Was my response to theist too harsh?
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23-04-2016, 07:02 AM
RE: Was my response to theist too harsh?
(22-04-2016 05:02 AM)Tomasia Wrote:  
(22-04-2016 01:53 AM)Silly Deity Wrote:  You are absolutely spot on.

As Richard Dawkins says, "Would you ever speak of a baby's political beliefs? Hannah is a socialist baby, Mark a conservative. Who would ever dream of saying such a thing? What would you say if you read a demographic article which said something like this: “One in every three children born today is a Kantian Neo-platonist child. If the birth rate trends continue, Existentialist Positivists will be outnumbered by 2030.” Never mind the nonsensical names of philosophical schools of thought just invented. I deliberately chose surreal names so as not to distract from the real point. Religion is the one exception we all make to the rule: don’t label children with the opinions of their parents."

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It's funny that the type of folks here who argued that we don't know whether other animals have contemplated their existence, where they came from, seem to confidently assert that infants lack a belief.

Those are entirely unrelated issues.

Quote:Shouldn't we just be lacking a belief as to whether they do or do not believe in God/s, for the sake of being consistent.

No. What knowledge do you think a newborn baby has?

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Science is not a subject, but a method.
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23-04-2016, 07:08 AM
RE: Was my response to theist too harsh?
(22-04-2016 04:00 PM)WeAreTheCosmos Wrote:  
(22-04-2016 03:49 PM)Alla Wrote:  Yes, I believe you are wrong. Children are neither believers nor atheists.

Technically if you lack belief, you're an atheist. So if babies aren't theist, they are necessarily atheist.

Oh Cosmos, silly, silly Cosmos. Expecting Alla to understand what words actually mean? She hasn't learned a single thing in her time here. Correct her definitions, and she'll be back next week entirely oblivious to how wrong she is. She never learns.

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23-04-2016, 07:09 AM
RE: Was my response to theist too harsh?
(22-04-2016 03:49 PM)Alla Wrote:  
(22-04-2016 01:01 AM)stcomza Wrote:  So, last night I got blasted by a very religious old lady for saying that children are born atheists.
Am I wrong? Dodgy

Yes, I believe you are wrong. Children are neither believers nor atheists.

You are quite wrong. If one is not a believer, one is an atheist.

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23-04-2016, 01:26 PM
RE: Was my response to theist too harsh?
(22-04-2016 04:27 PM)Alla Wrote:  
(22-04-2016 04:00 PM)WeAreTheCosmos Wrote:  Technically if you lack belief, you're an atheist. So if babies aren't theist, they are necessarily atheist.
If you lack of unbelief in God/gods you are not an atheist. Let me know if I am wrong.
Who taught you English a fuckin' toaster? You're wrong cause that sentence doesn't make grammatical sense in English.

If you do not have a belief in god you are an atheist under the definition of both atheism and theism. Your just fucking wrong Alla, as per usual.

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23-04-2016, 01:41 PM
RE: Was my response to theist too harsh?
(23-04-2016 07:09 AM)Chas Wrote:  You are quite wrong. If one is not a believer, one is an atheist.
prove that an infant is an atheist and not agnostic.
give me a name of an infant who ever said this: I REJECT a belief that there is God/gods. Then I will admit that I am wrong.

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23-04-2016, 01:43 PM
RE: Was my response to theist too harsh?
(23-04-2016 01:26 PM)WhiskeyDebates Wrote:  Who taught you English a fuckin' toaster? You're wrong cause that sentence doesn't make grammatical sense in English.

If you do not have a belief in god you are an atheist under the definition of both atheism and theism. Your just fucking wrong Alla, as per usual.

your Russian and Ukrainian are worse than my English

Adios, amigo! Kiss

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23-04-2016, 03:30 PM
RE: Was my response to theist too harsh?
(23-04-2016 01:41 PM)Alla Wrote:  
(23-04-2016 07:09 AM)Chas Wrote:  You are quite wrong. If one is not a believer, one is an atheist.
prove that an infant is an atheist and not agnostic.
give me a name of an infant who ever said this: I REJECT a belief that there is God/gods. Then I will admit that I am wrong.

