What exactly is Christianity
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15-06-2014, 03:02 PM
RE: What exactly is Christianity
(15-06-2014 02:44 PM)Anna Wrote:  
(15-06-2014 12:57 PM)Drunkin Druid Wrote:  Actually the OP is in the exact right place for asking such questions.
Why?
Because there seems to be quite a few people here that deal in facts and actual reality. People here do not generally base their ideas in tradition or nonsensical tales. It seems people here usually follow where the evidence leads.
Whenever for example I ask a devout Muslim about why no pigs I get "because Allah said so." I never get a real explanation. Just as I always get a magical explanation when asking about the origins of Islam itself.
The same is true when dealing with Christians or any other group that believes in magic. Asking a question of one who's judgement is clouded by faith is a great way to gain misinformation

From what I know, they say Muslims shouldn't eat pig because it wallows in its own filth and sometimes eat it too so thats that. And regarding origins of islam, its quite complicated, but it goes something like Islam started with Adam and Eve, and Abraham and Moses and Jesus were all prophets of Allah spreading the religion. I've heard that the bible mentions the coming of a last prophet and even mentions his name (but I am not sure about this) so then came Mohammed and he was the final prophet and Koran was the last of scriptures. But those who didn't accept him as a prophet and continued to follow Jesus are now called Christians. Otherwise its said that all the previous prophets were spreading the religion of Allah but some people chose to believe only Moses or Jesus and thus they are not labelled as Muslims, but they are called Ehl-e-Kitaab, meaning 'of the book'.

Yeah. The point was that I never get an actual explanation from those within the faith. All I ever get is "because god said so."
And your explanation for the origins of Islam is much like the one I get from Muslims. The problem is that they trace it back to Adam and Eve. Adam and Eve. Two fictional characters in Jewish mythology. It's like me saying I can trace my ancestry back to Achilles. No. "Islam can be traced back to Adam and Eve" is not sufficient.
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15-06-2014, 03:17 PM
RE: What exactly is Christianity
(15-06-2014 03:02 PM)Drunkin Druid Wrote:  
(15-06-2014 02:44 PM)Anna Wrote:  From what I know, they say Muslims shouldn't eat pig because it wallows in its own filth and sometimes eat it too so thats that. And regarding origins of islam, its quite complicated, but it goes something like Islam started with Adam and Eve, and Abraham and Moses and Jesus were all prophets of Allah spreading the religion. I've heard that the bible mentions the coming of a last prophet and even mentions his name (but I am not sure about this) so then came Mohammed and he was the final prophet and Koran was the last of scriptures. But those who didn't accept him as a prophet and continued to follow Jesus are now called Christians. Otherwise its said that all the previous prophets were spreading the religion of Allah but some people chose to believe only Moses or Jesus and thus they are not labelled as Muslims, but they are called Ehl-e-Kitaab, meaning 'of the book'.

Yeah. The point was that I never get an actual explanation from those within the faith. All I ever get is "because god said so."
And your explanation for the origins of Islam is much like the one I get from Muslims. The problem is that they trace it back to Adam and Eve. Adam and Eve. Two fictional characters in Jewish mythology. It's like me saying I can trace my ancestry back to Achilles. No. "Islam can be traced back to Adam and Eve" is not sufficient.

Exactly. Everything is always about Adam and Eve. Sometimes I wonder do hindus have an Adam and Eve too or does it only work for Middle East? Tongue But thats the closest you'll ever get to finding the origins of Islam, and the shorter story would be a guy (Mohammed) crawls inside a dark cave everyday for some reason then comes out and tells people he just had a revelation from god, he gets 300 people to accept what he was preaching then goes to war against those who didnt. The End!

All great truths begin as blasphemy - George Bernard Shaw
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15-06-2014, 04:02 PM
RE: What exactly is Christianity
(15-06-2014 03:17 PM)Anna Wrote:  Everything is always about Adam and Eve. Sometimes I wonder do hindus have an Adam and Eve too or does it only work for Middle East? Tongue
---

According to Hindus, they are not descendants of Adam and Eve so, "original sin" and related concepts do not effect a Hindu person.

