What is Rape Culture?
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14-08-2014, 09:35 AM (This post was last modified: 14-08-2014 09:41 AM by Res Publica.)
RE: What is Rape Culture?
Basically what is being said here is "rape culture is real because your say there is no rape culture which is rape culture".

Anti-rape organizations like RAINN have criticized the notion of rape culture as it shifts blame from the perpetrator towards culture in general. Rape culture advocates would have you believe that rapists are just sensitive lovers who have been mislead by modern society. Here in reality rape is a violent crime committed by people who know damn well what they are doing is wrong. Talk all you want about how men need to be "taught not to rape", but everyone knows rape is wrong. The notion that rapists are somehow just confused as to what consent is is hilariously and tragically wrong.

Link

Rapists are dangerous violent criminals, not confused schmucks. Feminists see rapists not as dangerous criminals, but as political weapons to further their cause. When it really comes down to it feminists don't care about victims, they would rather use rape victims as postergirls for their cause than they would really help them.

PS. loved your new rating Mathilda, that straman-ad hominem really shows just how little you value the truth. My parents have very different political ideas than me.

Paleoliberal • English Nationalist • Zionist • Rightist • Anti-Islam • Neoconservative • Republican • Linguistic Revivalist and Purist

Happily Divorced from the Left!
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14-08-2014, 09:58 AM
RE: What is Rape Culture?
(14-08-2014 09:35 AM)Res Publica Wrote:  PS. loved your new rating Mathilda, that straman-ad hominem really shows just how little you value the truth. My parents have very different political ideas than me.

Thanks for informing me. I'll make sure to update it in light of this new information.
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14-08-2014, 10:55 AM (This post was last modified: 14-08-2014 11:01 AM by Michael_Tadlock.)
RE: What is Rape Culture?
(14-08-2014 09:35 AM)Res Publica Wrote:  Basically what is being said here is "rape culture is real because your say there is no rape culture which is rape culture".

Anti-rape organizations like RAINN have criticized the notion of rape culture as it shifts blame from the perpetrator towards culture in general. Rape culture advocates would have you believe that rapists are just sensitive lovers who have been mislead by modern society. Here in reality rape is a violent crime committed by people who know damn well what they are doing is wrong. Talk all you want about how men need to be "taught not to rape", but everyone knows rape is wrong. The notion that rapists are somehow just confused as to what consent is is hilariously and tragically wrong.

Link

Rapists are dangerous violent criminals, not confused schmucks. Feminists see rapists not as dangerous criminals, but as political weapons to further their cause. When it really comes down to it feminists don't care about victims, they would rather use rape victims as postergirls for their cause than they would really help them.

PS. loved your new rating Mathilda, that straman-ad hominem really shows just how little you value the truth. My parents have very different political ideas than me.

I am going to quote some posts I made in another thread that I think apply. I would to summarize though by saying a few things:

1) About 1/6 women, some 16%, will be raped in their life time.
2) Most rapists do not appear to be serial rapists. On average, when a woman is raped, she is raped by a person who has never raped before. That is a LOT of rapist, to many to be all depraved, violent, sociopaths.
3) About 97% of rapist will never spend time in prison. Some of this can be attributed to the difficult nature of the crime, however, a lot more of it has to do with sexism in our courts and woman being afraid to take their rapist to court.
4) No one is arguing that rapists should be let off the hook, only that the problems of rape go deeper than the individuals that rape. If you want to prevent rape, not just punish it, then you need to change the culture that makes rape so tragically common and seemingly permissible.
Here are some posts I made on the subject in another thread. They can be read in context here:

http://www.thethinkingatheist.com/forum/...ot-to-rape

In general, I encourage you to actually research something before summarily dismissing it. You may not like the phrasing "rape culture", and I get that. It is an off putting term. However, the ideas behind it are well established with statistics and good reasoning. Furthermore, the version of rape culture you have been attacking is a straw man of the real thing. Really learn about it, and read some good opinions on it first.

(10-06-2014 02:45 AM)Michael_Tadlock Wrote:  Teaching men not to rape doesn't mean sensitivity training for violent offenders. Most rape falls into that "gray rape" area, where the person who was the rapist can convince them self they never raped in the first place. For the victim there is nothing gray about it, rape is rape.

