What do we know?
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26-10-2013, 04:03 PM
RE: What do we know?
(26-10-2013 02:43 PM)The_Thinking_Theist Wrote:  
(26-10-2013 02:28 PM)Ameron1963 Wrote:  Also. Evolution don't begin with that weird fish that walked out of the primordial sea. We don't really know where the thing started. Some folks say the ":Big Bang". Some of us less well educated folks wonder if it weren't before that!

You're not like I thought you were! You're cool!

Did you know that one panda needs 60 acres of bamboo per day to survive?

Imagine that times two for 40 days!

Not to mention, indeed, the shit.

I seriously doubt that. Do you have a credible source for that?

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Science is not a subject, but a method.
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26-10-2013, 04:08 PM
RE: What do we know?
(26-10-2013 04:03 PM)Chas Wrote:  
(26-10-2013 02:43 PM)The_Thinking_Theist Wrote:  You're not like I thought you were! You're cool!

Did you know that one panda needs 60 acres of bamboo per day to survive?

Imagine that times two for 40 days!

Not to mention, indeed, the shit.

I seriously doubt that. Do you have a credible source for that?

Because giant pandas are unable to efficiently digest bamboo and thus absorb only a small percentage of the nutrients in it, they must consume vast amounts of it in order to ensure that they get enough nutrients. A wild panda spends about 12 to 16 hours a day feeding and may eat up to 40 lb of bamboo daily, sometimes even more.

http://www.pandasinternational.org/

http://www.northrup.org/photos/Panda/

http://www.abc-kid.com/panda/

and also I meant 60 per week
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26-10-2013, 05:11 PM (This post was last modified: 26-10-2013 05:23 PM by kim.)
RE: What do we know?
(26-10-2013 04:00 PM)Chas Wrote:  No, I don't believe that is correct.

Our digestive system and our dentition are those of omnivores. We are midway between carnivores and herbivores in both. Our ape-like ancestors were likely omnivores who ate more plants than meat, but (long) before that there may have been insectivores in our past.

Lactose intolerance is the norm for (adult) mammals. The gene for producing lactase (to process lactose) switches off fairly early in life. The ability to continue consuming lactose is a mutation that leaves that gene 'on'. It appeared rather recently in humans - about 10,000 years ago. Its spread is due to the benefit it provides with another source of nutrition.

Sorry, guess I should have clarified; our prehuman ancestors were vegetarian. Yes, once we became omnivorous, this enabled the brains of our prehuman ancestors to grow dramatically over a period of a few million years while our primate cousins remain vegetarian.
And we have an appendix...
The human appendix has been proposed to be a vestigial structure, a structure that has lost all or most of its original function through the process of evolution. The vermiform appendix has been proposed to be the shrunken remainder of the cecum that was found in a remote ancestor of humans. Ceca, which are found in the digestive tracts of many extant herbivores, house mutualistic bacteria which help animals digest the cellulose molecules that are found in plants.

According to what I've read, lactose intolerance is a genetically-determined characteristic. Would that not mean it could be a result of evolution? Or is this something too soon to know?

From wikipedia -
Most mammals normally cease to produce lactase, becoming lactose intolerant, after weaning, but some human populations have developed lactase persistence, in which lactase production continues into adulthood. It is estimated that 75% of adults worldwide show some decrease in lactase activity during adulthood. The frequency of decreased lactase activity ranges from 5% in northern Europe through 71% for Sicily to more than 90% in some African and Asian countries. This distribution is now thought to have been caused by recent natural selection favoring lactase-persistent individuals in cultures in which dairy products are available as a food source. While it was first thought that this would mean that populations in Europe, India, Arabia and Africa had high frequencies of lactase persistence because of a particular mutation, it was later shown that lactase persistence is caused by several independently occurring mutations.

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26-10-2013, 05:25 PM
RE: What do we know?
(26-10-2013 05:11 PM)kim Wrote:  
(26-10-2013 04:00 PM)Chas Wrote:  No, I don't believe that is correct.

Our digestive system and our dentition are those of omnivores. We are midway between carnivores and herbivores in both. Our ape-like ancestors were likely omnivores who ate more plants than meat, but (long) before that there may have been insectivores in our past.

Lactose intolerance is the norm for (adult) mammals. The gene for producing lactase (to process lactose) switches off fairly early in life. The ability to continue consuming lactose is a mutation that leaves that gene 'on'. It appeared rather recently in humans - about 10,000 years ago. Its spread is due to the benefit it provides with another source of nutrition.

Sorry, guess I should have clarified; our prehuman ancestors were vegetarian. Yes, once we became omnivorous, this enabled the brains of our prehuman ancestors to grow dramatically over a period of a few million years while our primate cousins remain vegetarian.

According to what I've read, lactose intolerance is a genetically-determined characteristic. Would that not mean it could be a result of evolution? Or is this something too soon to know?