The better question is can a baby truly believe in God or your God for example? If they are not able to than they are not a theist. You make a clear case on this forum that believers have to follow God's laws because you've made a covenant with him, can a baby do this? Can a baby decide that this is a good God, read the Bible, pray about it and then decide to follow this religious path? If a baby is not able to do this than they are automatically not able to be a theist in any real or true sense. It's like a bucket filled with water, if it's filled up we can call it a "water bucket" if it's empty it's just a "bucket". A human filled with faith and religious dogma is a theist, a human that lacks faith and religious belief is an atheist. The baby hasn't been filled with faith yet, he lacks it so they can only be an atheist.

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23-04-2016, 03:45 PM
RE: Was my response to theist too harsh?
(23-04-2016 03:30 PM)SitaSky Wrote:  The better question is can a baby truly believe in God or your God for example? If they are not able to than they are not a theist.
If they are not able to believe in god/gods then they are not theists. I think I said this; they are not theists.
(23-04-2016 03:30 PM)SitaSky Wrote:  You make a clear case on this forum that believers have to follow God's laws because you've made a covenant with him, can a baby do this?
It doesn't matter. Babies do not have to have faith, they do not have to repent, they do not have to make covenants.
God KNOWS that babies are NOT capable of doing this. Those who are NOT capable are not asked to do what they can not do.
Any human who dies as a baby/infant will end up in heaven.
(23-04-2016 03:30 PM)SitaSky Wrote:  Can a baby decide that this is a good God, read the Bible, pray about it and then decide to follow this religious path? If a baby is not able to do this than they are automatically not able to be a theist in any real or true sense. It's like a bucket filled with water, if it's filled up we can call it a "water bucket" if it's empty it's just a "bucket". A human filled with faith and religious dogma is a theist, a human that lacks faith and religious belief is an atheist. The baby hasn't been filled with faith yet, he lacks it so they can only be an atheist.
I thought I said that babies are NOT theists.
Are they atheists then? Can they REJECT belief in god/gods? You tell me, please.
Are they agnostics?
Another question: what difference does it make?

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23-04-2016, 03:52 PM
RE: Was my response to theist too harsh?
(23-04-2016 03:30 PM)SitaSky Wrote:  Can a baby decide that this is a good God, read the Bible, pray about it and then decide to follow this religious path? If a baby is not able to do this than they are automatically not able to be a theist in any real or true sense. It's like a bucket filled with water, if it's filled up we can call it a "water bucket" if it's empty it's just a "bucket". A human filled with faith and religious dogma is a theist, a human that lacks faith and religious belief is an atheist. The baby hasn't been filled with faith yet, he lacks it so they can only be an atheist.
(23-04-2016 03:50 PM)Alla Wrote:  I thought I said that babies are NOT theists.
Are they atheists then? Can they REJECT belief in god/gods? You tell me, please.
Are they agnostics?
Another question: what difference does it make?

If they are not theists, they are the opposite which is an athiest. This is simple English here. Atheism isn't a "rejection" of the God claim, it's a lack of belief in God/Gods, that's it. Here is the definition:

a·the·ism
ˈāTHēˌizəm/
noun:
disbelief or lack of belief in the existence of God or gods.

If a baby lacks a belief in a God and is not a theist as you have pointed out yourself they are automatically an atheist. Until they become a theist and have a belief in a God they will remain an atheist, if they decide they are not sure they are agnostic but they have to learn about the God Claim to begin with so a baby can't make that choice, they are still lacking the belief. You are thinking someone needs to willfully reject the idea of a God to be an atheist, this is not the case, it's simply not believing there is a God and baby can't willfully believe there is one...I'm repeating myself it's just as simple as atheism is the opposite of theism, a baby can't be a theist, there's only one thing for them to be which is the opposite.

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23-04-2016, 04:21 PM
RE: Was my response to theist too harsh?
(23-04-2016 03:52 PM)SitaSky Wrote:  If they are not theists, they are the opposite which is an athiest.
OK, but at least admit that they have NO IDEA that they are atheists. They don't even know what a heck is that.

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