What does it mean to be "Spiritual but not Religious"?
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20-09-2017, 03:03 PM
RE: What does it mean to be "Spiritual but not Religious"?
(20-09-2017 02:12 PM)DLJ Wrote:  
(20-09-2017 10:58 AM)GirlyMan Wrote:  Think Alzheimer's, except the brain still functions properly, it just don't feel like playing the game.

Right. And what's the difference, from an onlooker's perspective, between not playing ("annulment of the attacher") and detachment?

Seems like the same thing from over here.

Unsure

Detachment requires a conscious effort. Unattachment does not. An analogy might be trying to pry apart two things glued together compared to just letting the glue dissolve. Consider Maybe.

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20-09-2017, 03:10 PM
RE: What does it mean to be "Spiritual but not Religious"?
(20-09-2017 01:37 PM)jennybee Wrote:  
(20-09-2017 01:28 PM)Grasshopper Wrote:  I think a lot of religious teachings are useful and valuable as a way to lead better, healthier lives -- they just happen to be tangled up in woo (apologies to Bob Dylan). That doesn't make them worthless. I know Aliza has said this about Judaism, and I have experienced some of the same sort of thing with the Catholicism that I was brought up in. Yeah, the dogma is basically bullshit, but many of the things that Catholics do (as opposed to what they believe) are useful things to do whether or not you're religious. I don't see why Hinduism and Buddhism and Zen would be any different. No need to throw out the baby with the bathwater.



There are also atheists that celebrate traditional Jewish and Xtian holidays. For me, I (and I know several other atheists on here) celebrate Xmas, Halloween, St. Pat's, Valentine's, Easter, and so on. All of those are religious-based. So should we not celebrate if we choose to since we are no longer praying or celebrating a god? Are we being religious because we are celebrating them even without any sort of belief?

I think there are aspects of traditional religious holidays that are nice such as spending time with family, Christmas lights, buying gifts for people you care about, sitting around a stocking decorated fireplace with some hot peppermint tea. I even like some Xmas music. It is possible to extract the religion from the act of doing something. To me, being an atheist, is just that, free to live how we choose, do as we choose, use philosophies that (we feel) benefit our lives as we choose.

We aren't talking about a non-believer's life philosophy when talking about putting up a Christmas tree, are we? It's a Hallmark moment and no one is concerned about their chakras based on an ancient text.

See here they are the bruises some were self-inflicted and some showed up along the way. - JF
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20-09-2017, 03:33 PM (This post was last modified: 20-09-2017 03:39 PM by GirlyMan.)
RE: What does it mean to be "Spiritual but not Religious"?
(20-09-2017 12:56 PM)MrCrowley Wrote:  No such thing as the spirit, and therefore spirituality resides on the same level as religiosity: moronic.

There are most certainly and obviously immaterial "things". You can't show me a thought, you can enunciate it, you can re-present it, but you cannot reduce it to material constituent components. Show me an orgasm, wait don't, that's not what I meant. We know, for example, that male orgasms cannot be reduced to electrical EEG signals. The burden is on materialists to demonstrate exactly what material components a thought reduces to, and they, above all, are not allowed to speculate. Show me the reduction of an orgasm to its material components in precise formulaic terms. Oh, and mine better reduce by the same formula as yours or you still haven't fully described the thought in material terms. Materialists contend that theirs is the only rational position to take, but when asked to demonstrate it, they fail. They claim they won't always fail, it's just a matter of time. I say, why should I believe you?

I used to be a materialist, and then I took some angel dust to the knee.

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20-09-2017, 03:38 PM
RE: What does it mean to be "Spiritual but not Religious"?
(20-09-2017 03:03 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  
(20-09-2017 02:12 PM)DLJ Wrote:  Right. And what's the difference, from an onlooker's perspective, between not playing ("annulment of the attacher") and detachment?

Seems like the same thing from over here.

Unsure

Detachment requires a conscious effort. Unattachment does not. An analogy might be trying to pry apart two things glued together compared to just letting the glue dissolve. Consider Maybe.

Did you use Spirit Gum? Laughat

Angel

So the casual observer won't see any difference, but the patient observer would see a rapid change or a slow dissolve.

Effort-wise, someone like yourself, so close to √úbermensch, should be able to detach at a flick of a switch, no? Just change a one to a zero and up goes the firewall.
Around Layer 5 of the OSI Model, methinks.

Unless that is, your mind has only hubs and no bridges or switches in which case you'll have some compartmentalising to do.