The vast majority of rapes are committed by someone the victim knows and usually by a friend who is interested in consensual sex. A lot of men either aren't aware of, or don't adequately appreciate what the rules for consent are. To make matter worse, most rapes involve alcohol or some other narcotic. If there was better education for men about rape it is possible that less men might commit rape.

Also, in our society men are getting a lot of harmful messages about woman and there needs to be a counter to that. We live in a society that reduces women to objects. There is still these silly and destructive notions that when a woman says something she doesn't always really mean it, and that woman are weak in character and need to be "taken care of". Men do need to be educated on what rape is how they can cross the line and become a rapist. Men need to stop seeing sex a conquest and/or an entitlement. I personally believe that most rapes could be prevented if men had different attitudes about sex and woman.

As for the self defense bit, I think feminists are loathe to put any ownest on the victim. Its easy for "learn self defense" to feel like "its your fault if you let yourself get raped". This is not what anybody means, but idealistically speaking, the best solution is nobody ever gets raped no matter how helpless or defenseless they are.

In addition to that, "self defense" doesn't speak to the problem. Most rapes are committed without the threat of violence. Very rarely does a rapist have a weapon. Very rarely does a rapist have to even do very much to physically restrain the victim. The problem isn't that woman aren't empowered or able to resist their attacker, the problem is that rape is a deeply traumatic experience that renders very strong people helpless while it is happening. You can't blame the victim for not resisting, you have to blame the rapist for committing the sexual assault in the first place. Education could help a lot of people, but the party that needs the most educating is men.

(10-06-2014 01:03 PM)Michael_Tadlock Wrote:  
(10-06-2014 11:16 AM)Near Wrote:  Of course most of us have probably heard "So how's the whole 'teaching people not to murder' going?"

Teaching men not to rape? Let's play that then. If anyone thinks that that is actually a good idea, how sexist is that? We can't be bothered to learn what types of people might become rapists, let's just teach ALL men not to rape.

Jesus Christ, it reminds me of when I hear the whole "all guys are cheaters, it's just a matter of time." I fucking hate that shit. Generalizations like that are shitty to be on th receiving end of, especially when you already have low self esteem.

It's not blaming the victim, let's maybe look and see if we can find a better method of preventing rape than "teach men not to rape."

Lets play a numbers game then.

Statistically speaking, somewhere between 1 in 4 and 1 in 6 woman will be sexually assaulted in their lifetime.

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/12/15/health....html?_r=0

Quote:A 1997 report by the U.S. Bureau of Justice Statistics, which defines rape as forced penetration by the offender,[205] found that 91% of rape victims are female and 9% are male, and that nearly 99% of rapists are male.

Quote:According to the US Bureau of Justice Statistics, woman are rapted by their current or former intimate partner 26%, another relative 7%, friend or acquaintance 38%, and stranger 26%.

It is estimated that more than half of all rapes are never reported to the police, and the US Bureau basis its statistics on reported rapes. Many more women who are raped by someone they know don't report it because of shame and social stigma. The numbers are probably much more skewed towards friends and acquaintances and former or current intimate partners than even this data shows. The lesson to be learned here; most women are raped by someone they know and often a person they trust.

What percentage of men commit rape? Its hard to say. I have read numbers as high as 1 in 8. The famous 1987 study that found 1/4 college woman will be raped in their lifetime also found that 4.5% of college men self reported that they had forced a woman to have sex with them at least once. One thing is very clear, if 1/5 woman are being raped in their lifetime, it is not possible for only a small percentage of men to be responsible for all these rapes.

Self defense here is NOT a solution to this problem. These women know their attackers, the issue isn't that they are unable to roundhouse kick them to the balls, the issue is that they trust their attacker. They are socially, emotionally, and psychologically dominated while the attack is taking place. Very often it has nothing to do with strength. Woman should be educated when it comes to rape, but not in self defense but in ways to spot rape before it happens and techniques for how protect themselves and how to get out of it.

I understand as a man reading this you feel like you are being blamed for the problem. If you personally never raped anyone, then guess what you're not a rapist. Nobody is calling you a rapist. The data shows though, MEN ARE THE PROBLEM. To pretend otherwise is to wantonly ignore the facts. If you are curious who rapists are then think about the all the men you know right now. Chances are at least a few of them are rapists. Statistically speaking, there might be a dozen rapist on this forum. Rapist are men you know, rape victims are women we know, lets stop pretending the problem is shady folks in back alleys and battered woman on the lifetime channel. Its real people, everywhere, all the time.

