What is Spirit?
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18-01-2014, 11:14 AM
RE: What is Spirit?
(18-01-2014 10:36 AM)Baruch Wrote:  spirit (ˈspɪrɪt)
n
1. (Brewing) (often plural) any distilled alcoholic liquor such as brandy, rum, whisky, or gin

2. (Chemistry) chem
a. an aqueous solution of ethanol, esp one obtained by distillation

b. the active principle or essence of a substance, extracted as a liquid, esp by distillation

3. (Chemistry) pharmacol
a. a solution of a volatile substance, esp a volatile oil, in alcohol

b. (as modifier): a spirit burner.


Sorry - I ruined it on page 1 of the thread.

Hello --- Vodka? Is this a spiritist movement that you overlook vodka. Or maybe you want to oppress vodka. Is vodka allowed in your inner circle?

We have enough youth. How about looking for the Fountain of Smart?
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18-01-2014, 11:21 AM
RE: What is Spirit?
(18-01-2014 10:29 AM)houseofcantor Wrote:  Cause I saw the Witchy One and Alla discussing it, and thought it could use its own thread.

I see it in mathematical terms. Angel
WHO is spirit? you are spirit, for example.
What is spiritual matter? I don't know yet.
P.S. Oh, how do you see it in mathematical terms? just a curiosity

English is not my native language.
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18-01-2014, 11:45 AM
RE: What is Spirit?
(18-01-2014 11:21 AM)Alla Wrote:  
(18-01-2014 10:29 AM)houseofcantor Wrote:  Cause I saw the Witchy One and Alla discussing it, and thought it could use its own thread.

I see it in mathematical terms. Angel
WHO is spirit? you are spirit, for example.
What is spiritual matter? I don't know yet.
P.S. Oh, how do you see it in mathematical terms? just a curiosity

In a way I see Void being an attractor that we gravitate towards. Consciousness I see like a tipping point in deterministic chaos, a product of a self-organizing system. Emergent rather than transcendent.

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18-01-2014, 12:50 PM
RE: What is Spirit?
(18-01-2014 11:45 AM)houseofcantor Wrote:  Consciousness I see like a tipping point in deterministic chaos, a product of a self-organizing system. Emergent rather than transcendent.
I think I can agree with that.

(18-01-2014 11:45 AM)houseofcantor Wrote:  In a way I see Void being an attractor that we gravitate towards.
could you explain please?

English is not my native language.
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18-01-2014, 01:00 PM
RE: What is Spirit?
(18-01-2014 11:14 AM)Thinkerbelle Wrote:  
(18-01-2014 10:36 AM)Baruch Wrote:  spirit (ˈspɪrɪt)
n
1. (Brewing) (often plural) any distilled alcoholic liquor such as brandy, rum, whisky, or gin

2. (Chemistry) chem
a. an aqueous solution of ethanol, esp one obtained by distillation

b. the active principle or essence of a substance, extracted as a liquid, esp by distillation

3. (Chemistry) pharmacol
a. a solution of a volatile substance, esp a volatile oil, in alcohol

b. (as modifier): a spirit burner.


Sorry - I ruined it on page 1 of the thread.

Hello --- Vodka? Is this a spiritist movement that you overlook vodka. Or maybe you want to oppress vodka. Is vodka allowed in your inner circle?


Vodka are unbelievers. They are not spiritual. Only Jinns, Rummis & Brandies.
whining is also a sign of unbelief.

A wise man proportions his belief to the evidence -
David Hume


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18-01-2014, 01:03 PM
RE: What is Spirit?
Spirit is energy. Everything in the universe is energy in some form, vibrating at some frequency. The universe is a process of converting energy on matter and matter back to energy.
The real question is, what is energy?

My preliminary guess is, energy is fundamentally existence. Which is useful for resolving the paradox of simulated lives or minds. Simulated life is only as real as the amount of energy/matter it contains, which is typically much less than us, biologic people. Which is why we are allowed erase and destroy self-conscious AIs and robots without any qualms. Killing an android is not murder, because it is not killing.
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18-01-2014, 01:16 PM
RE: What is Spirit?
Quote:houseofcantor
In a way I see Void being an attractor that we gravitate towards. Consciousness I see like a tipping point in deterministic chaos, a product of a self-organizing system. Emergent rather than transcendent.

