What is the explaination for everything?
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09-02-2014, 01:09 AM (This post was last modified: 09-02-2014 01:13 AM by DLJ.)
RE: What is the explaination for everything?
(09-02-2014 12:56 AM)fmudd Wrote:  
(09-02-2014 12:45 AM)DLJ Wrote:  ...
I find your (friend's) god(s) not guilty of existing.

I am not saying that those gods are innocent.

The court is adjourned.

All rise.

There is this reflexive need to keep retreating to the Null Hypothesis.

If you adhere to that; fine. But the instant you say "God does not exist" then you are in effect making a claim based on faith that God doesn't exist.

At BEST you can say that "we don't believe in the Christian's representation of God" but you can't say there is no God without stepping into the realm of faith.

Correct. Full marks.

Yes

Faith implies greater confidence than most are willing to assert... so we don't say that.

However, we can say that there is a high probability that there are no gods due to absence of evidence.

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09-02-2014, 01:10 AM
RE: What is the explaination for everything?
It's getting late; I first want to thank everyone who posted. I am sure we can reconcile at some point.

Will check back later today...
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09-02-2014, 01:19 AM
RE: What is the explaination for everything?
The Path from agnostic to atheist through reason NOT faith

have you read the bible ?,
have you compared GOD to all the other man made deities around the planet (should we be agnostic to 3,000+ entities),
have you prayed for the rescue of a kidnapped child that was eventually found dismembered.
have heard of a single unexplained miracle since the invention of photography and video cameras
have you compared the Noah story to Gilgamesh
have you looked into the evidence for evolution,
have you notice how all major/minor sciences fit with the theory of evolution, Geology, cosmology, Geneology
have you realised how absurd the Noah story is, unless god used so much magic that the boat would have been unnecessary
have you read my signature.

1> So add all that up and either GOD is a mad trickster with an agenda to create disbelief in him, OR
2> There is no deity and humans inverted them for various reasons, like Thor to explain Lightning.

So If I choose option 2 after all the careful research , do you still insist I'm going on FAITH

Theism is to believe what other people claim, Atheism is to ask "why should I".
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09-02-2014, 06:44 AM
RE: What is the explaination for everything?
This has become futile, I just got caught up on the last 5 pages, fmudd is just going to repeat a narrow outlook , that he's convinced himself of, about the definition 'atheist'.

He is intentionally not going to concede to anything other than to prove his self imposed concept of what an atheist is.

The thread started out with a childish question "explain everything" which he then turned into a debate to prove his delusional dogma.

I doubt he's willing to listen to any amount of reason from an opposing point of view, or he wouldnt just keep repeating the same thing over and over again, ad nauseam.

This does get so old ! Undecided

If bullshit were music some people would be a brass band.
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09-02-2014, 06:57 AM
RE: What is the explaination for everything?
(08-02-2014 03:27 PM)fmudd Wrote:  
(08-02-2014 03:19 PM)War Horse Wrote:  Everything just is.

Thats as vague of an answere as your question is.

OK, here is why I am asking.

I am asking this question because I am in an ongoing discussion with a Christian who uses God to explain everything.

I want to show that atheism has a better way to explain existence.

The answers I have found seems "religious".

I am not arguing; I am just trying to find how atheists explains existence.

A god explains nothing. Without Special Pleading, the concept (as an explanation) is useless. A deity which "exists", in no way explains "existence", ((as it MUST (have always)) "participated" in (only part of) Reality. That ain't no "creator".

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein
Those who were seen dancing were thought to be insane by those who could not hear the music - Friedrich Nietzsche
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09-02-2014, 07:17 AM
RE: What is the explaination for everything?
(09-02-2014 01:02 AM)fmudd Wrote:  I am purposely creating pressure against this Null Hypothesis theory that people uphold to because that is simply not what atheists have done.

Atheists don't say that "we believe the Christian God doesn't exist BUT we don't know ourselves."

There is the absolute positive assertion that God doesn't exist.

You (as in atheists) are bound by the very idea of the Null Hypothesis yourself whenever you say "God doesn't exist".

And, on that thought, how can you say with certainty that the religious folks are wrong with their claims.

Atheists have no belief in god/gods.
Gnostic Atheists are sure that there are no god/gods.
Agnostic Atheists say have no evidence to corroborate the existance of any god/gods. I'm one of these.

So to answer your question I, for one, cannot say with certainty that whatever take on the supernatural you have is wrong. What I can say is that based on all evidence to the contrary the supernatural does not occur.

