What Is Truth?
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24-08-2014, 10:12 AM (This post was last modified: 24-08-2014 10:55 AM by phil.a.)
RE: What Is Truth?
(19-12-2013 02:12 PM)Free Wrote:  This question was purportedly asked to Jesus by Pontius Pilate during the trial of Jesus of Nazareth (doesn't really matter if the story is true or not, however) and Jesus did not answer it.

Therefore, let's investigate and see if we atheists can come up with an answer to this question that Jesus so miserably failed to respond to.

My definition of truth is the following:

Truth is all that which can be determined to exist.

What's your take on this rather philosophical question?

In terms of a direct experience of reality - "Truth" appears as our experience of empty space.

Empty space supports the possibility of separate entities in space existing in process relationships with one another, essentially our human "truths" are descriptions of those process relationships occurring "inside" space.

"Truth" is an absolute, fully abstract "entity", because it's abstract and so not an object it's not really possible to talk directly about it. Space isn't an object, but is the premise for talking about objects from an objective perspective.

"Truth" is the container for all relative human truths, so that everything that's "true" exists in Truth.

Phil
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24-08-2014, 10:14 AM
RE: What Is Truth?
(19-12-2013 04:28 PM)Dom Wrote:  Truth is relative. What is true for me may not be true for you.

Do you realise the above is an absolute truth claim?

Phil
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24-08-2014, 01:14 PM
RE: What Is Truth?
(24-08-2014 10:14 AM)phil.a Wrote:  
(19-12-2013 04:28 PM)Dom Wrote:  Truth is relative. What is true for me may not be true for you.

Do you realise the above is an absolute truth claim?

Phil

No it's not.

Dog.

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If you're perfect -- Alanis Morissette
(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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24-08-2014, 01:33 PM
RE: What Is Truth?
(24-08-2014 01:14 PM)morondog Wrote:  
(24-08-2014 10:14 AM)phil.a Wrote:  Do you realise the above is an absolute truth claim?

Phil

No it's not.

Dog.

Why not?

Surely the claim "Truth is relative" is itself stating that all truth is relative.

Phil
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24-08-2014, 01:40 PM
RE: What Is Truth?
(24-08-2014 01:33 PM)phil.a Wrote:  
(24-08-2014 01:14 PM)morondog Wrote:  No it's not.

Dog.

Why not?

Surely the claim "Truth is relative" is itself stating that all truth is relative.

Phil

You made the claim that it's an absolute claim, you defend it. Otherwise I can just make a counter assertion and it's just as good as your assertion Drinking Beverage

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(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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24-08-2014, 01:41 PM
RE: What Is Truth?
PS what is truth?

PPS what do you mean by absolute truth?

PPPS If all truth is relative is itself a relative claim, where is the absolute?

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If you're perfect -- Alanis Morissette
(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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24-08-2014, 01:57 PM
RE: What Is Truth?
Every time I see this thread title I have a little piece of a song from Jesus Christ Superstar playing in my head...


Pontius Pilate (I think) to Christ.


What is truth?
Is truth unchanging law?
We both have truths.
Are mine the same as yours?


With the chorus chanting "Crucify him" in the background.

See here they are, the bruises, some were self-inflicted and some showed up along the way. - JF
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24-08-2014, 02:05 PM
RE: What Is Truth?
(24-08-2014 01:40 PM)morondog Wrote:  
(24-08-2014 01:33 PM)phil.a Wrote:  Why not?

Surely the claim "Truth is relative" is itself stating that all truth is relative.

Phil

You made the claim that it's an absolute claim, you defend it. Otherwise I can just make a counter assertion and it's just as good as your assertion Drinking Beverage

Quite happy to explain it, as I have now done above.

You're welcome!

Phil
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24-08-2014, 02:13 PM
RE: What Is Truth?
(24-08-2014 01:41 PM)morondog Wrote:  PS what is truth?

PPS what do you mean by absolute truth?

PPPS If all truth is relative is itself a relative claim, where is the absolute?

I counter...

Word games = boring.

We'll love you just the way you are
If you're perfect -- Alanis Morissette
(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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24-08-2014, 02:17 PM
RE: What Is Truth?
(24-08-2014 01:41 PM)morondog Wrote:  PS what is truth?

PPS what do you mean by absolute truth?

absolute:
1 "not qualified or diminished in any way; total"
2 viewed or existing independently and not in relation to other things; not relative or comparative:

Quote:PPPS If all truth is relative is itself a relative claim, where is the absolute?

But it's not a relative claim. A relative claim would be something like: "in my opinion, all truth is relative" (e.g. i relativise the claim to my own perspective). That would be fine, such a claim can be raised to it's own expectations, but the original unqualified claim is absolute, so contradicts itself.

Phil
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