"Well. So-and-So Was An Atheist!"
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28-01-2014, 08:59 PM
RE: "Well. So-and-So Was An Atheist!"
(28-01-2014 06:32 PM)Phil Hill Wrote:  I'm aware of that and many more quotes but just like most politicians whatever he said in public might just be to garner public opinion. For that reason I tend to avoid using his public quotes.
In his work "Mein Kampf", a book that Hitler wrote while he was in prison about a decade prior to becoming the Leader and Reich Chancellor of Germany, you can find numerous quotes that attest to his religiosity. I once searched for all of them per request and posted them here.

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28-01-2014, 09:03 PM
RE: "Well. So-and-So Was An Atheist!"
(28-01-2014 08:35 PM)WindyCityJazz Wrote:  One of the things that comes with religion is that even if it's not the main reason a war started, there have certainly been leaders who justified their actions with a "Well, these people aren't Christians, so that makes my war on them to be just!",

Did you know there was some fucker who invented a gun that shot two types of bullets? Spherical bullets for Christian targets and cubes for non-Christians, because they'd hurt more. Luckily, the chuckle-fuck's design was scrapped for not being practical.

http://www.cracked.com/article_19233_the...built.html

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28-01-2014, 09:09 PM
RE: "Well. So-and-So Was An Atheist!"
(28-01-2014 09:03 PM)RobbyPants Wrote:  Did you know there was some fucker who invented a gun that shot two types of bullets? Spherical bullets for Christian targets and cubes for non-Christians, because they'd hurt more. Luckily, the chuckle-fuck's design was scrapped for not being practical.

http://www.cracked.com/article_19233_the...built.html

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HAHAHAHA! I laughed my ass off at that one!

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28-01-2014, 09:16 PM
RE: "Well. So-and-So Was An Atheist!"
(28-01-2014 06:02 PM)Phil Hill Wrote:  
(28-01-2014 05:42 PM)WindyCityJazz Wrote:  We've all heard this one before right? You point out all the people that have been murdered in the name of God, and they turn around and say "Well, Stalin (or any other name) was an atheist, so that proves you atheists are evil!"

The problem with that defense is that Stalin didn't kill people in the name of atheism, so whether or not he was atheist is as relevant as whether or not he liked pizza.

How about the Hitler was an atheist and evolution led to the Holocaust. Only Hitler was born, raised and died a member of the RCC which he never renounced or was excommunicated from. And he banned Darwin's books from Germany. But I enjoy when Christians use this argument then get all twisted by cognitive dissonance when they hear the truth.

Yeah, I'll use quotes from his speeches where he specifically said that Jewish people were evil and it was his duty as a follower of Christ to punish them. Usually they'll try and claim that Hitler changed his religious views, but there is absolutely no proof of that whatsoever. In fact, Banana Man Ray Comfort wrote this introduction for Darwin's "Origin of Species", claiming that Hitler was undeniably atheist. Of course, as usual, he offered no credible evidence.

“Religion was invented when the first con man met the first fool.” - Mark Twain
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31-01-2014, 11:02 AM
RE: "Well. So-and-So Was An Atheist!"
(28-01-2014 07:46 PM)RobbyPants Wrote:  
(28-01-2014 06:02 PM)Phil Hill Wrote:  How about the Hitler was an atheist and evolution led to the Holocaust. Only Hitler was born, raised and died a member of the RCC which he never renounced or was excommunicated from. And he banned Darwin's books from Germany. But I enjoy when Christians use this argument then get all twisted by cognitive dissonance when they hear the truth.

Yeah, but, he wasn't a true Christian. And, the Nazi belt buckle doesn't say "God with us"! It says "Got mittens?"! Or something!

Yeah, about all I hear is they heard he was atheist, then when you give them the evidence, they assume you're wrong, or just pull a huge No True Scotsman on you.



