Poll: What year do you think atheism will become the global majority
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What date do you estimate atheism will overtake theism in the world population
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14-09-2017, 04:22 AM (This post was last modified: 14-09-2017 04:34 AM by Thoreauvian.)
RE: What date do you estimate atheism will overtake theism in the world population
(13-09-2017 07:08 PM)mordant Wrote:  Maybe the question then becomes, is there any point in unbelievers arguing against theism. Is this a quixotic enterprise, or do we carry some sort of noble torch for humanity?

The way I see it, we should be honest no matter what happens.

What scientists have already discovered will slowly sink into the awareness of the general public. About the universe, about human psychology, about evolution. (So scientists and journalists are doing a good job of fighting our battles for us.)

When the science sinks in, atheism is only a step away.
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14-09-2017, 05:32 AM
RE: What date do you estimate atheism will overtake theism in the world population
(14-09-2017 04:22 AM)Thoreauvian Wrote:  The way I see it, we should be honest no matter what happens.

What scientists have already discovered will slowly sink into the awareness of the general public. About the universe, about human psychology, about evolution. (So scientists and journalists are doing a good job of fighting our battles for us.)

When the science sinks in, atheism is only a step away.

Thing is though.. Science is not in the business of offering out comfort blankets, there is no benefit involved in only accepting proven facts.

Get your own bleeding hymn book
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14-09-2017, 06:09 AM
RE: What date do you estimate atheism will overtake theism in the world population
(14-09-2017 05:32 AM)Thedemonbarber Wrote:  Science is not in the business of offering out comfort blankets, there is no benefit involved in only accepting proven facts.

So you think most humans are only motivated by personal profit?

I would think that since so many of us now have our basic needs met, we have the time to consider other interests.
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14-09-2017, 07:29 AM
RE: What date do you estimate atheism will overtake theism in the world population
(14-09-2017 06:09 AM)Thoreauvian Wrote:  So you think most humans are only motivated by personal profit?

I would think that since so many of us now have our basic needs met, we have the time to consider other interests.

I just think that science is at a disadvantage, religion is still able to 'Get them while they are young' science then has to break into the indoctrinated mind and in some ways repair the damage. Children should always be taught facts as facts, and faith schools should be closed down, religion should never be taught as truth under any circumstance.

Religion just preys on our fears and our self preservation instincts, it's a cancer that has been allowed to flourish for far to long, and we need a cure finding to stamp it out for good.

Get your own bleeding hymn book
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14-09-2017, 09:14 AM
RE: What date do you estimate atheism will overtake theism in the world population
(14-09-2017 07:29 AM)Thedemonbarber Wrote:  
(14-09-2017 06:09 AM)Thoreauvian Wrote:  So you think most humans are only motivated by personal profit?

I would think that since so many of us now have our basic needs met, we have the time to consider other interests.

I just think that science is at a disadvantage, religion is still able to 'Get them while they are young' science then has to break into the indoctrinated mind and in some ways repair the damage. Children should always be taught facts as facts, and faith schools should be closed down, religion should never be taught as truth under any circumstance.

Religion just preys on our fears and our self preservation instincts, it's a cancer that has been allowed to flourish for far to long, and we need a cure finding to stamp it out for good.

> “The human race has suffered for centuries and is still suffering from the mental disorder known as religion, and atheism is the only physician that will be able to effect a permanent cure.” (Joseph Lewis) Consider
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14-09-2017, 04:46 PM
RE: What date do you estimate atheism will overtake theism in the world population
(14-09-2017 04:22 AM)Thoreauvian Wrote:  The way I see it, we should be honest no matter what happens.

What scientists have already discovered will slowly sink into the awareness of the general public. About the universe, about human psychology, about evolution. (So scientists and journalists are doing a good job of fighting our battles for us.)

When the science sinks in, atheism is only a step away.


This is utter cringe.

70% of the nones don't even have a college degree, so whatever one might think is a cause for their rise it's unlikely to be attributable to raised scientific awareness.

I know atheists have a tendency towards a idealized narrative, of truth and science paving the way for unbelievers, but the actual reality is not as romantic, the loss of religion more the result of losing it's luster, acquiring repulsion, more than anything else. There's a significantly higher percentage of the LGBT community that are non-religious/atheists, than the general population, and this isn't because they're more scientifically enlightened.

"Tell me, muse, of the storyteller who has been thrust to the edge of the world, both an infant and an ancient, and through him reveal everyman." ---Homer the aged poet.