A new type of thinking is essential if mankind is to survive and move to higher levels. ~ Albert Einstein
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15-06-2014, 04:06 PM
RE: What exactly is Christianity
(15-06-2014 03:17 PM)Anna Wrote:  
(15-06-2014 03:02 PM)Drunkin Druid Wrote:  Yeah. The point was that I never get an actual explanation from those within the faith. All I ever get is "because god said so."
And your explanation for the origins of Islam is much like the one I get from Muslims. The problem is that they trace it back to Adam and Eve. Adam and Eve. Two fictional characters in Jewish mythology. It's like me saying I can trace my ancestry back to Achilles. No. "Islam can be traced back to Adam and Eve" is not sufficient.

Exactly. Everything is always about Adam and Eve. Sometimes I wonder do hindus have an Adam and Eve too or does it only work for Middle East? Tongue But thats the closest you'll ever get to finding the origins of Islam, and the shorter story would be a guy (Mohammed) crawls inside a dark cave everyday for some reason then comes out and tells people he just had a revelation from god, he gets 300 people to accept what he was preaching then goes to war against those who didnt. The End!

Of course that explanation assumes that Muhammad actually existed. He may have I don't know but it's much more plausible.
If a person wants to know the actual origins of Islam or any religion it does no good to ask someone who presupposes that the religion is true. It's pretty likely that the person will not investigate honestly.
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15-06-2014, 04:06 PM
RE: What exactly is Christianity
(15-06-2014 10:38 AM)smileXsmileXsmile Wrote:  I've run into a lot of people in my time who say they do not take the bible literally and it is more about the morals involved. i.e. they don't literally believe that Eve came from Adam's rib but it's more of a metaphor. Can this person successfully be labeled a Christian? Why or why not? If not what would you call them?

A better question might be, what is the neccessary criteria for being a Christian?

The answers to these questions should help spark some new thought processes for me. On a side note, I think it would be cool to eventially become knowledgable in many religions so I can make a tree diagram that shows where and why each religion parts ways.

Thanks!
Jesus Christ is the true image of God sent by God, as in His Character. This True Image of God sent by God reveals a self sacrificing Love even unto death, even while forgiving those who crucify him. Obviously, since God sent a true image of Himself to believe in, we were therefore corrupted in our wills by belief in a false image upon which we reasoned right and wrong, which also corrupted the moral spirit in our souls. We therefore needed a True image of God to replace the false image we before believed in. The word Christ/Messiah actually means the True Image of God sent by God.

It doesn't matter whether the story of Adam and Eve is literal or metaphor. In spiritual terms Male/female simply means one was made from the other which means one came before the other, which then implies different perspectives based upon such circumstances.
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15-06-2014, 04:10 PM
RE: What exactly is Christianity
(15-06-2014 04:02 PM)kim Wrote:  
(15-06-2014 03:17 PM)Anna Wrote:  Everything is always about Adam and Eve. Sometimes I wonder do hindus have an Adam and Eve too or does it only work for Middle East? Tongue
---

According to Hindus, they are not descendants of Adam and Eve so, "original sin" and related concepts do not effect a Hindu person.

Hey, thanks for the info Smile

All great truths begin as blasphemy - George Bernard Shaw
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15-06-2014, 04:13 PM
RE: What exactly is Christianity
(15-06-2014 04:06 PM)childeye Wrote:  
(15-06-2014 10:38 AM)smileXsmileXsmile Wrote:  I've run into a lot of people in my time who say they do not take the bible literally and it is more about the morals involved. i.e. they don't literally believe that Eve came from Adam's rib but it's more of a metaphor. Can this person successfully be labeled a Christian? Why or why not? If not what would you call them?

A better question might be, what is the neccessary criteria for being a Christian?

The answers to these questions should help spark some new thought processes for me. On a side note, I think it would be cool to eventially become knowledgable in many religions so I can make a tree diagram that shows where and why each religion parts ways.

Thanks!
Jesus Christ is the true image of God sent by God, as in His Character. This True Image of God sent by God reveals a self sacrificing Love even unto death, even while forgiving those who crucify him. Obviously, since God sent a true image of Himself to believe in, we were therefore corrupted in our wills by belief in a false image upon which we reasoned right and wrong, which also corrupted the moral spirit in our souls. We therefore needed a True image of God to replace the false image we before believed in. The word Christ/Messiah actually means the True Image of God sent by God.

It doesn't matter whether the story of Adam and Eve is literal or metaphor. In spiritual terms Male/female simply means one was made from the other which means one came before the other, which then implies different perspectives based upon such circumstances.