This reminds me of an old Disqus post I made back on the Atheism Resource site. Let's see if I can't find it...

http://www.atheismresource.com/2012/the-...-914605025

Ho-boy, looks like that one turned into a whole series of stupid bullshit Christians. Take a look if you're into self-induced face palms.


Chasmosaurus Wrote:Hitler thought he was Odin. How can you say he was Christian? Just because he wrote in Christian terms to attract an audience does not mean he was Christian.


EvolutionKills Wrote:That does nothing but ignore the fact that, regardless of his personal beliefs, Hitler managed to get the German people to go along with his plans. A nation where the two most prominent religions were Christian sects (Lutherans and Catholics), fed for centuries upon anti-Semitic hatred by their churches. The problem wasn't just that Hitler was a whack-job, it's that the rest of the country was crazy enough to follow him; and they were that crazy because of religion, not in spite of it.

If Hitler managed to abuse Christianity so easily for his own ends, that's still an indictment against Christianity. His followers were Christian, his soldiers were Christian, the Nazis running the concentration camps were Christian. Being Christian, believing in God and Jesus, didn't stop those pious men from killing millions of innocents. No, indeed it can be argued that their religious beliefs are exactly what enabled them to do so. Religion is a terrible catalyst and enforcer of in-group-out-group thinking. It was so easy for them to label the Jews and Gypsies as 'others', and thus to distance themselves from their own horrible actions. That is one of the things that scares me the most about religion.

Remember, that the 9-11 hijackers were most assuredly the most pious believers on those planes.



Zach Wrote:Man i am going to pray for you and anyone else that is lost in this world enough to believe this. you dont just throw accusations like that around without any proof. We are all sinners, we are not perfect we can't be perfect. its not about religion, its about sacrifice and commitment and love. The pope has been designated by man not godholy priest who is closer to god then any other. We all are in the same boat. We all fall short of the glory of God because of our sins. The story of the bible is not fiction it is a biography about why God had to do what he did. We were imperfect, we could only be perfect without God. He is the Alpha and the Omega. the bible is a painting of the world before us and how we got to where we are today. im never going to convince you of any of this. i am a man and i wont try to do a job that God can only do. all i can do is tell you who he is and that he loves you


EvolutionKills Wrote:"Man i am going to pray for you and anyone else that is lost in this world enough to believe this."

And I'll think for you. Not only that, I'd encourage you to think for yourself.

"you dont just throw accusations like that around without any proof."

Must I cite every speech that Hitler publicly affirmed himself as a Christian? Do you really need to see the census numbers to believe that Germany was a vastly Christian majority nation? I can get them for you if you'd like, as they are readily accessible to anyone with Google and the will to use it.

"We are all sinners, we are not perfect we can't be perfect."

Now THAT is a statement that requires evidence. Please provide evidence for the existence of sin without quoting the Bible. Remember that the Bible is the claim, not the proof. So to prove a Biblical claim, you must look outside the Bible for corroborative evidence. What evidence, outside the Bible, do you have for the existence of 'sin'?

"The pope has been designated by man not godholy priest who is closer to god then any other."

Religion is a means of control, but it's not limited to just the Catholic Church. The Bible is a tool used to repress and control people, because it teaches people to stop thinking and to accept authority and information uncritically; it creates willing mental slaves that are easily abused.

"We all are in the same boat."

Nope, not everyone buys into your same religious delusion. Other people don't buy into any religious delusion.

"We all fall short of the glory of God because of our sins."

Provide proof and evidence for the existence of 'sin' and your 'god' outside of quoting scripture.

"The story of the bible is not fiction it is a biography about why God had to do what he did."

Except for all of the things it claims that are demonstrably false. The world is not flat, supported on four pillars, and covered by a solid firmament; outer-space is not filled with water. Stars do not fall from the sky. Bird's blood and rituals do not cure leprosy. Diseases and mental illness are not demonic possession. Need I go on?

"We were imperfect, we could only be perfect without God."

This is nonsensical. But one has the question any being that claims to be perfect, then creates imperfect beings then holds his creations accountable for not being perfect, when the creator had the power to make them perfect but chose not to.