(10-06-2014 02:11 PM)Michael_Tadlock Wrote:  
(10-06-2014 01:35 PM)Near Wrote:  And how often does a man being on the receiving end of rape go unreported? Anybody can be raped or be a rapist.

It must be the one original sin the "teach men not to rape" people believe in "If you're a man you are automatically a rapist, that's why we have to teach all men not to rape.

It's like Suey Park and her "Only white men can be racist", except it's "only men can be rapists."

@Michael_Tadlock: you say "if you've never raped you're not a rapist and we aren't talking about you" (paraphrase) but if we support "teach all men not to rape" we are as good as saying that they are all rapists.

Would we take an entire school to a prison, and say "See kids, this is what happens if you break the law!" Or would we take just the troubled kids?

Rape is a two sided issue, let's find out how to better empower and embolden women to come forward if they have been assaulted, let's try to focus on the people who have done the assaulting, and not paint all men with the rapists brush.

If you focus on men who have done the assaulting then its too late, there is already a victim.

99% of all rapists are men. That's just math. You don't get much closer to 100% than 99%. That means men are the raping demographic here. So ideally if you want to prevent rape, you want to affect the behavior of men.

I agree with you that woman can be better educated and empowered when it comes to rape. I think what could help many woman is a better toolset for how to communicate consent, and techniques for how to get out of a dangerous situation. It is important to remember not to blame the victim, however. We need to put responsibility for rape on the rapist while giving woman tools for protecting themselves. If a woman uses none of these tools it is still the rapists fault for rape.

The point I want to make though is that "self defense" has often been used as a band-aid proscription. It is easier to think about woman doing Karate then it is to really consider the factors that actually lead to rape for most people. Self defense can be a valuable tool, and it has saved many woman from rape before. The problem is that self defense, as a tool, is not adequate or even helpful for so many woman. We need to recognize that the problem with rape is not always that woman are physically dominated but that they are mentally dominated first. Empowering women with education and with verbal and nonviolent means of self defense, I believe, could help a lot more people.

(12-06-2014 04:40 PM)Michael_Tadlock Wrote:  
(12-06-2014 01:11 PM)Luminon Wrote:  Any comments?
[Image: 10295661_731646640212357_6220639381780112964_n.png]

Selection bias much?

Percentage of people who die in childbirth
woman: 100%
Men: 0%

Percentage of Nurses
woman: 92%
men: 8.1%

Percentage of people who die of Ovarian cancer
woman: 100%
men: 0%

I have pictures too.

[Image: n5lq4h.jpg]

This is by income:
[Image: 350px-Income_inequity_US.png]

[Image: Women-MPs-001.png]

[Image: Rape_Rate.png]

Quote:The U.S. Bureau of Justice Statistics (1997) stated that 91% of United States people whose rape accusations resulted in convictions against the accused were female and 9% were male. It also stated that 99% of the people convicted of and imprisoned in response to rape accusations were male, with only 1% of those convicted being female.


https://www.rainn.org/get-information/st...-offenders Wrote:The Perpetrator's not Hiding in the Bushes

More than 50% of all rape/sexual assault incidents were reported by victims to have occurred within 1 mile of their home or at their home.2

4 in 10 take place at the victim's home.
2 in 10 take place at the home of a friend, neighbor, or relative.
1 in 12 take place in a parking garage.
43% of rapes occur between 6:00pm and midnight.2

24% occur between midnight and 6:00am.
The other 33% take place between 6:00am and 6:00pm.
The Criminal
The average age of a rapist is 31 years old.2
52% are white.2
22% of imprisoned rapists report that they are married.2
Juveniles accounted for 16% of forcible rape arrestees in 1995 and 17% of those arrested for other sex offenses.2
In 1 in 3 sexual assaults, the perpetrator was intoxicated — 30% with alcohol, 4% with drugs.3
In 2001, 11% of rapes involved the use of a weapon — 3% used a gun, 6% used a knife, and 2 % used another form of weapon.2
84% of victims reported the use of physical force only.2
Rapists are more likely to be a serial criminal than a serial rapist.