Another load of meaningless drivel, with no references.

"Jesus Christ is the true image of God sent by God, as in His Character." is a non sequitur.
What exactly were the Jews (his "chosen people") worshiping all those years before ?

"The word Christ/Messiah actually means the True Image of God sent by God."
is a flat-out lie.

"It doesn't matter whether the story of Adam and Eve is literal or metaphor. In spiritual terms Male/female simply means one was made from the other which means one came before the other, which then implies different perspectives based upon such circumstances."

I see you can twist and rationalize and try to make any piece of garbage look pretty, if you try.

Thumbsup

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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15-06-2014, 04:23 PM
RE: What exactly is Christianity
(15-06-2014 04:06 PM)childeye Wrote:  
(15-06-2014 10:38 AM)smileXsmileXsmile Wrote:  I've run into a lot of people in my time who say they do not take the bible literally and it is more about the morals involved. i.e. they don't literally believe that Eve came from Adam's rib but it's more of a metaphor. Can this person successfully be labeled a Christian? Why or why not? If not what would you call them?

A better question might be, what is the neccessary criteria for being a Christian?

The answers to these questions should help spark some new thought processes for me. On a side note, I think it would be cool to eventially become knowledgable in many religions so I can make a tree diagram that shows where and why each religion parts ways.

Thanks!
Jesus Christ is the true image of God sent by God, as in His Character. This True Image of God sent by God reveals a self sacrificing Love even unto death, even while forgiving those who crucify him. Obviously, since God sent a true image of Himself to believe in, we were therefore corrupted in our wills by belief in a false image upon which we reasoned right and wrong, which also corrupted the moral spirit in our souls. We therefore needed a True image of God to replace the false image we before believed in. The word Christ/Messiah actually means the True Image of God sent by God.

It doesn't matter whether the story of Adam and Eve is literal or metaphor. In spiritual terms Male/female simply means one was made from the other which means one came before the other, which then implies different perspectives based upon such circumstances.

Yes. Adam came before Eve. If he had just a little more stamina maybe she wouldn't have had enough time to fuck around with forbidden fruit.
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15-06-2014, 04:23 PM
RE: What exactly is Christianity
(15-06-2014 04:06 PM)Drunkin Druid Wrote:  
(15-06-2014 03:17 PM)Anna Wrote:  Exactly. Everything is always about Adam and Eve. Sometimes I wonder do hindus have an Adam and Eve too or does it only work for Middle East? Tongue But thats the closest you'll ever get to finding the origins of Islam, and the shorter story would be a guy (Mohammed) crawls inside a dark cave everyday for some reason then comes out and tells people he just had a revelation from god, he gets 300 people to accept what he was preaching then goes to war against those who didnt. The End!

Of course that explanation assumes that Muhammad actually existed. He may have I don't know but it's much more plausible.
If a person wants to know the actual origins of Islam or any religion it does no good to ask someone who presupposes that the religion is true. It's pretty likely that the person will not investigate honestly.

Thats true. I come from a Muslim family and even though I don't believe any of Muslim teachings I still think that Mohammed may have been real and not mythical because he didn't perform any miracles like Jesus did, he just went to people with Quran and preached his religion, was poor and didnt claim to be god. He may have been mythical but its just my view that since no magic was involved he might be real and just wrote a book about how he assumed things work and impressed a bunch of people.

All great truths begin as blasphemy - George Bernard Shaw
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15-06-2014, 04:27 PM
RE: What exactly is Christianity
(15-06-2014 04:23 PM)Anna Wrote:  
(15-06-2014 04:06 PM)Drunkin Druid Wrote:  Of course that explanation assumes that Muhammad actually existed. He may have I don't know but it's much more plausible.
If a person wants to know the actual origins of Islam or any religion it does no good to ask someone who presupposes that the religion is true. It's pretty likely that the person will not investigate honestly.

Thats true. I come from a Muslim family and even though I don't believe any of Muslim teachings I still think that Mohammed may have been real and not mythical because he didn't perform any miracles like Jesus did, he just went to people with Quran and preached his religion, was poor and didnt claim to be god. He may have been mythical but its just my view that since no magic was involved he might be real and just wrote a book about how he assumed things work and impressed a bunch of people.

Yeah. That does seem reasonable. I just don't know enough about that time and place to form an opinion.
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