"He is the Alpha and the Omega"

More nonsense.

" the bible is a painting of the world before us and how we got to where we are today."

Not at all, the Bible is a snap shot of the religious and cultural beliefs of a fraction of the population of Mesopotamia 2000+ years ago. It tells us nothing about our modern age, as the book was quite clearly written by ignorant bronze/iron age men who knew of nothing outside of their own borders. There is no mention of science, genetics, electricity, space travel, the internet, global communication, or anything at all beyond the borders of their desert; no mention of China, Australia, or the Americas and the people therein.

"im never going to convince you of any of this."

To convince me you need evidence, and you appear to have none. To believe something without evidence is not noble, it is simply gullibility.

"i am a man and i wont try to do a job that God can only do."

Except he can't do anything either because he doesn't appear to exist, and if he does, appears to be content to never interact in the world. Your god is identical to a non-existent god, and thus I see no reason why your god should exist while all others are still imaginary.

"all i can do is tell you who he is and that he loves you"

And may you be touched by His noodly appendage!

Did I convince you of the existence of the Fly Spaghetti monster? I certainly hope not, and now you should understand why I don't believe in your 'god'.
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Holly Wrote:I see you like to make the argument that if God had the power to make us all perfect and to save us all from ever making the mistakes that would damn us to hell, why would he choose not to?

Human beings are imperfect because we were given the "gift" of free will. We can choose to follow God, or we can choose not to. We can choose between right and wrong.

So, why would God let us do that? Because he wanted the separate those who would TRULY FOLLOW HIM from those who would choose to ignore him.

With free will, people are given the chance to grow by making mistakes and recovering from them. Although there are people that make mistakes and don't recover from them, which is a terrible loss, but that is still part of the punishment from the original sin.

And you ask, how can we verify the existence of "sin"? Look around you! Do you not have a conscience? When you hear of a murder, do you not get the feeling that it is wrong? That my friend, is sin. When you can feel that it is wrong. BUT, you may say that you don't feel it's wrong to commit small acts of what Christians would consider sin. You could say that it feels totally fine with you and there's no harm done. THAT is because you haven't been filled with the Holy Spirit. When you have been filled with the Holy Spirit - which can be done just by asking for it - you will slowly begin to feel it, and have a STRONGER sense of what is TRULY right and what is TRULY wrong.
I know the difference now between the conscience I had before having the Holy Spirit and after acquiring it. You become so much more sensitive to knowing what is sin and what isn't than you were before.

But without ever having the Holy Spirit in your life, you couldn't possibly be able to even fathom what that experience is like!!!
So please don't even try to judge and put down something that you have not experienced for yourself.
You could, if you wanted to. It's freely available. YES, FREE. It doesn't cost any money. Anyone can obtain it.

And oh yes, there has been the argument of sacrificing and the idea that incest and whatnot was okayed by God. You may forget all of that was BEFORE Christ. When he came to the earth, his teachings were so controversial because it went against so many things that were in practice at the time. Why? Why did it have to be that way?
Well, in this day and age would you want to be sacrificing animals? He did it to give us the free gift of life because he sacrificed HIMSELF, which is greater than any sacrifice we could make.


EvolutionKills Wrote:Freewill, as proposed by theists, is incompatible with their God's omniscience.

Try again dumbass.



Chelsea Brown Wrote:Sounds like youve been watching too much of the jewish history channel.


EvolutionKills Wrote:I'm sorry, are you going to try to argue that Christians were not the vast majority of the German population, the Wehrmacht, or the Nazi party? If you have objections, please be specific. You're vague anti-Semitic insinuation is flaccid in the extreme, and speaks more of your own lack of education than anything else.



