What is it about theists that make them think that personal insults win a debate?
Post Reply
 
Thread Rating:
  • 0 Votes - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
20-02-2013, 11:05 PM
RE: What is it about theists that make them think that personal insults win a debate?
(20-02-2013 03:53 PM)PleaseJesus Wrote:  It is eyewitnesses speaking of Jesus and prophecies, therefore their trust is not blind. Their "faith" was trust in someone they knew personally.


Star Wars is eyewitnesses speaking of Jedis and the Force, therefore their trust is not blind. Their "faith" was trust in something they knew personally.


Still doesn't mean that believing in the Force, or that Yoda is real, is at all rational. Just because you can be rational in your everyday life, does not mean that you are applying that same level of thinking and credulity to Scripture. It's clear you're not, and your argumentation plainly shows that you just don't fucking get it... Drinking Beverage





[Image: GrumpyCat_01.gif]
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 2 users Like EvolutionKills's post
23-02-2013, 11:41 PM
RE: What is it about theists that make them think that personal insults win a debate?
(19-02-2013 02:51 PM)DeavonReye Wrote:  Here's another one [and from the same theist]: In a thread about homosexuals, . . . and how it is an abomination unto god. I said:

"Also remember to not eat meat with blood in it.
Do not cut the hair at the sides of your head or clip off the edges of your beard.
Do not cut your bodies for the dead or put tattoo marks on yourselves."

He posted:

"You’re trying to sound witty but you’re just demonstrating your ignorance.

And immaturity."
That's a red herring, because it has nothing to do with what you're saying and disguises the fact that he has nothing worth listening to say. It's also ad hominem, for the same reason.

Don't worry, one day you'll realise everything a theist says is pretty much based on some sort of logical fallacy. In fact, the very idea of god defies the logical principle lex parsimoniae.

Science, logic and how they destroy religious arguments @ http://scepticalprophet.wordpress.com/

To surrender to ignorance and call it God has always been premature, and it remains premature today.
- Isaac Asimov.
Faith means not wanting to know what is true.
- Friedrich Nietzsche
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
24-02-2013, 02:58 AM
RE: What is it about theists that make them think that personal insults win a debate?
I don't mind a decent flame war. Insults over the internet are half the fun. Sure it's more productive to get a good conversation going, but some people are so fucking stupid, that it becomes entertaining and often necessary. Sure it accomplishes no real goal of merit or worth, other than watching the other guy rage.

As far as theists resorting to it, well, just think about the mechanism in which a theist creates a god into their psyche. It is a manifestation of the ego that exists only in their brain. They personalize and internalize it. When you tell them their god doesn't exist, or you ridicule it with debate, jokes, insults, or the like, they feel you're attacking them directly, even if their higher brain function doesn't see it that way. The higher functioning brain compartmentalizes, but the lower functioning unevolved "lizard brain", does not.

So attacking god is attacking them. To which they feel overwhelming insult, and just HAVE to retaliate with what they see as attacking in kind with what the opposite side has done. I've experienced this very phenomenon with my family, as I am the only atheist, and I often have to fend off several of them at a time. I am also very vocal and quite frank about my atheism, even among theists. I don't feel I have to censor myself for the sake of their feelings, especially when they aren't thoughtful enough to return the favor. My Facebook wall is often flooded with "god" and "Jesus" drivel.

Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes KMFDM_Kid2000's post
24-02-2013, 09:47 AM
RE: What is it about theists that make them think that personal insults win a debate?
The weird part is that he claims 20 years "working on particle accelerators". He also said, "I know that one cannot survive in that environment without the ability for rational thought and critical thinking. You don’t have to be stupid to believe in God. I also have based my conclusions concerning God and the Bible using those same critical thinking methods and I have concluded with reasonable expectations of certainty that the Bible is indisputably everything it claims to be."

So, if he is telling the truth about that, he must be intelligent on some level. . . . so it makes me wonder how he COULD see his religion as "indisputable". Any thoughts on that?
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
26-02-2013, 08:05 AM
RE: What is it about theists that make them think that personal insults win a debate?
Considering my last post [above], . . . and after seeing TTA's video on The Psychology of Belief by Caleb Lack, . . . it would appear that intelligence is a non-factor in whether or not someone will be religious. I know a very smart man, . . . CPA, . . . Lawyer, . . . amateur astronomer [and a pretty good one at that], . . . yet he believe in the christian god and sees life here on this planet as "astronomically unlikely, thus a god created us all".