46% of rapists who were released from prison were re-arrested within 3 years of their release for another crime.4

18.6% for a violent offense.
14.8% for a property offense.
11.2% for a drug offense.
20.5% for a public-order offense.

theamericanbar.org Wrote:Approximately 1.3 million women and 835,000 men are physically assaulted by an intimate partner annually in the United States.
Patricia Tjaden & Nancy Thoennes, U.S. Dep't of Just., NCJ 183781, Full Report of the Prevalence, Incidence, and Consequences of Intimate Partner Violence Against Women: Findings from the National Violence Against Women Survey, at iv (2000), available at http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/nij/pubs-sum/183781.htm
Intimate partner violence made up 20% of all nonfatal violent crime experienced by women in 2001.
Callie Marie Rennison, U.S. Dep't of Just., NCJ 197838, Bureau of Justice Statistics Crime Data Brief: Intimate Partner Violence, 1993-2001, at 1 (2003), available at http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/pub/pdf/ipv01.pdf
Intimate partners committed 3% of the nonfatal violence against men.
Callie Marie Rennison, U.S. Dep't of Just., NCJ 197838, Bureau of Justice Statistics Crime Data Brief: Intimate Partner Violence, 1993-2001, at 1 (2003), available at http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/pub/pdf/ipv01.pdf
In 2000, 1,247 women and 440 men were killed by an intimate partner. In recent years, an intimate partner killed approximately 33% of female murder victims and 4% of male murder victims.
Callie Marie Rennison, U.S. Dep't of Just., NCJ 197838, Bureau of Justice Statistics Crime Data Brief: Intimate Partner Violence, 1993-2001, at 1 (2003), available at http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/pub/pdf/ipv01.pdf

[Image: merm3.jpg]
[Image: vince2.jpg]
[Image: friends4.jpg]
[Image: final3.jpg]
[Image: Media-Coverage-and-Female-Athletes-40-Stat.jpg]
[Image: Media-Coverage-and-Female-Athletes-4-Stat.jpg]

And the data goes on, and on, and on, and on. Women are underrepresented, underpaid, inappropriately sexualized and trivialized in the work place and the media, far more likely to be victims of violence, and far more likely to be victims of rape. Are there gender disparities that negatively affect men? Absolutely there are, and they are problems, and feminism is about them too. But don't kid yourself. Woman have it much, much worse.

Quote:I don't mean any social Darwinist aims, but long-term personal and relationship happiness and fulfillment aims, which turn out to be in line with the best interests of the children. Back in times when there was no welfare state, women had to exercise judgement about who are they going to bed with. Now they just get knocked up and receive welfare. There are whole neighbourhoods and populations of single mother "families" like that. Don't give me an argument they do it out of love.

Who the fuck are you to tell people who to marry and who to have children with? If you want to get into data about the poor and the plight of minorities we can do that too. For now, pick one demographic to hate at a time.

Quote: I'll accept that argument when men will be able to have abortion, when they'll regularly win legal custody battles over children and when women will pay alimony or divorce support to men.
Yes, women can have sex with anyone they want, but then they must not go to politicians voting to increase taxes, tax my money and have bigger welfare checks. The state is the ultimate single mom's husband.

You have never lived on welfare I take it, nor spent any time around people that have.

Quote:[Image: I+never+really+got+this+either_7785ec_4635215.png]
If children are hit by women, I wouldn't be surprised if they decided to return the favor somehow to the womankind when they grow up.

You really are something special. Perhaps a men's rights activist forum would be better suited for you.

Quote: What sort of equality women are lacking? The job market? Women do tend to get lower pay, but firstly, they do extra job of child rearing, which certainly lowers their business performance, and secondly, they tend to start on higher minimal pay than men. They often prefer to be supported by a man if he's earning enough.

Sounds all right to me. My problem starts when women drag politics and laws into the fight. The political fight of men and women has no innocents on both sides, they're both as bloody as Jews and Palestinians.