AlwaysLearning Wrote:"If Hitler managed to abuse Christianity so easily for his own ends, that's still an indictment against Christianity."
So because of the ease by which something can be abused, in this case Christianity, you're saying then Christianity is to blame? If that's true, then let's carry that logic out. Another oft abused subject is children. Are they to be "indicted" because of the ease to which they are abused? Or was it possible that something else is at work in Hitler's example? Now obviously as a believer in God and a follower of Christ, we're just not going to agree on this point. But incase you're able to put yourself in the position mentally of a follower of Christ, could it be Hitler's evil intentions and not in fact Christ who is to blame? And surely you are familiar enough with religion or Christianity to understand the concept of "nominalism". Has it ever occured to you that there could be large groups or even nations in existence that look at their perspective religion, in Germany's case, Christianity as purely a cultural adornment and not a life spent in pursuit of knowing Christ? Here's my only example of an authentic Christ follower during Hitler's reign: Deitrich Bonhoffer. See how he handled Hitler's Christianity.


EvolutionKills Wrote:You know, you could have saved us both a lot of time by just typing 'No True Scotsman Fallacy' in all caps.

Of course the Nazis weren't the right Christians, they weren't your Christians who followed your interpretation of the Bible and the teaching of Christ and therefore they're not 'True Christians ™'. Thank goodness we have you here to deliver unto us the correct interpretation of the scripture! Wait, where were you in 1933 Germany? Oh shit, you mean you didn't correct their flawed interpretation and you allowed them to run amok as false Christians!? Damn nigga', whose fault is that?

*yawn...*

Try harder next time, or get yourself a real education buckwheat.

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31-01-2014, 11:48 AM
RE: "Well. So-and-So Was An Atheist!"
Christians often try to claim Einstein as a christian and give us Hitler.

It's annoying and too easily refuted.


God is a concept by which we measure our pain -- John Lennon

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31-01-2014, 12:01 PM
Re: RE: "Well. So-and-So Was An Atheist!"
(31-01-2014 11:48 AM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  Christians often try to claim Einstein as a christian and give us Hitler.

It's annoying and too easily refuted.

But we know Christians lie. They claim superior morals when they really are amoral people.

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31-01-2014, 12:16 PM
RE: "Well. So-and-So Was An Atheist!"
(31-01-2014 12:01 PM)Phil Hill Wrote:  
(31-01-2014 11:48 AM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  Christians often try to claim Einstein as a christian and give us Hitler.

It's annoying and too easily refuted.

But we know Christians lie. They claim superior morals when they really are amoral people.

Sorry, I can't let that go. That really needs to be qualified with "some".

"Religion has caused more misery to all of mankind in every stage of human history than any other single idea." --Madalyn Murray O'Hair
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31-01-2014, 12:22 PM
RE: "Well. So-and-So Was An Atheist!"
Not really, all Christian avoid the negative commandments to avoid punishment. That is amoral. They do good for eternal reward, once again that is amoral.

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31-01-2014, 12:51 PM
RE: "Well. So-and-So Was An Atheist!"
(31-01-2014 12:22 PM)Phil Hill Wrote:  Not really, all Christian avoid the negative commandments to avoid punishment. That is amoral. They do good for eternal reward, once again that is amoral.
You also said "But we know Christians lie." That also needs to be qualified with "some". in the first place, you don't know every Christian to know whether they all lie. Secondly, there is no reason to believe there are none that don't lie. Third, there is no reason to single out Christians on this point. Every group of people that you could think of has at least some in it who lie.

Regarding amoral, how does either example that you gave make someone without morals? How can you categorically claim that an entire group of people is amoral? Again you don't know every one of them and I'd bet you know some who do have moral standards. I'm honestly surprised you attempted to defend this. And, by the way, the second example you gave of doing good for eternal reward also needs to be qualified by "some". Have you ever been a Christian? I was. If so, did you stop doing good when the eternal reward fairy tale became apparent? I didn't. Eternal reward may be a factor, but it's certainly not the only reason probably most Christians do whatever good they do.

"Religion has caused more misery to all of mankind in every stage of human history than any other single idea." --Madalyn Murray O'Hair
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