What I Think Bill Nye Should do While Debating Ken Ham
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22-01-2014, 11:30 AM (This post was last modified: 22-01-2014 11:35 AM by Metazoa Zeke.)
What I Think Bill Nye Should do While Debating Ken Ham
As you all know, there's a debate happening February 4, 2014 between the science guy and someone who doesn't know the consequence of a country run on religion. However Bill doesn't know that it's a trap. However this trap can't be executed that easily for Ken. Bill isn't stupid and Ham knows that, but Ham isn't stupid when it comes to executing plans. He must make sure that he can change topics and a whim and go on a Gish Gallop to "win". This plan is more then it seems.

Ken Ham's creation museum is losing money. Ken Ham needs the money and that is Ken's bread winner after his website. He needs something to get him noticed. That is the first part of his trap. Bill Nye is a perfect candidate for this debate because he's already famous. Bill Nye debating in his museum no less. This another part of his plan. The main reason they're debating on Ken Ham's turf is so that he can show off his Noah's ark theme park, which will encourage all the creationist there to try and pay for it. This is only the first part.

Second part is getting creationism a higher stance in america. Why america? Because this country is already teeming with religious zealots, and this country has the most christian creationist in the world. Which is ironic seeing how Ken is from Australia, a country more secular then america, and instead of trying to get most of Australia to become christian creationist, he instead goes to a country where 46% of the population already agree with him. This debate will make unsure American's think that creationism is as valid as any scientific theory. Worst part they don't know that creationism fills none, if any requirements to become a part of science in the first place. This also has to do with Bill Nye again. If Bill even says he doesn't know once, then Ken Ham will spring on that opportunity and say his god is the only answer. This again will help in the rise of the NAO of christian theology.

Third reason is for pride. As you know Bill Nye had a video call "Creationism is not Appropriate for Children," and this video got under Ken Ham's skinAngry. This is another reason he wants to debate Bill. If Bill makes one slip up, no matter how good his other points were, he's going to get him on it and talk about how he should have never put that video up in the first place. This debate has alot to do with Ken Ham's pride, but not just his. I know he's going to do this for all other creationist bothered by that video. He fells as if he can get the slip on Bill, he's got his revenge.

The last major thing is how the debate is formatted. Bill Nye is going in to debate on creationist territory in front of nobody but creationist. That's right nobody but Ken Ham's followers. Many atheist have said that there tickets have been refunded. This is so no atheist can record the debate in full, and Ken Ham's lackeys can edit out all the good points Bill has raised.

However I don't think this debate is a bad idea. This debate for bill can be good. It reminds me of a mma fight i say before where a man tried to mount the other, and the man on the ground took advantage of that and won the fight. Bill can use this trap to his advantage but there's one thing he must do to get this right. Don't debate evolution, attack the things creationist believe.

Why do I want Bill to do this? It is so that he can show the folly of creation "science". He must attack the flood story in particular. That one story is where the true foundation of creationism falls, not the garden. If you show the faults in that, then there is no explanation a creationist can give, and they have to realize they're wrong. If Bill does do this, we know Ken Ham will try to change the subject the second he brings this up. Even when he does, Bill must pressure Ken into not changing the subject. If bill executes showing the folly of the flood correctly, then Ken Ham's trap can be used against him. Then Ken will lose money for his ark park and lose followers as well(but I can't guarantee they would become atheist).

I hope Bill does go for that plan. I wish that Bill Nye was Phoenix Wright, so that he would know how to keep pressuring the issues he brings up. Bill can't back out now, if he did then he would have made Ken Ham's plan easier to execute. All I can say is good luck Bill, you might just do what you wanted to do for the United States and the world.


P.S you know what else is funny. When I was looking at Ken Ham's name yesterday, I found it ironic that someone trying to promote the bible has the last name of Noah's son that was cursed in the bible. Just had to say thatBig Grin




[Image: Guilmon-41189.gif] ♪僕は恐怖の一定した状態に住んで、不幸、逃すもう?僕は、それはもう痛いときも気づかないと
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22-01-2014, 11:37 AM
RE: What I Think Bill Nye Should do While Debating Ken Ham
I still don't like it. There is nothing in creationism worthy of debate. The Ken Ham types can flap that science is afraid to debate him but I think it is for the best that real scientists as Bill Nye purports himself to be, should not engage them. All it does to them is send the message that there's something worth debating here.

It won't matter how good it is, both side will claim a victory.


God is a concept by which we measure our pain -- John Lennon

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22-01-2014, 11:42 AM
RE: What I Think Bill Nye Should do While Debating Ken Ham
(22-01-2014 11:37 AM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  I still don't like it. There is nothing in creationism worthy of debate. The Ken Ham types can flap that science is afraid to debate him but I think it is for the best that real scientists as Bill Nye purports himself to be, should not engage them. All it does to them is send the message that there's something worth debating here.

It won't matter how good it is, both side will claim a victory.

I'm sort of a opportunist. If bill is going to stick with evolution,cosmology,and all other science the prove all the abrahamic religions wrong, then i can agree. If he shows that the flood is scientifically wrong then i say have at it bill. I don't know why anyone would claim victory in a debate, I wouldn't. I'd just say i hope i made a good point.

[Image: Guilmon-41189.gif] ♪僕は恐怖の一定した状態に住んで、不幸、逃すもう?僕は、それはもう痛いときも気づかないと
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22-01-2014, 11:46 AM
RE: What I Think Bill Nye Should do While Debating Ken Ham
I agree..... I wonder if Ham thinks Bill Nye is a easy takedown.