I won't say all the laws in the US are gender neutral or gender equal, but most of them are. Laws are pretty straightforward to change and unambiguous, which is why most of the legal victories for feminism had all happened by the 70's. The frontier of feminism right now is the culture war, because it is much, much harder to change how people think. Things are getting better, at least in the united states, but there is a long, long way to go. Its far from over.
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14-08-2014, 01:27 PM
RE: What is Rape Culture?
(14-08-2014 10:55 AM)Michael_Tadlock Wrote:  
(14-08-2014 09:35 AM)Res Publica Wrote:  Basically what is being said here is "rape culture is real because your say there is no rape culture which is rape culture".

Anti-rape organizations like RAINN have criticized the notion of rape culture as it shifts blame from the perpetrator towards culture in general. Rape culture advocates would have you believe that rapists are just sensitive lovers who have been mislead by modern society. Here in reality rape is a violent crime committed by people who know damn well what they are doing is wrong. Talk all you want about how men need to be "taught not to rape", but everyone knows rape is wrong. The notion that rapists are somehow just confused as to what consent is is hilariously and tragically wrong.

Link

Rapists are dangerous violent criminals, not confused schmucks. Feminists see rapists not as dangerous criminals, but as political weapons to further their cause. When it really comes down to it feminists don't care about victims, they would rather use rape victims as postergirls for their cause than they would really help them.

PS. loved your new rating Mathilda, that straman-ad hominem really shows just how little you value the truth. My parents have very different political ideas than me.

I am going to quote some posts I made in another thread that I think apply. I would to summarize though by saying a few things:

1) About 1/6 women, some 16%, will be raped in their life time.
2) Most rapists do not appear to be serial rapists. On average, when a woman is raped, she is raped by a person who has never raped before. That is a LOT of rapist, to many to be all depraved, violent, sociopaths.
3) About 97% of rapist will never spend time in prison. Some of this can be attributed to the difficult nature of the crime, however, a lot more of it has to do with sexism in our courts and woman being afraid to take their rapist to court.
4) No one is arguing that rapists should be let off the hook, only that the problems of rape go deeper than the individuals that rape. If you want to prevent rape, not just punish it, then you need to change the culture that makes rape so tragically common and seemingly permissible.
Here are some posts I made on the subject in another thread. They can be read in context here:

http://www.thethinkingatheist.com/forum/...ot-to-rape

In general, I encourage you to actually research something before summarily dismissing it. You may not like the phrasing "rape culture", and I get that. It is an off putting term. However, the ideas behind it are well established with statistics and good reasoning. Furthermore, the version of rape culture you have been attacking is a straw man of the real thing. Really learn about it, and read some good opinions on it first.

(10-06-2014 02:45 AM)Michael_Tadlock Wrote:  Teaching men not to rape doesn't mean sensitivity training for violent offenders. Most rape falls into that "gray rape" area, where the person who was the rapist can convince them self they never raped in the first place. For the victim there is nothing gray about it, rape is rape.

The vast majority of rapes are committed by someone the victim knows and usually by a friend who is interested in consensual sex. A lot of men either aren't aware of, or don't adequately appreciate what the rules for consent are. To make matter worse, most rapes involve alcohol or some other narcotic. If there was better education for men about rape it is possible that less men might commit rape.

Also, in our society men are getting a lot of harmful messages about woman and there needs to be a counter to that. We live in a society that reduces women to objects. There is still these silly and destructive notions that when a woman says something she doesn't always really mean it, and that woman are weak in character and need to be "taken care of". Men do need to be educated on what rape is how they can cross the line and become a rapist. Men need to stop seeing sex a conquest and/or an entitlement. I personally believe that most rapes could be prevented if men had different attitudes about sex and woman.

As for the self defense bit, I think feminists are loathe to put any ownest on the victim. Its easy for "learn self defense" to feel like "its your fault if you let yourself get raped". This is not what anybody means, but idealistically speaking, the best solution is nobody ever gets raped no matter how helpless or defenseless they are.

In addition to that, "self defense" doesn't speak to the problem. Most rapes are committed without the threat of violence. Very rarely does a rapist have a weapon. Very rarely does a rapist have to even do very much to physically restrain the victim. The problem isn't that woman aren't empowered or able to resist their attacker, the problem is that rape is a deeply traumatic experience that renders very strong people helpless while it is happening. You can't blame the victim for not resisting, you have to blame the rapist for committing the sexual assault in the first place. Education could help a lot of people, but the party that needs the most educating is men.

(10-06-2014 01:03 PM)Michael_Tadlock Wrote:  Lets play a numbers game then.