Back to the serious stuff.
Explain further:
Quote:Void being an attractor that we gravitate towards
- how do you incorporate the term spirit in this ?

Explain further:
Quote: Consciousness I see like a tipping point in deterministic chaos, a product of a self-organizing system. Emergent rather than transcendent.
I see consciousness as emergent & self organizing, this is the consensus view in neuroscience & philosophy of mind and certainly makes sense (regardless if it is consensus) - also how do you incorporate the term spirit ?
Once the self organizing threshold occurs then do you have "spirit" ? eg when we sleep communication between neurons in different parts of the brain dampen down and the brain wave frequencies result in a phenomenon which switches of phenomenal consciousness (so called qualia) i.e there are no experiences. The brain is still working 100% but the threshold for obtaining an emergent consciousness is sent into disarray (I wouldn't call it chaos ?)
Same effects with coma & anaesthetic drugs.
However a malfunctioning brain may still have consciousness eg in Alzheimer's but seriously impaired memory, external awareness of stimuli from environment, self awareness and even self identity.

So spirit in terms of consciousness is what in your opinion ?
Simple consciousness - basic raw "qualia" i.e any experiences ? (diminished in sleep, coma & anaesthetics)
Self awareness ? Self identity ? (emerges at a very young age but not at birth and can be impaired by pathology)

A wise man proportions his belief to the evidence -
David Hume


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18-01-2014, 01:18 PM
RE: What is Spirit?
(18-01-2014 01:03 PM)Luminon Wrote:  Spirit is energy. Everything in the universe is energy in some form, vibrating at some frequency. The universe is a process of converting energy on matter and matter back to energy.
The real question is, what is energy?

My preliminary guess is, energy is fundamentally existence. Which is useful for resolving the paradox of simulated lives or minds. Simulated life is only as real as the amount of energy/matter it contains, which is typically much less than us, biologic people. Which is why we are allowed erase and destroy self-conscious AIs and robots without any qualms. Killing an android is not murder, because it is not killing.

You are basically equivocating spirit = energy.

A wise man proportions his belief to the evidence -
David Hume


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18-01-2014, 01:22 PM
RE: What is Spirit?
(18-01-2014 12:50 PM)Alla Wrote:  [quote='houseofcantor' pid='470351' dateline='1390067140']
Consciousness I see like a tipping point in deterministic chaos, a product of a self-organizing system. Emergent rather than transcendent.
I think I can agree with that.

Alla - how can you agree consciousness is emergent and not transcendent ?
It is generally a physicalist view and most theists accept a form of dualism and consciousness must be transcendent.
There are Christian physicalists such as Nancey Murphy but these are usually from "liberal theology" and not really compatible with Mormonism as far as I can tell.

A wise man proportions his belief to the evidence -
David Hume


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18-01-2014, 01:39 PM
RE: What is Spirit?
"Spirit" for me, is a meaningless term. It is mildly suspicious at the very least, and fucking enraging at its worst. It seems to me that every person has their own private definition, and when they discuss it, it becomes infinitely more confusing. This near inability to define the term illustrates how unclear the idea is. The best explanations I have heard, while still being vague and nebulous, rely on a belief in a supernatural world which resides perfectly in parallel with our own, but remains unseen. As with all supernatural ideas, when I demand evidence, there is none to be found. I personally have concluded that there is no such spiritual realm, and thus no spirituality or spirit.

I also suspect the motives of those who claim knowledge of the spiritual, because they so often do so as a means of promoting human immortality. They do not wish to die (Who can blame them?) and their doctrine is to openly fearful of that reality. I am told that life will continue after death, but not in any tangible way, nor any way in which I might otherwise understand it. I have no desire to participate in wish thinking of that sort, however much comfort it may supply.

I also cannot help but notice the many tricksters and con persons who use this "spiritual realm" as a means of stealing a living. There have been for many years, and still are, those who would claim to read the future, speak to the dead, and summon ancestors and other spirits, all the for the low price of some of your wallet, and all of your dignity. It is impossible for me not to notice the money making machine of this New Age nonsense.

Religion is the sigh of the oppressed creature, the heart of a heartless world, just as it is the spirit of a spiritless situation. The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness.

-Karl Marx
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