What I Think Happens After We Die
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13-05-2012, 12:58 PM
RE: What I Think Happens After We Die
The absence of evidence for what is called the mind being separate from the brain is the reason why many of us gravitate towards the evidence suggesting that they are one and the same and/or that the brain generates the "mind."

What evidence suggests that they are separate?

What evidence suggests the existence of any "lucid spiritual plane" is connected to the evidence of the mind and brain being separate?

What is the soul? What evidence exists to suggest it exists?

How does it store memories?

How does the immaterial world interact with the material world yet leave no traces of this interaction?

Your concept for what happens when we die opens the door to these and many more questions and resolves nothing. It fails to qualify as scientific.

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13-05-2012, 01:13 PM (This post was last modified: 13-05-2012 01:21 PM by GirlyMan.)
RE: What I Think Happens After We Die
(13-05-2012 12:58 PM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  The absence of evidence for what is called the mind being separate from the brain is the reason why many of us gravitate towards the evidence suggesting that they are one and the same and/or that the brain generates the "mind."

What evidence suggests that they are separate?

What evidence suggests the existence of any "lucid spiritual plane" is connected to the evidence of the mind and brain being separate?

What is the soul? What evidence exists to suggest it exists?

How does it store memories?

How does the immaterial world interact with the material world yet leave no traces of this interaction?

Your concept for what happens when we die opens the door to these and many more questions and resolves nothing. It fails to qualify as scientific.

I thought we reasoned dualism away long ago. Only reason I can see that it continues to rear its ugly head is we don't like what reason's sayin'. I don't worship reason as God with good reason, but I'll be goddamned if I'm gonna ignore it. It's the most credible source we have.

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13-05-2012, 01:17 PM
RE: What I Think Happens After We Die
I don't understand exactly how ones goes from duality to an afterlife either. One is not equal to the other nor would one be contingent upon the other.

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13-05-2012, 01:32 PM
RE: What I Think Happens After We Die
(13-05-2012 01:17 PM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  I don't understand exactly how ones goes from duality to an afterlife either. One is not equal to the other nor would one be contingent upon the other.

Precisely. I ain't got nothin' to say about an afterlife and the reuse of the resources I used to use. That pointer to global memory I used to hold might very well belong to a different process now. But I do think that maintaining my state post process termination is so unlikely as to call bullshit. The promise of a postmortem preservation of identity is bullshit. It's that simple. Deal with it. Wink

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13-05-2012, 01:32 PM
 
RE: What I Think Happens After We Die
(13-05-2012 06:35 AM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  [b]Since there is not ONE SHRED of evidence that consciousness exists apart from "neural activity",

Except for learning and memory in paramecia, precognition, NDEs, and known limits of what a central nervous system can do. So, as you can see, there is evidence, but there is you unwillingness to accept that evidence.


(13-05-2012 06:51 AM)houseofcantor Wrote:  [font=Verdana]ain't no we in die
only i

LOL. Good one. Thumbsup


(13-05-2012 07:23 AM)Chas Wrote:  I think that this a belief based on absolutely no evidence. You're welcome to believe it, but don't be surprised when you can't convince anyone else.

I suppose evidence would be what? Communicating with people who are currently existing on their lucid spiritual plane and describe it as such, like if they came in over a radio of some kind, or perhaps if they spoke and we could then hear them in our minds. That might be hard evidence to come by. Do keep in mind, however, that there is no one shred of evidence that we cease to exist upon the death of our bodies.
(13-05-2012 11:10 AM)bemore Wrote:  Because if the soul is timeless, endless and lives through many different lifes and exists (maybe) temporarily without a body between incarnations then that would indicate that we dont know ourselves........ our TRUE selves.

Thanks for the video. I'm going to watch that here shortly. But I'd like to comment on what you said, because you are correct. If we think all we are is the person in the mirror, we are mistaken. We are our soul. And this incarnation is only one manifestation of that soul.