From wikipedia -
Most mammals normally cease to produce lactase, becoming lactose intolerant, after weaning, but some human populations have developed lactase persistence, in which lactase production continues into adulthood. It is estimated that 75% of adults worldwide show some decrease in lactase activity during adulthood. The frequency of decreased lactase activity ranges from 5% in northern Europe through 71% for Sicily to more than 90% in some African and Asian countries. This distribution is now thought to have been caused by recent natural selection favoring lactase-persistent individuals in cultures in which dairy products are available as a food source. While it was first thought that this would mean that populations in Europe, India, Arabia and Africa had high frequencies of lactase persistence because of a particular mutation, it was later shown that lactase persistence is caused by several independently occurring mutations.

Well, yes - lactose intolerance is the result of evolution; and so is lactose tolerance.

One thing that is observed widely is that genes turn on and off at various times to drive development. Mammals evolved not consuming lactose after being weaned, so the mutation that led to that gene turning off became widespread. It is a selective advantage to not produce useless chemicals, the energy is best used otherwise.

The mutation that kept that gene turned on recently became widespread in humans with the advent of herding milk-producing animals. There is a selective advantage to having an additional food source.

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26-10-2013, 05:32 PM
RE: What do we know?
Wow - this is cool!
I just found this while brushing up on the appendix!!

Quote:In a more recent paper, the appendix was found to have evolved at least 32 times (and perhaps as many as 38 times) and to have been lost no more than six times. This suggests that the cecal appendix has a selective advantage in many situations and argues strongly against its vestigial nature. This complex evolutionary history of the appendix, along with a great heterogeneity in its evolutionary rate in various taxa, suggests that it is a recurrent trait.

Wow - evidently this is from a paper published this year! Damn, science is getting good at fucking with my education. Thumbsup

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26-10-2013, 06:01 PM
RE: What do we know?
(26-10-2013 04:08 PM)The_Thinking_Theist Wrote:  
(26-10-2013 04:03 PM)Chas Wrote:  I seriously doubt that. Do you have a credible source for that?

Because giant pandas are unable to efficiently digest bamboo and thus absorb only a small percentage of the nutrients in it, they must consume vast amounts of it in order to ensure that they get enough nutrients. A wild panda spends about 12 to 16 hours a day feeding and may eat up to 40 lb of bamboo daily, sometimes even more.

http://www.pandasinternational.org/

http://www.northrup.org/photos/Panda/

http://www.abc-kid.com/panda/

and also I meant 60 per week

... Can we please just let the panda's die off?
The fuckers barely ever breed and the only thing they eat, they are shit at actually using; how they survived this long is beyond me...

The people closely associated with the namesake of female canines are suffering from a nondescript form of lunacy.
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26-10-2013, 06:04 PM
RE: What do we know?
(26-10-2013 06:01 PM)Free Thought Wrote:  
(26-10-2013 04:08 PM)The_Thinking_Theist Wrote:  Because giant pandas are unable to efficiently digest bamboo and thus absorb only a small percentage of the nutrients in it, they must consume vast amounts of it in order to ensure that they get enough nutrients. A wild panda spends about 12 to 16 hours a day feeding and may eat up to 40 lb of bamboo daily, sometimes even more.

http://www.pandasinternational.org/

http://www.northrup.org/photos/Panda/

http://www.abc-kid.com/panda/

and also I meant 60 per week

... Can we please just let the panda's die off?
The fuckers barely ever breed and the only thing they eat, they are shit at actually using; how they survived this long is beyond me...

Damn it dude, every time I read your user I think I'm reading 'Deep Thought'!

"What is the answer to..."
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26-10-2013, 07:31 PM
RE: What do we know?
(26-10-2013 06:04 PM)The_Thinking_Theist Wrote:  
(26-10-2013 06:01 PM)Free Thought Wrote:  ... Can we please just let the panda's die off?
The fuckers barely ever breed and the only thing they eat, they are shit at actually using; how they survived this long is beyond me...

Damn it dude, every time I read your user I think I'm reading 'Deep Thought'!

"What is the answer to..."

Not the first person to think that.

The people closely associated with the namesake of female canines are suffering from a nondescript form of lunacy.
"Anti-environmentalism is like standing in front of a forest and going 'quick kill them they're coming right for us!'" - Jake Farr-Wharton, The Imaginary Friend Show.
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26-10-2013, 07:35 PM
RE: What do we know?
(26-10-2013 07:31 PM)Free Thought Wrote:  
(26-10-2013 06:04 PM)The_Thinking_Theist Wrote:  Damn it dude, every time I read your user I think I'm reading 'Deep Thought'!

"What is the answer to..."

Not the first person to think that.

Definitely not the last. Laughat

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26-10-2013, 07:38 PM
RE: What do we know?
(26-10-2013 07:31 PM)Free Thought Wrote:  
(26-10-2013 06:04 PM)The_Thinking_Theist Wrote:  Damn it dude, every time I read your user I think I'm reading 'Deep Thought'!

"What is the answer to..."

Not the first person to think that.

This is even more weird ... I usually know people around here by their avatar. The other day, a friend of mine on facebook posted the the Jesus facepalm pic and I all I could think of was Free Thought!! Big Grin

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