"In Him was life, and the life was the Light of men. The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it."
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14-09-2017, 05:37 PM
RE: What date do you estimate atheism will overtake theism in the world population
(14-09-2017 04:46 PM)Tomasia Wrote:  70% of the nones don't even have a college degree, so whatever one might think is a cause for their rise it's unlikely to be attributable to raised scientific awareness.

Science is not just acquired in college. It permiates our culture now, and is easily available on-line, on television, and through books and lectures.

I never got a college degree but still found the lectures I bought from the Teaching Company very helpful in approaching atheism. I listened to them during my long commutes.
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14-09-2017, 06:08 PM
RE: What date do you estimate atheism will overtake theism in the world population
(14-09-2017 04:46 PM)Tomasia Wrote:  
(14-09-2017 04:22 AM)Thoreauvian Wrote:  The way I see it, we should be honest no matter what happens.

What scientists have already discovered will slowly sink into the awareness of the general public. About the universe, about human psychology, about evolution. (So scientists and journalists are doing a good job of fighting our battles for us.)

When the science sinks in, atheism is only a step away.


This is utter cringe.

70% of the nones don't even have a college degree, so whatever one might think is a cause for their rise it's unlikely to be attributable to raised scientific awareness.

> Citation needed.
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14-09-2017, 07:36 PM
RE: What date do you estimate atheism will overtake theism in the world population
(14-09-2017 04:46 PM)Tomasia Wrote:  70% of the nones don't even have a college degree, so whatever one might think is a cause for their rise it's unlikely to be attributable to raised scientific awareness.

This is true for Australia; at our 2016 federal census, 31% of people aged 20 years and over with a postgraduate degree reported no religion. But a degree or lack thereof is a very poor metric for judging a person's intellectual capabilities and/or their scientific "awareness". If you're implying that nearly 70% of the nones are scientifically unaware then you don't know what you're talking about—certainly with regard to Australia.

A study based on data collected as part of the General Social Survey by researchers at the National Opinion Research Center (NORC) at the University of Chicago reports that 60.6% of people in the US believe in the existence of God, whilst here in Australia, only 24.9% are believers. Using your kind of "logic", this would mean that Australians are far more scientifically aware than Americans would it not? (Which of course we're not.)

Quote:I know atheists have a tendency towards a idealized narrative, of truth and science paving the way for unbelievers, but the actual reality is not as romantic...

You know of this idealisation how? And of course atheists attest unequivocally to the principles of "truth and science"! That's a large part of what defines us as atheists. In fact it's the theists who in actuality hold an "idealised" narrative of the world, believing as they do in supernatural entities and paranormal phenomena in order to "explain" things such as so-called miracles, faith healing, intelligent design, or the effects of prayer.

Quote:...the loss of religion more the result of losing it's luster, acquiring repulsion, more than anything else.

I'm not even sure I know what you're getting at this? Of course religion is losing its luster (whatever that is?) in an enlightened 21st century, and is being rejected by a more scientifically aware population. In Australia at our first federal census in 1901, around 98% of the population were Christian; in 2016 that figure was 52.1%.

Quote:There's a significantly higher percentage of the LGBT community that are non-religious/atheists, than the general population, and this isn't because they're more scientifically enlightened.

This may be the case, but it's totally irrelevant to... well... anything at all LOL.

I'm a creationist... I believe that man created God.
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17-09-2017, 12:52 PM
RE: What date do you estimate atheism will overtake theism in the world population
(14-09-2017 05:37 PM)Thoreauvian Wrote:  
(14-09-2017 04:46 PM)Tomasia Wrote:  70% of the nones don't even have a college degree, so whatever one might think is a cause for their rise it's unlikely to be attributable to raised scientific awareness.

Science is not just acquired in college. It permiates our culture now, and is easily available on-line, on television, and through books and lectures.

I never got a college degree but still found the lectures I bought from the Teaching Company very helpful in approaching atheism. I listened to them during my long commutes.
Despite being a senior software architect / developer / independent consultant for about a third of a century and published author I also do not have a degree. I entered the IT world at a fortuitous time where it was possible to do so as an autodidact and taking the time for a degree was both unnecessary and wasted money / opportunity. There are many people like me abroad in the world. My father took the same path, he was a master mechanic on both autos and later on aircraft and rebuilt both from the ground up when need be, had training in metallurgy and other difficult subjects, held an instrument rating and yet as one of a dozen children of a farm family he dropped out of formal school in the sixth grade.

So ... indeed there are a lot of people who didn't take the "normal" formalized standard track to their personal expertise and yet are every bit as aware of science and the scientific method as any college graduate. Particularly in the 21st century where you can audit classes at MIT and Ivy League and other top schools for free.
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