Consider

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20-09-2017, 03:43 PM
RE: What does it mean to be "Spiritual but not Religious"?
(20-09-2017 03:10 PM)Anjele Wrote:  
(20-09-2017 01:37 PM)jennybee Wrote:  There are also atheists that celebrate traditional Jewish and Xtian holidays. For me, I (and I know several other atheists on here) celebrate Xmas, Halloween, St. Pat's, Valentine's, Easter, and so on. All of those are religious-based. So should we not celebrate if we choose to since we are no longer praying or celebrating a god? Are we being religious because we are celebrating them even without any sort of belief?

I think there are aspects of traditional religious holidays that are nice such as spending time with family, Christmas lights, buying gifts for people you care about, sitting around a stocking decorated fireplace with some hot peppermint tea. I even like some Xmas music. It is possible to extract the religion from the act of doing something. To me, being an atheist, is just that, free to live how we choose, do as we choose, use philosophies that (we feel) benefit our lives as we choose.

We aren't talking about a non-believer's life philosophy when talking about putting up a Christmas tree, are we? It's a Hallmark moment and no one is concerned about their chakras based on an ancient text.

As I've said, I'm not concerned about chakras as energy centers either. I just use them as a focal point in meditation sometimes as I do many different types/styles of meditation. It's just one of the many meditations I do. I use chakras just because (I've found) it helps my mind focus on a particular point during meditation and for no other reason. I also sometimes focus on certain current song lyrics. Meditation can take pretty much any form as long as you focus your mind on one point. That's really all meditation is.

As I've said before, the parts of the ancient texts that I do use have to do with health and wellness. So, much like having an atheist Hallmark Xmas moment, there really is nothing religious taking place because, like in an atheist Xmas moment, I am not paying homage to a deity. I'm simply using some traditions that I like and find helpful to me in my life in terms of health and wellness. Just like an atheist might use some Xtian aspects of Xmas that they find pleasing to them. In both cases, neither atheist is believing or paying homage to a deity. So there really is zero woo involved.

"Let the waters settle and you will see the moon and stars mirrored in your own being." -Rumi
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20-09-2017, 03:45 PM
RE: What does it mean to be "Spiritual but not Religious"?
(20-09-2017 03:43 PM)jennybee Wrote:  
(20-09-2017 03:10 PM)Anjele Wrote:  We aren't talking about a non-believer's life philosophy when talking about putting up a Christmas tree, are we? It's a Hallmark moment and no one is concerned about their chakras based on an ancient text.

As I've said, I'm not concerned about chakras as energy centers either. I just use them as a focal point in meditation sometimes as I do many different types/styles of meditation. It's just one of the many meditations I do. I use chakras just because (I've found) it helps my mind focus on a particular point during meditation and for no other reason. I also sometimes focus on certain current song lyrics. Meditation can take pretty much any form as long as you focus your mind on one point. That's really all meditation is.

As I've said before, the parts of the ancient texts that I do use have to do with health and wellness. So, much like having an atheist Hallmark Xmas moment, there really is nothing religious taking place because, like in an atheist Xmas moment, I am not paying homage to a deity. I'm simply using some traditions that I like and find helpful to me in my life in terms of health and wellness. Just like an atheist might use some Xtian aspects of Xmas that they find pleasing to them. In both cases, neither atheist is believing or paying homage to a deity. So there really is zero woo involved.

Yet the need to classify yourself as a 'spiritual' atheist is there.

See here they are the bruises some were self-inflicted and some showed up along the way. - JF
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20-09-2017, 03:53 PM
RE: What does it mean to be "Spiritual but not Religious"?
(20-09-2017 03:38 PM)DLJ Wrote:  
(20-09-2017 03:03 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  Detachment requires a conscious effort. Unattachment does not. An analogy might be trying to pry apart two things glued together compared to just letting the glue dissolve. Consider Maybe.
Effort-wise, someone like yourself, so close to √úbermensch, should be able to detach at a flick of a switch, no? Just change a one to a zero and up goes the firewall.
Around Layer 5 of the OSI Model, methinks.

