What Is Preventing
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26-08-2017, 05:55 PM
RE: What Is Preventing
(25-08-2017 05:44 PM)Jeanne Wrote:  
(24-08-2017 10:44 PM)morondog Wrote:  Gee I wonder who keeps stoking such tensions...

Identity Politics got into full swing with Woodrow Wilson. Lyndon Johnson set the game up well with the Great Society agenda.

But...recently? That would be Barrack Obama, who set race relations back decades. When he was first introduced to the nation, I had such hopes for his future as our president, but they were quickly dashed the more I learned about him and it was painful to watch what went down over his two terms.

Conveniently ignoring Nixon's "Southern Strategy", Reagan's "Welfare Queens", and Bush the Elder's Willie Horton ads.

It's no coincidence that your examples are Democrats, and that you completely ignored Republican examples of identity politics.

You're a lot more transparent than you think you are.

(25-08-2017 05:44 PM)Jeanne Wrote:  Who stokes the tensions? Those who have to gain from America's demise. Left. Right. Communists. Fascists. Anarchists throughout the spectrum.

What do those American factions have to gain? Be specific.
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26-08-2017, 07:15 PM
RE: What Is Preventing
(25-08-2017 05:55 PM)Jeanne Wrote:  I don't think my thinking he would have liked to have a third term and probably was seeking a way to do it was paranoid.

It obviously is. The Constitution forbids it, so implicit in your fear is the fear that the Constitution would be overthrown. This is clearly unrealistic, to be kind to you.

(25-08-2017 05:55 PM)Jeanne Wrote:  After all, Clinton was supposed to win and that would have been Obama's third and fourth term...don't you think?

Which is, you know, not Obama's taking a third term. Let's stay connected to reality here, Jeanne. You are arguing that the possibility of a Clinton victory is evidence that your fears of Obama seeking a third term are valid.

I never thought I'd have to remind anyone of this, but Obama is not Hillary Clinton, either in person, style, politics, or DNA.

This sort of shitty reasoning is why while you sound reasonable on the surface, it's obvious you clearly have suborned your thinking to someone else's agenda. By your own logic, Bush the Elder was a third Reagan term. It wasn't.
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26-08-2017, 07:29 PM
RE: What Is Preventing
(25-08-2017 06:28 PM)Jeanne Wrote:  
(25-08-2017 01:19 PM)Thumpalumpacus Wrote:  You offered up your opinion. If you cannot or will not stand up for them and explain why you feel what you feel, then why should anyone care what those opinions are?

What does Trump say that you like? What does he do that you like?

Be specific. Absent that, I've got no reason to see you as anything other than a spoon-fed drone.

You are welcomed to see me as anything that you wish. And I am allowed to see any who disagree with me as anything that I wish.

Maybe you don't realize that there are talking points on both sides and that each side shakes their collective head at the other for regurgitating them...or maybe you do and you just want to call me names.

I know there are talking points on both sides. I am a centrist and cotton to heterogeneous views, as you may or may not know.

I'm not shaking my head at you because we disagree. I'm shaking my head at you because while you're very happy to state your views, you're awfully afraid to discuss them. Forgive me my skepticism, but that strikes me as seagull posting -- take a shit and fly away. And I don't blame you. I wouldn't want to have to defend the views you espouse either. But if you want to change minds, you'll engage in discussion. If you simply want to climb on your crate and holler into the marketplace of ideas, I'll accept that that's the level you operate on and regard you as I do others who are happy to shout but not to talk.

Anyone can state an opinion. It takes a deeper person to discuss that view with folks who disagree. I'm willing and able to go there with you. Why are you so shy about discussing what you're so open about proclaiming?
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27-08-2017, 12:15 PM
RE: What Is Preventing
I'm British so what the hell do I know about US politics, but if Trump goes he'll simply be replaced by Mike Pence who sings from the same song sheet won't he, so what's the point of trying to get rid of Trump?
Also, the American people voted Trump into the WH so it's not exactly as if they're all against him is it?
(In fact I hear that polls indicate more and more people are liking him all the time)
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27-08-2017, 12:33 PM
RE: What Is Preventing
(27-08-2017 12:15 PM)Propwash Wrote:  I'm British so what the hell do I know about US politics, but if Trump goes he'll simply be replaced by Mike Pence who sings from the same song sheet won't he, so what's the point of trying to get rid of Trump?

Pence is highly religious and I disagree with him on just about every issue but he doesn't appear to be mentally unstable or completely ignorant of US law.

Quote:Also, the American people voted Trump into the WH so it's not exactly as if they're all against him is it?

The states voted him into office which is an artifact of the electoral system in the US. Clinton won the vote of the people.

Quote:(In fact I hear that polls indicate more and more people are liking him all the time)

You need to get out more and troll less.

