims it a joke, but not in public.
I will call him a liar and a dog here and now.
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