What does it mean to change your goals?
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22-10-2015, 12:51 PM
What does it mean to change your goals?
It is a proven mathematical theorem that a strict goal achieving agents cannot change it's goal by itself, for an example an ai whose primary purpose is to collect the largest ammounts of stamps possible cannot suddenly decide it wants to take over the world, but, if it's goal was something more abstract and collecting stamps was an objective it computed would achieve that goal it could change that sub goal if it became more convinient.

Formally

Goal-orientated agent has aim A

Whilst pursuing A it cannot change it's aim to say, objective Z because this would not assist in achieving A, however, if A1 was an objective that the agent thought would help achieve A and A2 could be deomonstrated to acheive A better than A1 the goal orientated agent would switch to attempting to achieve A2.

So, when a human changes their mind, what is the base aim of humans then? What is it that we change our mind in relation to, when we stop believing in God for example, what A does Belief not satisfy that non-belief doesn't?

Further, though the aim of an agent can't be changed by the agent itself, it can be changed by external forces changing the agent. So as a human is externally physically and chemically alterable, what does it say about us if we

A. Cannot change "primary goals" consciously and

B. Can have our most basic desires changed by external processes

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22-10-2015, 01:55 PM
RE: What does it mean to change your goals?
(22-10-2015 12:51 PM)tear151 Wrote:  So, when a human changes their mind, what is the base aim of humans then?

Survival?

Quote:What is it that we change our mind in relation to, when we stop believing in God for example, what A does Belief not satisfy that non-belief doesn't?

Our ability to process information about the world and make decisions that will provide a potentially higher rate of survival for the human race. The belief in god(s) was simply a paradigm for understanding the world and making decisions in a way that improved our ability to survive. Now that we have more knowledge and improved information processing capability, belief in god(s) is a less useful paradigm than the scientific method for understanding the world and making decisions. In other words, for atheists, the scales have tipped in favor of science over religion being the most viable decision making framework for survival.

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22-10-2015, 05:14 PM
RE: What does it mean to change your goals?
(22-10-2015 12:51 PM)tear151 Wrote:  It is a proven mathematical theorem that a strict goal achieving agents cannot change it's goal by itself,

Show me this proof of which you speak. Gradient descent is the process of continually changing the goal. Oh and genetic algorithms.

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22-10-2015, 05:56 PM
RE: What does it mean to change your goals?
(22-10-2015 05:14 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  
(22-10-2015 12:51 PM)tear151 Wrote:  It is a proven mathematical theorem that a strict goal achieving agents cannot change it's goal by itself,

Show me this proof of which you speak. Gradient descent is the process of continually changing the goal. Oh and genetic algorithms.

Yes but then there is a higher goal to follow the Gradient Descent and with the genetic algorithm the goal to maximise the function you chose.

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22-10-2015, 06:02 PM
RE: What does it mean to change your goals?
(22-10-2015 05:56 PM)tear151 Wrote:  
(22-10-2015 05:14 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  Show me this proof of which you speak. Gradient descent is the process of continually changing the goal. Oh and genetic algorithms.

Yes but then there is a higher goal to follow the Gradient Descent and with the genetic algorithm the goal to maximise the function you chose.

I agree. Thumbsup I took my Masters in AI at JHU and am not familiar with this proof of which you speak. Show me this proof of which you speak.

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23-10-2015, 06:01 PM
RE: What does it mean to change your goals?
(22-10-2015 06:02 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  
(22-10-2015 05:56 PM)tear151 Wrote:  Yes but then there is a higher goal to follow the Gradient Descent and with the genetic algorithm the goal to maximise the function you chose.

I agree. Thumbsup I took my Masters in AI at JHU and am not familiar with this proof of which you speak. Show me this proof of which you speak.

I haven't read it, I know it exists and that's all lol, it's accepted by the general math establishment so that's enough for me lol

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23-10-2015, 06:11 PM
RE: What does it mean to change your goals?
(23-10-2015 06:01 PM)tear151 Wrote:  
(22-10-2015 06:02 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  I agree. Thumbsup I took my Masters in AI at JHU and am not familiar with this proof of which you speak. Show me this proof of which you speak.

I haven't read it, I know it exists and that's all lol, it's accepted by the general math establishment so that's enough for me lol

How do you know it exists and is accepted if you can't find or identify it? You're sounding like a goddam theist.

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13-11-2015, 02:30 AM
RE: What does it mean to change your goals?
(22-10-2015 12:51 PM)tear151 Wrote:  ... So, when a human changes their mind, what is the base aim ...

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30-11-2015, 07:24 PM
RE: What does it mean to change your goals?
A lot of factors and obstacles can come into play when one is aiming at his/her goals, though. Sometimes, our goals change based on what is happening externally around us. Out of survival, out of a number of things.

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01-12-2015, 07:47 PM
RE: What does it mean to change your goals?
(22-10-2015 12:51 PM)tear151 Wrote:  So, when a human changes their mind, what is the base aim of humans then? What is it that we change our mind in relation to, when we stop believing in God for example, what A does Belief not satisfy that non-belief doesn't?

Further, though the aim of an agent can't be changed by the agent itself, it can be changed by external forces changing the agent. So as a human is externally physically and chemically alterable, what does it say about us if we

A. Cannot change "primary goals" consciously and

B. Can have our most basic desires changed by external processes

I think the trick here, might be that you distinguish a belief vs. non-belief in God as a choice. I don't believe in God. I couldn't chose to believe in God right now if I wanted to. I think the move to go from believer to non-believer (or vice versa is a conclusion rather than an action.

As for the 2nd part, my conclusion is that we're fancy machines with some A that is a convoluted ever changing formula we're trying to maximize.

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