I believe Aron Ra offered to debate Ken Ham and Ham refused, Aron said he would be at the debate in the audience taping the show, I'm pretty sure Aron will dissect Ham at a later date, either at lecture or on Youtube.
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22-01-2014, 11:48 AM
RE: What I Think Bill Nye Should do While Debating Ken Ham
I believe Aron Ra offered to debate Ken Ham and Ham refused, Aron said he would be at the debate in the audience taping the show, I'm pretty sure Aron will dissect Ham at a later date, either at lecture or on Youtube.
[/quote]

Aron Ra would ruin Answers in Genesis period. In fact if he debated him i don't think answers in genesis would be a website anymore. sound amazing doesnt it Wink

[Image: Guilmon-41189.gif] ♪僕は恐怖の一定した状態に住んで、不幸、逃すもう?僕は、それはもう痛いときも気づかないと
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22-01-2014, 11:54 AM
RE: What I Think Bill Nye Should do While Debating Ken Ham
(22-01-2014 11:48 AM)ThePaleolithicFreethinker Wrote:  Aron Ra would ruin Answers in Genesis period. In fact if he debated him i don't think answers in genesis would be a website anymore. sound amazing doesnt it Wink

No doubt in mind that your are correct. Thumbsup
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22-01-2014, 11:56 AM
RE: What I Think Bill Nye Should do While Debating Ken Ham
(22-01-2014 11:42 AM)ThePaleolithicFreethinker Wrote:  
(22-01-2014 11:37 AM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  I still don't like it. There is nothing in creationism worthy of debate. The Ken Ham types can flap that science is afraid to debate him but I think it is for the best that real scientists as Bill Nye purports himself to be, should not engage them. All it does to them is send the message that there's something worth debating here.

It won't matter how good it is, both side will claim a victory.

I'm sort of a opportunist. If bill is going to stick with evolution,cosmology,and all other science the prove all the abrahamic religions wrong, then i can agree. If he shows that the flood is scientifically wrong then i say have at it bill. I don't know why anyone would claim victory in a debate, I wouldn't. I'd just say i hope i made a good point.

Because people will see what they will. If a creationist watches it, and sees Ken Ham get a jab in they'll proclaim him the victor.

Just as we see things through our own view.

Is it true AronRa won't be allowed to attend it or will he not just be allowed to record it?

I don't trust anything AIG does and I wouldn't trust anything they release as the debate through their website. That's the other thing that's worrisome. Not the debate or the people who see it as it unfolds, people's individual memory fails. They won't recall what points actually made, they'll just recall vividly the emotional response they had to it.

It's what they release afterward that could be disingenuous. We've seen this time and again with Ray Comfort and Ben Stein.


God is a concept by which we measure our pain -- John Lennon

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22-01-2014, 12:11 PM
RE: What I Think Bill Nye Should do While Debating Ken Ham
Because people will see what they will. If a creationist watches it, and sees Ken Ham get a jab in they'll proclaim him the victor.

Just as we see things through our own view.

Is it true AronRa won't be allowed to attend it or will he not just be allowed to record it?

I don't trust anything AIG does and I wouldn't trust anything they release as the debate through their website. That's the other thing that's worrisome. Not the debate or the people who see it as it unfolds, people's individual memory fails. They won't recall what points actually made, they'll just recall vividly the emotional response they had to it.

It's what they release afterward that could be disingenuous. We've seen this time and again with Ray Comfort and Ben Stein.
[/quote]

Maybe this debate will be like the first fight i saw between anderson silva vs chael sonnen. Chael had silva right in his hand, but silva made the come back with one submission. Despite the advantage chael had silva still won. I'm up set that people see debates trough only their perspective. Ive seen debates between theist and atheist and i've heard theist make points and i go "there right their holy book does say it that way, you got to come up with a better argument." Ray Comfort is the second biggest liar after the hovinds. Maybe i should write why ray comfort should release the full interviews he had in evolution vs god ( or as i like to call it atheist vs theist).

[Image: Guilmon-41189.gif] ♪僕は恐怖の一定した状態に住んで、不幸、逃すもう?僕は、それはもう痛いときも気づかないと
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22-01-2014, 02:22 PM
RE: What I Think Bill Nye Should do While Debating Ken Ham
No doubt there will be postings / uploads "Nye gets owned by a Creationist".
It's like Dawkins refusing to debate Craig.
Just appearing on the same stage grants "legitimacy" to the preposterous position.
Creationism has no legitimacy. It's like arguing if the Earth is flat.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein
Those who were seen dancing were thought to be insane by those who could not hear the music - Friedrich Nietzsche
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22-01-2014, 02:26 PM
RE: What I Think Bill Nye Should do While Debating Ken Ham
(22-01-2014 02:22 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  No doubt there will be postings / uploads "Nye gets owned by a Creationist".
It's like Dawkins refusing to debate Craig.
Just appearing on the same stage grants "legitimacy" to the preposterous position.

Ya the creatinonist would probably say the moment of ownage is when ken ham ask if hes god. This brings me to another point i should have added. If ken ham ask bill nye are you god bill should say "no im not your god, im better then him. Remember your god created the universe and we created your god."

[Image: Guilmon-41189.gif] ♪僕は恐怖の一定した状態に住んで、不幸、逃すもう?僕は、それはもう痛いときも気づかないと
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