Statistically speaking, somewhere between 1 in 4 and 1 in 6 woman will be sexually assaulted in their lifetime.

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/12/15/health....html?_r=0



It is estimated that more than half of all rapes are never reported to the police, and the US Bureau basis its statistics on reported rapes. Many more women who are raped by someone they know don't report it because of shame and social stigma. The numbers are probably much more skewed towards friends and acquaintances and former or current intimate partners than even this data shows. The lesson to be learned here; most women are raped by someone they know and often a person they trust.

What percentage of men commit rape? Its hard to say. I have read numbers as high as 1 in 8. The famous 1987 study that found 1/4 college woman will be raped in their lifetime also found that 4.5% of college men self reported that they had forced a woman to have sex with them at least once. One thing is very clear, if 1/5 woman are being raped in their lifetime, it is not possible for only a small percentage of men to be responsible for all these rapes.

Self defense here is NOT a solution to this problem. These women know their attackers, the issue isn't that they are unable to roundhouse kick them to the balls, the issue is that they trust their attacker. They are socially, emotionally, and psychologically dominated while the attack is taking place. Very often it has nothing to do with strength. Woman should be educated when it comes to rape, but not in self defense but in ways to spot rape before it happens and techniques for how protect themselves and how to get out of it.

I understand as a man reading this you feel like you are being blamed for the problem. If you personally never raped anyone, then guess what you're not a rapist. Nobody is calling you a rapist. The data shows though, MEN ARE THE PROBLEM. To pretend otherwise is to wantonly ignore the facts. If you are curious who rapists are then think about the all the men you know right now. Chances are at least a few of them are rapists. Statistically speaking, there might be a dozen rapist on this forum. Rapist are men you know, rape victims are women we know, lets stop pretending the problem is shady folks in back alleys and battered woman on the lifetime channel. Its real people, everywhere, all the time.

(10-06-2014 02:11 PM)Michael_Tadlock Wrote:  If you focus on men who have done the assaulting then its too late, there is already a victim.

99% of all rapists are men. That's just math. You don't get much closer to 100% than 99%. That means men are the raping demographic here. So ideally if you want to prevent rape, you want to affect the behavior of men.

I agree with you that woman can be better educated and empowered when it comes to rape. I think what could help many woman is a better toolset for how to communicate consent, and techniques for how to get out of a dangerous situation. It is important to remember not to blame the victim, however. We need to put responsibility for rape on the rapist while giving woman tools for protecting themselves. If a woman uses none of these tools it is still the rapists fault for rape.

The point I want to make though is that "self defense" has often been used as a band-aid proscription. It is easier to think about woman doing Karate then it is to really consider the factors that actually lead to rape for most people. Self defense can be a valuable tool, and it has saved many woman from rape before. The problem is that self defense, as a tool, is not adequate or even helpful for so many woman. We need to recognize that the problem with rape is not always that woman are physically dominated but that they are mentally dominated first. Empowering women with education and with verbal and nonviolent means of self defense, I believe, could help a lot more people.

(12-06-2014 04:40 PM)Michael_Tadlock Wrote:  Selection bias much?

Percentage of people who die in childbirth
woman: 100%
Men: 0%

Percentage of Nurses
woman: 92%
men: 8.1%

Percentage of people who die of Ovarian cancer
woman: 100%
men: 0%

I have pictures too.

[Image: n5lq4h.jpg]

This is by income:
[Image: 350px-Income_inequity_US.png]

[Image: Women-MPs-001.png]

[Image: Rape_Rate.png]





[Image: merm3.jpg]
[Image: vince2.jpg]
[Image: friends4.jpg]
[Image: final3.jpg]
[Image: Media-Coverage-and-Female-Athletes-40-Stat.jpg]
[Image: Media-Coverage-and-Female-Athletes-4-Stat.jpg]

And the data goes on, and on, and on, and on. Women are underrepresented, underpaid, inappropriately sexualized and trivialized in the work place and the media, far more likely to be victims of violence, and far more likely to be victims of rape. Are there gender disparities that negatively affect men? Absolutely there are, and they are problems, and feminism is about them too. But don't kid yourself. Woman have it much, much worse.


Who the fuck are you to tell people who to marry and who to have children with? If you want to get into data about the poor and the plight of minorities we can do that too. For now, pick one demographic to hate at a time.