So, . . . when the person is more learned than you, it is a bit tense when they could best you in technical issues. Yet, having said that, . . . even their own brilliance is uncompelling to their god claims. The smartest person in the world may also be religious, . . . but their words are still empty. I still see nothing credible in what they say, and it really IS just their own personal feelings [which aren't satisfactory for "evidence"].

So, how do YOU handle a debate [such as in the OP] when you know that your opponent has advanced science understanding?
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
26-02-2013, 11:12 AM
RE: What is it about theists that make them think that personal insults win a debate?
Thought about this thread some more this week. I'd have to say I don't know, why is it that those dirty, &#@$%^ Christians with their @#$#@$ Bible and their #@$#@$#@$ lack of scientific knowledge think that @#$#@$ insulting freethinkers gains them any @#$#@$# ground what-the-@#$#@$-soever? Pot, meet kettle.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
26-02-2013, 11:47 AM
RE: What is it about theists that make them think that personal insults win a debate?
(24-02-2013 02:58 AM)KMFDM_Kid2000 Wrote:  I don't mind a decent flame war. Insults over the internet are half the fun. Sure it's more productive to get a good conversation going, but some people are so fucking stupid, that it becomes entertaining and often necessary. Sure it accomplishes no real goal of merit or worth, other than watching the other guy rage.
Never. Never ever ever ever ever is insulting an opponent necessary. If they actually are wrong, then you have grounds to attack with rational argument. If they're not wrong, then insulting becomes a proxy for the arguments that you would have if you could formulate them. Reason shows strength; insulting shows weakness.

You even agree and accept that insults "accomplish no real goal of merit or worth". And we know it's rationalizing because, from an objective viewpoint, you don't approve of insults -- if someone insulted you, you'd never refer to those insults as "necessary". The fun of "watching the other guy rage" doesn't justify them, either, because the ends don't justify the means. Plus, there are plenty of ways to have fun without acting immorally or unethically.

My girlfriend is mad at me. Perhaps I shouldn't have tried cooking a stick in her non-stick pan.
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
26-02-2013, 11:50 AM
RE: What is it about theists that make them think that personal insults win a debate?
(26-02-2013 11:12 AM)PleaseJesus Wrote:  Thought about this thread some more this week. I'd have to say I don't know, why is it that those dirty, &#@$%^ Christians with their @#$#@$ Bible and their #@$#@$#@$ lack of scientific knowledge think that @#$#@$ insulting freethinkers gains them any @#$#@$# ground what-the-@#$#@$-soever? Pot, meet kettle.
I hate this, too, PleaseJesus. This isn't a theist (or atheist) problem as much as it is an irrational problem. Rational discussion doesn't involve name-calling. But please don't stereotype all atheists as hypocritical... people are too complicated to fit into neat little boxes.

My girlfriend is mad at me. Perhaps I shouldn't have tried cooking a stick in her non-stick pan.
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes Starcrash's post
26-02-2013, 01:51 PM
RE: What is it about theists that make them think that personal insults win a debate?
Quote:I hate this, too, PleaseJesus. This isn't a theist (or atheist) problem as much as it is an irrational problem. Rational discussion doesn't involve name-calling. But please don't stereotype all atheists as hypocritical... people are too complicated to fit into neat little boxes.
Okay. I certainly appreciate your perspective and your kind words. Thank you sincerely.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
26-02-2013, 02:10 PM
RE: What is it about theists that make them think that personal insults win a debate?
Insecurity about ones beliefs breeds irrational and emotional responses when those loosely or weakly held beliefs are challenged. Or when the beliefs themselves are just weak and they are challenged. We are panicky and emotional creatures and whenever someone believes something out of fear, they become scared when that fear is brought back up. For the theist, they become scared of hell whenever their beliefs are questioned because they believe their faith is being tested and they desperately don't want to fail that test. So they jump to insults as an escape tactic.

A recent theist on our forum has done exactly that, multiple times, with multiple individuals.

“Science is simply common sense at its best, that is, rigidly accurate in observation, and merciless to fallacy in logic.”
—Thomas Henry Huxley
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
Post Reply
Forum Jump: