What are "feelings" and "emotion"?
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01-11-2014, 10:50 AM
RE: What are "feelings" and "emotion"?
(01-11-2014 10:41 AM)Mathilda Wrote:  
(01-11-2014 10:31 AM)Wolfbitn Wrote:  I would refer you to the articles Iv posted that refer to the voles and the photograph studies. They both indicate without question that the feelings produced the chemical reaction.

No they don't.

Then explain what it means, when referring to the reactions, when we are told in those very studies that the pictures were the "cause" of the chemical reactions they were studying. Are you implying the pictures of lovers did not create a response or a feeling? The chemical reactions did not occur until AFTER the feeling. Feel free, IF you disagree, to show me in that study where the chemical reaction was the CAUSE of the feeling... you cant because it says exactly the opposite... your "no" means absolutely zero. You have no source whatsoever to back you.

(01-11-2014 10:31 AM)Wolfbitn Wrote:  You can find all 4 links together in Angela Merkels last post where she tried to say those were HER sources and not acknowledging that they were provided by ME. Smile

Quote:Oddgamer posted them, not me. The point he was trying to make was that your sources do not say what you think they say.

But he cant produce a quote form them to back him, nor can you. You guys can only steal MY sources, pretend they are yours, and not even able to produce a quote from them to back you.

You need quotes to back you... you need SOMETHING other than "no". Where is your credible source?

Where are your quotes?

Where are your scientific studies? Your opinion means exactly shit when compared to actual real science. Science is not biased as you tend to be regarding this subject.
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01-11-2014, 10:52 AM
RE: What are "feelings" and "emotion"?
(01-11-2014 10:43 AM)Wolfbitn Wrote:  In the voles it was the act of mating, preceded by the "urge" or "desire" or "feeling" to mate, that then went on to produce a 50 percent increase in the female's dopamine levels within the brain... as a "reward system". It's very clear.

Wrong. Both hunger and reward are considered feelings. So one feeling led to an action which led to another feeling.

http://www.thethinkingatheist.com/forum/...#pid675746

http://www.thethinkingatheist.com/forum/...#pid675775


(01-11-2014 10:43 AM)Wolfbitn Wrote:  The photo study was even more revealing. While brains were monitored, over a period of hours, groups were given pictures and allowed to look at them for several minutes. The FEELINGS produced by pictures of lovers then caused the chemical/electrical reactions. They specifically use the word "cause". It is very clear.

Wrong.

http://www.thethinkingatheist.com/forum/...#pid675811
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01-11-2014, 10:55 AM
RE: What are "feelings" and "emotion"?
(01-11-2014 10:49 AM)Peebothuhul Wrote:  
(01-11-2014 10:43 AM)Wolfbitn Wrote:  In the voles it was the act of mating, preceded by the "urge" or "desire" or "feeling" to mate, that then went on to produce a 50 percent increase in the female's dopamine levels within the brain... as a "reward system". It's very clear.

So... something physical... caused something physical? Or have I missed something in regards to the Voles or the topic at large? Consider

(01-11-2014 10:43 AM)Wolfbitn Wrote:  The photo study was even more revealing. While brains were monitored, over a period of hours, groups were given pictures and allowed to look at them for several minutes. The FEELINGS produced by pictures of lovers then caused the chemical/electrical reactions. They specifically use the word "cause". It is very clear.

Yes... you've said "The feelings produced by the pictures" twice now.

My question to you is/was "HOW did the pictures produce those feelings?" What was the picture's mechanism?

Much cheers to all.

The people in the study groups were given several pictures... Only the pictures of the lovers of the participants produces the changes, as the rest of the pictures weren't of an emotional nature. The chemical reactions produced, emerged only AFTER the initial feeling, which was instantly generated by the picture. The chemical reactions occurred only afterward on a consistent basis with no exception ever mentioned. Read it for yourself, it says exactly what Im telling you it says. Smile
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01-11-2014, 10:57 AM
RE: What are "feelings" and "emotion"?
(01-11-2014 10:50 AM)Wolfbitn Wrote:  The chemical reactions did not occur until AFTER the feeling.

Wrong.

You don't even try explaining why a feeling would cause a 'chemical reaction'. Even the use of the phrase 'chemical reaction' shows that you don't understand what is going on. Neurochemicals are being released by neurons.

Why would a feeling release neurochemicals? What is the purpose of the dopamine?

Your understanding is flawed and lacks explanatory power.
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01-11-2014, 10:58 AM
RE: What are "feelings" and "emotion"?
(01-11-2014 10:55 AM)Wolfbitn Wrote:  The people in the study groups were given several pictures... Only the pictures of the lovers of the participants produces the changes, as the rest of the pictures weren't of an emotional nature. The chemical reactions produced, emerged only AFTER the initial feeling, which was instantly generated by the picture. The chemical reactions occurred only afterward on a consistent basis with no exception ever mentioned. Read it for yourself, it says exactly what I'm telling you it says. Smile

*Nods* Okay... but beyond telling me what it says... can you tell me what it says about the MECHANISM for the pictures to give the feelings?

Simply saying "The pictures did it"... is not very informative. What do your links say about the way/mechanism that the pictures did what they did?


Much cheers to all.
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01-11-2014, 11:00 AM
RE: What are "feelings" and "emotion"?
(01-11-2014 10:52 AM)Mathilda Wrote:  
(01-11-2014 10:43 AM)Wolfbitn Wrote:  In the voles it was the act of mating, preceded by the "urge" or "desire" or "feeling" to mate, that then went on to produce a 50 percent increase in the female's dopamine levels within the brain... as a "reward system". It's very clear.

Wrong. Both hunger and reward are considered feelings. So one feeling led to an action which led to another feeling.

http://www.thethinkingatheist.com/forum/...#pid675746

http://www.thethinkingatheist.com/forum/...#pid675775

Dont post threads here for me to read... iv way too much to do, and I will not be clicking into them... be credible enough to provide quotes from actual scientific studies as I have for you.

(01-11-2014 10:43 AM)Wolfbitn Wrote:  The photo study was even more revealing. While brains were monitored, over a period of hours, groups were given pictures and allowed to look at them for several minutes. The FEELINGS produced by pictures of lovers then caused the chemical/electrical reactions. They specifically use the word "cause". It is very clear.

Quote:Wrong.

So says your opinion minus anything credible, in the face of 4 articles and 2 scientific studies provided by me. If "no" and "wrong" are all youre able to produce, my suggestion would be go study and find a source to try to gain a bit of credibility.
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01-11-2014, 11:02 AM
RE: What are "feelings" and "emotion"?
(01-11-2014 10:58 AM)Peebothuhul Wrote:  
(01-11-2014 10:55 AM)Wolfbitn Wrote:  The people in the study groups were given several pictures... Only the pictures of the lovers of the participants produces the changes, as the rest of the pictures weren't of an emotional nature. The chemical reactions produced, emerged only AFTER the initial feeling, which was instantly generated by the picture. The chemical reactions occurred only afterward on a consistent basis with no exception ever mentioned. Read it for yourself, it says exactly what I'm telling you it says. Smile

*Nods* Okay... but beyond telling me what it says... can you tell me what it says about the MECHANISM for the pictures to give the feelings?

Simply saying "The pictures did it"... is not very informative. What do your links say about the way/mechanism that the pictures did what they did?


Much cheers to all.

I DID tell you... they were pictures of lovers which provoked the immediate response. The pics of the other people shown them produced nothing... the emotion or feeling of the pics of the lovers were what caused the reactions... none others. You don't "feel" anything when looking at pics of someone youre infatuated with? These people did and I imagine you would too Wink

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01-11-2014, 11:04 AM
RE: What are "feelings" and "emotion"?
(01-11-2014 10:57 AM)Mathilda Wrote:  
(01-11-2014 10:50 AM)Wolfbitn Wrote:  The chemical reactions did not occur until AFTER the feeling.
You don't even try explaining why a feeling would cause a 'chemical reaction'. Even the use of the phrase 'chemical reaction' shows that you don't understand what is going on. Neurochemicals are being released by neurons.

Why would a feeling release neurochemicals? What is the purpose of the dopamine?

I don't need to explain why... All I need do is show you it did. And I did, so deal with it Smile

Now go get a source to back you... why do you have to continually be told? You have none?
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01-11-2014, 11:08 AM
RE: What are "feelings" and "emotion"?
(01-11-2014 11:02 AM)Wolfbitn Wrote:  
(01-11-2014 10:58 AM)Peebothuhul Wrote:  *Nods* Okay... but beyond telling me what it says... can you tell me what it says about the MECHANISM for the pictures to give the feelings?

Simply saying "The pictures did it"... is not very informative. What do your links say about the way/mechanism that the pictures did what they did?


Much cheers to all.

I DID tell you... they were pictures of lovers which provoked the immediate response. The pics of the other people shown them produced nothing... the emotion or feeling of the pics of the lovers were what caused the reactions... none others. You don't "feel" anything when looking at pics of someone youre infatuated with? These people did and I imagine you would too Wink

.

What do you think people's disagreements with your take on this even are? You act like you're wining some argument by the fact that the people they love gave a response opposed to people they don't love.

In no place in your article does it say chemical reactions happened AFTER. Feelings you feel from the picture response are the same as chemical reactions, they are one in the same.

"Allow there to be a spectrum in all that you see" - Neil Degrasse Tyson
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01-11-2014, 11:09 AM
RE: What are "feelings" and "emotion"?
(01-11-2014 11:02 AM)Wolfbitn Wrote:  ........They were pictures of lovers which provoked the immediate response.

Yes, I understand this sentence and its implications/ramifications.

(01-11-2014 11:02 AM)Wolfbitn Wrote:  The pics of the other people shown them produced nothing...

Yes, I understand this sentence and its implications/ramifications.

(01-11-2014 11:02 AM)Wolfbitn Wrote:  The emotion or feeling of the pics of the lovers were what caused the reactions... none others.

So... the feelings are what produced the feelings? Consider
Again, I fail to see what is so strange/mysterious about this.

(01-11-2014 11:02 AM)Wolfbitn Wrote:  You don't "feel" anything when looking at pics of someone you're infatuated with? These people did and I imagine you would too Wink

This sentence... does not seem to be needed.

Again, in regards to the pictures and their production of feelings (Which seems to be your position. Correct me if I am wrong) what is the MECHANISM for the pictures to produce the feelings?

So far you've simply re-iterated that the pictures produced the feelings. Then added a sentence that feelings produced the feelings.

You've read your links and seem to be saying you understand them. Please explain the mechanism detailed in said links of said pictures producing feelings.


Much cheers to all.
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