You have never lived on welfare I take it, nor spent any time around people that have.


You really are something special. Perhaps a men's rights activist forum would be better suited for you.


I won't say all the laws in the US are gender neutral or gender equal, but most of them are. Laws are pretty straightforward to change and unambiguous, which is why most of the legal victories for feminism had all happened by the 70's. The frontier of feminism right now is the culture war, because it is much, much harder to change how people think. Things are getting better, at least in the united states, but there is a long, long way to go. Its far from over.

That is a long list with no references what-so-ever. If you actually read the article from RAINN (an anti-rape group) you would know that 90% college rapes are committed by less than 3% of men.

Paleoliberal • English Nationalist • Zionist • Rightist • Anti-Islam • Neoconservative • Republican • Linguistic Revivalist and Purist

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14-08-2014, 02:48 PM
RE: What is Rape Culture?
(14-08-2014 01:27 PM)Res Publica Wrote:  
(14-08-2014 10:55 AM)Michael_Tadlock Wrote:  I am going to quote some posts I made in another thread that I think apply. I would to summarize though by saying a few things:

1) About 1/6 women, some 16%, will be raped in their life time.
2) Most rapists do not appear to be serial rapists. On average, when a woman is raped, she is raped by a person who has never raped before. That is a LOT of rapist, to many to be all depraved, violent, sociopaths.
3) About 97% of rapist will never spend time in prison. Some of this can be attributed to the difficult nature of the crime, however, a lot more of it has to do with sexism in our courts and woman being afraid to take their rapist to court.
4) No one is arguing that rapists should be let off the hook, only that the problems of rape go deeper than the individuals that rape. If you want to prevent rape, not just punish it, then you need to change the culture that makes rape so tragically common and seemingly permissible.
Here are some posts I made on the subject in another thread. They can be read in context here:

http://www.thethinkingatheist.com/forum/...ot-to-rape

In general, I encourage you to actually research something before summarily dismissing it. You may not like the phrasing "rape culture", and I get that. It is an off putting term. However, the ideas behind it are well established with statistics and good reasoning. Furthermore, the version of rape culture you have been attacking is a straw man of the real thing. Really learn about it, and read some good opinions on it first.

That is a long list with no references what-so-ever. If you actually read the article from RAINN (an anti-rape group) you would know that 90% college rapes are committed by less than 3% of men.

My patience is with you is wearing very, very thin.

https://www.rainn.org/get-information/st...-offenders

Quote:Rapists are more likely to be a serial criminal than a serial rapist.

46% of rapists who were released from prison were re-arrested within 3 years of their release for another crime.4

18.6% for a violent offense.
14.8% for a property offense.
11.2% for a drug offense.
20.5% for a public-order offense.

Do. Some. Research.

This quote from you article

Quote:RAINN’s recommendations pointed to research that suggests that more than 90% of college rapes are committed by about 3% of college men (reliable research about female perpetrators is harder to come by)

Is almost certainly based of a study done, where 1 in 4 college women self reported they had been sexually assaulted, and about 3% of college men self reported they had forced someone to have sex with them at least once. Very suspect. I want to see the study.
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14-08-2014, 02:54 PM
Re: RE: What is Rape Culture?
(14-08-2014 01:27 PM)Res Publica Wrote:  
(14-08-2014 10:55 AM)Michael_Tadlock Wrote:  I am going to quote some posts I made in another thread that I think apply. I would to summarize though by saying a few things:

1) About 1/6 women, some 16%, will be raped in their life time.
2) Most rapists do not appear to be serial rapists. On average, when a woman is raped, she is raped by a person who has never raped before. That is a LOT of rapist, to many to be all depraved, violent, sociopaths.
3) About 97% of rapist will never spend time in prison. Some of this can be attributed to the difficult nature of the crime, however, a lot more of it has to do with sexism in our courts and woman being afraid to take their rapist to court.
4) No one is arguing that rapists should be let off the hook, only that the problems of rape go deeper than the individuals that rape. If you want to prevent rape, not just punish it, then you need to change the culture that makes rape so tragically common and seemingly permissible.
Here are some posts I made on the subject in another thread. They can be read in context here:

http://www.thethinkingatheist.com/forum/...ot-to-rape

In general, I encourage you to actually research something before summarily dismissing it. You may not like the phrasing "rape culture", and I get that. It is an off putting term. However, the ideas behind it are well established with statistics and good reasoning. Furthermore, the version of rape culture you have been attacking is a straw man of the real thing. Really learn about it, and read some good opinions on it first.