I can. Yes, OSI stack is a better analogy. Cut off everything above layer 4. I've done it. Many times. Trying to keep this session open long enough to shut down layer 5 gracefully. Mainly so I can get paid by the US taxpayers to sit around dicking with layer 1 just for shits and giggles. (This DMT shit is pretty interesting, total dissociation, but only for 15 minutes and then wham, you're back.) You don't know how gratifying and satisfying it is to me that in 10 months LDH will be paying me 6 figures to sit around and get stoned. This is why I waited 40 years. Smile

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20-09-2017, 03:55 PM
RE: What does it mean to be "Spiritual but not Religious"?
(20-09-2017 03:45 PM)Anjele Wrote:  
(20-09-2017 03:43 PM)jennybee Wrote:  As I've said, I'm not concerned about chakras as energy centers either. I just use them as a focal point in meditation sometimes as I do many different types/styles of meditation. It's just one of the many meditations I do. I use chakras just because (I've found) it helps my mind focus on a particular point during meditation and for no other reason. I also sometimes focus on certain current song lyrics. Meditation can take pretty much any form as long as you focus your mind on one point. That's really all meditation is.

As I've said before, the parts of the ancient texts that I do use have to do with health and wellness. So, much like having an atheist Hallmark Xmas moment, there really is nothing religious taking place because, like in an atheist Xmas moment, I am not paying homage to a deity. I'm simply using some traditions that I like and find helpful to me in my life in terms of health and wellness. Just like an atheist might use some Xtian aspects of Xmas that they find pleasing to them. In both cases, neither atheist is believing or paying homage to a deity. So there really is zero woo involved.

Yet the need to classify yourself as a 'spiritual' atheist is there.

Like I mentioned earlier in the thread, I don't come out and tell everyone I'm an atheist or spiritual atheist or cultural xtian atheist. I don't like labels so I don't typically categorize myself as anything. It's only when I'm asked what my "beliefs" are and then I will say "spiritual atheist." And the reason I use that term is because, as others have mentioned, it's kind of a loose term, with multiple definitions--one of which (via the dictionary) is "affecting the human spirit." And like "spirituality," the term "spirit" also has multiple dictionary definitions, one of which is "those qualities regarded as forming the definitive or typical elements in the character of a person."

As such, in keeping with these loose definitions, I choose to use the word spiritual atheist because: Yoga--the exercises, health, wellness aspects, and philosophy affect who I am as a person. And atheist because I don't believe in or practice woo. And I use this term as mentioned previosuly simply for simplicity sake. Because otherwise I have to go into a whole monologue about I'm an atheist who has implemented some aspects of yogic texts into the way I live my life, etc etc etc and so on and so forth. I just find it easier to say "spiritual atheist."

"Let the waters settle and you will see the moon and stars mirrored in your own being." -Rumi
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20-09-2017, 04:00 PM
RE: What does it mean to be "Spiritual but not Religious"?
(20-09-2017 03:55 PM)jennybee Wrote:  
(20-09-2017 03:45 PM)Anjele Wrote:  Yet the need to classify yourself as a 'spiritual' atheist is there.

Like I mentioned earlier in the thread, I don't come out and tell everyone I'm an atheist or spiritual atheist or cultural xtian atheist. I don't like labels so I don't typically categorize myself as anything. It's only when I'm asked what my "beliefs" are and then I will say "spiritual atheist." And the reason I use that term is because, as others have mentioned, it's kind of a loose term, with multiple definitions--one of which (via the dictionary) is "affecting the human spirit." And like "spirituality," the term "spirit" also has multiple dictionary definitions, one of which is "those qualities regarded as forming the definitive or typical elements in the character of a person."

As such, in keeping with these loose definitions, I choose to use the word spiritual atheist because: Yoga--the exercises, health, wellness aspects, and philosophy affect who I am as a person. And atheist because I don't believe in or practice woo. And I use this term as mentioned previosuly simply for simplicity sake. Because otherwise I have to go into a whole monologue about I'm an atheist who has implemented some aspects of yogic texts into the way I live my life, etc etc etc and so on and so forth. I just find it easier to say "spiritual atheist."

It's certainly not 'simple' though adding 'spiritual' may be softer.

Call yourself what you will but don't pretend that woo isn't a part of it. And I have read the previous posts and don't need any of it repeated...it's pretty clear.

See here they are the bruises some were self-inflicted and some showed up along the way. - JF
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20-09-2017, 04:01 PM
RE: What does it mean to be "Spiritual but not Religious"?
(20-09-2017 03:38 PM)DLJ Wrote:  
(20-09-2017 03:03 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  Detachment requires a conscious effort. Unattachment does not. An analogy might be trying to pry apart two things glued together compared to just letting the glue dissolve. Consider Maybe.

Did you use Spirit Gum? Laughat

Ha! Where's the little Kiwi looking to start an import/export empire? Maori spirit gum in different flavors with different Maori god names, Maori fruits, and tattoos. ... Consider Actually, he might be able to start something like that for as little as $10K. He'd have to surrender his water rights first, obviously.

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