You asked about why I explore my spirituality so much, what happened? And I don't know, or at least I don't know how to boil it down to one thing except to say I've never been satisfied in life. Also, I've had some really profound episodes of precognition, and I have spent years trying to figure out the implications of that. It's too profound for me to deny (even if it is utterly unprovable to others). Therefore, I am one person who not only believes the soul is not part of the brain, but I know it's not. Next week, I'll have to post those episodes in my blog or here or something and get others opinions.

I want to get to BeardedDude's questions. But I have to do that later.
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13-05-2012, 02:04 PM (This post was last modified: 13-05-2012 02:04 PM by TheBeardedDude.)
RE: What I Think Happens After We Die
Paramecia do not learn and they do not have a memory.
What evidence do you have to support that claim?

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13-05-2012, 02:12 PM
RE: What I Think Happens After We Die
(13-05-2012 01:32 PM)Egor Wrote:  Therefore, I am one person who not only believes the soul is not part of the brain, but I know it's not.

You're not alone there, there are millions, probably even billions, who share your delusion. That qualifies it as a mass delusion.

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13-05-2012, 02:14 PM
RE: What I Think Happens After We Die
When one person suffers from a delusion it is a mental illness. When many share in the same delusion, it is called religion.

I don't remember who said that

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13-05-2012, 03:02 PM (This post was last modified: 13-05-2012 10:38 PM by Bucky Ball.)
RE: What I Think Happens After We Die
(13-05-2012 01:32 PM)Egor Wrote:  Except for learning and memory in paramecia, precognition, NDEs, and known limits of what a central nervous system can do. So, as you can see, there is evidence, but there is you unwillingness to accept that evidence.


Except it's NOT "evidence" as it's not testable. Said needs to learn what "evidence" is. What is the Null Hypothesis ? It's just someone's INTERPRETATION of "perceived" patterns", (just as the "complexity in Design thingy is).....not peer-reviewed. A learned "reflex" is not "memory", nor does it imply consciousness, (which Said has never defined). A Paramecium does not CHOOSE. NDE's are lack of appropriate oxygen sat levels, which Said, of all people ought to know about. Was Said never at a Code Blue ? The "limits" are not important, as demonstrably, technology has improved them, by logrhythmic amounts. Even IF any of Said's non-evidentiary "evidences" had some support, scientifically, it does not point to a deity, and would not be the ONLY option for explanation, it's STILL "god of the gaps".

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13-05-2012, 09:15 PM
 
RE: What I Think Happens After We Die
(13-05-2012 02:04 PM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  Paramecia do not learn and they do not have a memory.
What evidence do you have to support that claim?



https://www.google.com/#sclient=psy-ab&h...24&bih=571

This link will take you to the google page with the approriate links to a scientific paper written by psychology researchers at the University of Toledo.

(13-05-2012 12:58 PM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  The absence of evidence for what is called the mind being separate from the brain is the reason why many of us gravitate towards the evidence suggesting that they are one and the same and/or that the brain generates the "mind."

What evidence suggests that they are separate?

Memory and learning in paramecia. NDEs, precognition.

Quote:What evidence suggests the existence of any "lucid spiritual plane" is connected to the evidence of the mind and brain being separate?

When we sleep we dream. If we can stay in a dream we often become lucid in that dream. It is logical therefore to assume that when we die, we will be in a dream state. Since we will no longer wake up, it is probable we will become lucid in that dream state.



Quote:What is the soul? What evidence exists to suggest it exists?

The soul would have to be a modality of the substance of the monistic entity of fundamental consciousness (God). This is modeled, I believe, by dream characters we create when we dream. If you dream of another person, you have actually created that person from your consciousness.

The evidence that the soul exists is mostly subjective, but universally subjective. Everyone has a sense of an observer within them that they usually refer to when they use personal pronouns like I or me or mine. This observer experiences thoughts, invokes will upon the mind, and has memories of the past.

Quote:How does it store memories?

I thing once the soul receives an experience from the mind, it imprints upon it and the soul is forever molded as a result. Much like a phonograph record is changed when sound is engraved on it.

Quote:How does the immaterial world interact with the material world yet leave no traces of this interaction?

I have no idea.
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