That is a long list with no references what-so-ever. If you actually read the article from RAINN (an anti-rape group) you would know that 90% college rapes are committed by less than 3% of men.

Do you know that one research chosen doesn't mean definite? And what a reference is? I could believe it's true, but I've also seen other studies on campuses and elsewhere in contrast. There's more than, the 1 study rainn choose to point out, but beyond that, the article you posted is about how to sidearm the issue of rape culture. They're disagreement with the term is on a limited use of it. It's not just about influencing rapists.. It's exactly what RAINN wants fixed. The attitude and handling of sexual assault cases with minimal punishment or seriousness that helps enable it.

You are repeatedly showing a lacking openness to what others are saying to you. It's very dangerous to be convinced of your opinion.

"Allow there to be a spectrum in all that you see" - Neil Degrasse Tyson
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14-08-2014, 02:58 PM
RE: What is Rape Culture?
(14-08-2014 02:48 PM)Michael_Tadlock Wrote:  <snip>
Do. Some. Research.

NOTE: Do not try to read my opinion from this reply. You will undoubtedly fail.

What about the supposed true percentage of rapes? I've searched for this extensively and found only articles that say that there are more rapes than we know about, usually varying from 1% to 15% of reported rapes (inferring that 85-99% of rapes go unreported). Where do they get these statistics from if the rapes aren't ever reported?
I've also seen statistics that state that 40% of abuse victims are men, rather than the 0-5% I've heard from other (sometimes questionable) sources.

The truth is absolute. Life forms are specks of specks (...) of specks of dust in the universe.
Why settle for normal, when you can be so much more? Why settle for something, when you can have everything?
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14-08-2014, 03:04 PM
RE: What is Rape Culture?
Another point worth making, even if only 3% of men are rapist, that is still almost 1 in 33 adult men; an equal rate to all incarcerated adults and all peoples on parole in the entire country of the United States. That would mean for every inmate and prison parolee in every prison there exists a free rapist, and that is if only three percent of the male population is responsible. That would make the most ubiquitous crime committed in the United States BY FAR. Even if it is only three percent. And it is not. It is almost certainly much, much higher than that.
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14-08-2014, 04:06 PM
RE: What is Rape Culture?
(14-08-2014 02:58 PM)One Above All Wrote:  
(14-08-2014 02:48 PM)Michael_Tadlock Wrote:  <snip>
Do. Some. Research.

NOTE: Do not try to read my opinion from this reply. You will undoubtedly fail.

What about the supposed true percentage of rapes? I've searched for this extensively and found only articles that say that there are more rapes than we know about, usually varying from 1% to 15% of reported rapes (inferring that 85-99% of rapes go unreported). Where do they get these statistics from if the rapes aren't ever reported?
I've also seen statistics that state that 40% of abuse victims are men, rather than the 0-5% I've heard from other (sometimes questionable) sources.

It is my understanding that these numbers are compiled from self reported rape victims. They conduct a survey where they ask women if they have ever been sexually assaulted, and they self report if they have or have not. This creates a disconnect between statistics regarding convicted rapists vs statistics regarding self reported rape, and indeed the facts can get muddy and confusing.

The number of male rape victims is really hard to gather. Men are victims of rape, usually by other men, but sometimes by other woman. Men tend to be less likely to self report than woman do, and even less likely to prosecute.
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14-08-2014, 05:07 PM
RE: What is Rape Culture?
(14-08-2014 04:06 PM)Michael_Tadlock Wrote:  It is my understanding that these numbers are compiled from self reported rape victims. They conduct a survey where they ask women if they have ever been sexually assaulted, and they self report if they have or have not.

What is the source of this understanding? That was/is also my opinion, but I was never able to find an article that disclosed how those numbers were obtained, which is why I reject(ed) my opinion on the subject.

The truth is absolute. Life forms are specks of specks (...) of specks of dust in the universe.
Why settle for normal, when you can be so much more? Why settle for something, when you can have everything?
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