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27-08-2017, 01:34 PM
RE: What Is Preventing
(24-08-2017 03:24 PM)Airportkid Wrote:  the Republicans from ditching Trump via impeachment in two days (1 day in the House, the 2nd in the Senate) so they can get their GOP agenda underway with Pence tootsweet? What purpose is it serving them to keep that lunatic around to monkeywrench their aims?

That they'll lose the trump base? Pswwhh.

In the months before the midterms they'll fulfill all the "important" trump objectives that coincide with their own and that bases' - and the base is so saturated with dimwits it'd be childishly (literally) easy to propagandize it into believing Pence is their messiah long before the midterms.

Not a scenario I'd like to see, but competent ship crews roll the loose cannons overboard before they splinter the masts.

They are fine with him. This is who they are. They are probably relieved that one can be as honest as Trump about who he is and still be elected.

One thing I have learned during Trump's presidency? That America can clearly function without a President. Maybe time to try a Westminster parliamentary system.

We have to remember that what we observe is not nature herself, but nature exposed to our method of questioning ~ Werner Heisenberg
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27-08-2017, 03:35 PM
RE: What Is Preventing
(27-08-2017 12:15 PM)Propwash Wrote:  I'm British so what the hell do I know about US politics, but if Trump goes he'll simply be replaced by Mike Pence who sings from the same song sheet won't he, so what's the point of trying to get rid of Trump?
Also, the American people voted Trump into the WH so it's not exactly as if they're all against him is it?
(In fact I hear that polls indicate more and more people are liking him all the time)

1) Trump garnered 3 million fewer votes than Clinton. Ascribing his election to the generic "American people" is sloppy thinking at the very least.

2) I'd be interested in seeing these polls you're talking about -- you got a link? The polls I see show Trump's approval ratings at historic lows for a President at this stage of his tenure. (see also: http://www.pbs.org/newshour/rundown/trum...d-record/, https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls...6179.html, https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/tru...-ratings/, and these these other sources.

I'll leave it for readers to answer for themselves your opening question in your quoted post. I have a preliminary answer, myself, which courses close to "not a goddamned thing".
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27-08-2017, 08:11 PM
RE: What Is Preventing
(27-08-2017 12:15 PM)Propwash Wrote:  Also, the American people voted Trump into the WH so it's not exactly as if they're all against him is it?
(In fact I hear that polls indicate more and more people are liking him all the time)

I agree that you seem to know fuck-all about US politics matey.

Quote:Plunging into undesirably uncharted territory, Trump is setting records with his dismally low approval ratings, including the lowest mark ever for a president in his first year. In fact, with four months left in the year, Trump has already spent more time under 40% (Gallup, currently 37%) than any other first-year president... His current approval rating is worse than former President Barack Obama's ever was...
CNBC, 26 Aug 17

Dodgy

I'm a creationist... I believe that man created God.
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27-08-2017, 08:41 PM
RE: What Is Preventing
(27-08-2017 01:34 PM)tomilay Wrote:  One thing I have learned during Trump's presidency? That America can clearly function without a President. Maybe time to try a Westminster parliamentary system.

No, no, and no to the Westminster system. It's already fucked over our government in recent memory. Check out Gough Whitlam’s 1975 dismissal as prime minister.

This reports on possibly the most outrageous and undignified event in Australia's political history, and worse, this could easily happen today, more than 40 years later. Briefly, the Australian Governor General, the Queen's representative here was (is) the most powerful single individual in the country. As such, he literally sacked our entire, constitutionally-elected government. The Queen of a foreign country, Elizabeth II was asked to intervene, and reinstate the government, but refused—despite having the absolute power to do so.

On top of that fiasco, far, far too many laws of our land are still beholden to British laws that may be hundreds of years old, and in accord with the Parliament of the United Kingdom. Hopefully, when the 91-year-old Queen departs this mortal coil shortly, Australia—at long last—can become a self-governing republic, unhampered by a born-to-rule bunch of millionaire inbreds.

I'm a creationist... I believe that man created God.
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28-08-2017, 07:25 AM
RE: What Is Preventing
(24-08-2017 03:24 PM)Airportkid Wrote:  the Republicans from ditching Trump via impeachment in two days (1 day in the House, the 2nd in the Senate) so they can get their GOP agenda underway with Pence tootsweet? What purpose is it serving them to keep that lunatic around to monkeywrench their aims?

That they'll lose the trump base? Pswwhh.

There's also the primaries.

Many districts are gerrymandered to the point where they are not remotely competitive. The Republican candidate knows he is going to soundly defeat the Democrat. This is by design. What they have less control over is the primaries. If Trump's base is still supporting him in 2018, any candidate who goes against him is at risk of having their seat pulled out from under them by an insurgent pro-Trump candidate.

Obviously, different districts will be more or less vulnerable to this, but I'm sure the future candidates in the more vulnerable districts are very aware of this.
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