This brings us to the often mentioned Teapot argument;
Can I say with 100% certainty that a Teapot does not orbit the planet Neptune? No I cannot.
Is there any evidence to suggest it exists? No there is not.
Could you credit the Teapot for anything? Yes.
Is this a logical thing to do? No.

So you can hang your hat on any scripture, religion, belief system you like and I could never disprove you with 100% certainty or that you are looney tunes. Would I let you teach my children about your belief system? Consider Over my dead body.

“I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man’s reasoning powers are not above the monkey’s.”~Mark Twain
“Ocean: A body of water occupying about two-thirds of a world made for man - who has no gills.”~ Ambrose Bierce
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09-02-2014, 07:27 AM
RE: What is the explaination for everything?
What is the explanation for everything? Gwyneth Paltrow. Heart

Know why? 'Cause I'm a fucking nutbag. Big Grin

This question is derivative of 'First Cause' philosophy, where thingness just is, but the animating force within thingness is god. Such philosophy is swallowed and regurgitated by many theists as it is simple and emotionally satisfying. When the theist is up and feeling good, god is great, when the theist is down, it is the sinful self or the devil; and they just happily bebop along without any critical self-analysis.

A more rational explanation for everything would be entropy, but such is not emotionally satisfying nor neatly expressed in a forum post. Many people are neither scientifically literate enough nor scientifically inclined to accept the potential answers modeled by science. The uncertainty of theory is far less comforting than the manufactured certainty of folk theology.

As for dismissing the theory of god, understand that these concepts do not stand alone. The concept of god stands upon descriptors, for instance omnigod can be dismissed for logical inconsistency, everywhere god can be dismissed for triviality, revealed god dismissed for promises not kept. An atheist is not required to construct a god from descriptors before tearing it down. What if you were to say "god does not exist," only to have me reply, "my Gwynnies?"

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09-02-2014, 07:36 AM
RE: What is the explaination for everything?
(08-02-2014 04:31 PM)fmudd Wrote:  
(08-02-2014 04:22 PM)Drunkin Druid Wrote:  I think you've summed up your misunderstanding right here. As an atheist I have never asserted there is no god nor have I ever asserted that god didn't create the universe. I simply disagree with the assertion that there is a god or that he created the universe based on the fact that there is no evidence to back up the claim. Bottom line is I don't know how the universe came to be nor do I know if god exists or not. I don't know, you don't know and your Christian friend don't know. Nobody knows and anyone who tries to tell you they do know is either crazy, lying to you or is deluding themselves.

Thanks to everyone; I showed the Christian this thread and out of all the comments she feels this was one of the most honest and open-minded responses on here and she really appreciates this.

Also thank you for not beating up on me.
Yes it was an honest response but you still don't seem to get it. I explained it to you pretty clearly. Nobody is saying there is no god. Everybody is saying there is no evidence for god so the claim can not be accepted. If I said I could turn into the Incredible Hulk would you believe me? Would you ask for evidence? You would, if you are rational reject my claim. Would that be faith that tells you I can't make the transformation? To reject something because of the lack of evidence is not faith based!
Now, if you say atheism is faith based again my head will pop.
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09-02-2014, 07:48 AM
RE: What is the explaination for everything?
(09-02-2014 07:27 AM)houseofcantor Wrote:  What is the explanation for everything? Gwyneth Paltrow. Heart

Know why? 'Cause I'm a fucking nutbag. Big Grin

This question is derivative of 'First Cause' philosophy, where thingness just is, but the animating force within thingness is god. Such philosophy is swallowed and regurgitated by many theists as it is simple and emotionally satisfying. When the theist is up and feeling good, god is great, when the theist is down, it is the sinful self or the devil; and they just happily bebop along without any critical self-analysis.

A more rational explanation for everything would be entropy, but such is not emotionally satisfying nor neatly expressed in a forum post. Many people are neither scientifically literate enough nor scientifically inclined to accept the potential answers modeled by science. The uncertainty of theory is far less comforting than the manufactured certainty of folk theology.

As for dismissing the theory of god, understand that these concepts do not stand alone. The concept of god stands upon descriptors, for instance omnigod can be dismissed for logical inconsistency, everywhere god can be dismissed for triviality, revealed god dismissed for promises not kept. An atheist is not required to construct a god from descriptors before tearing it down. What if you were to say "god does not exist," only to have me reply, "my Gwynnies?"

Have you been drinking?

That made too much sense!

Shocking

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09-02-2014, 08:05 AM
RE: What is the explaination for everything?
(09-02-2014 07:36 AM)Drunkin Druid Wrote:  Now, if you say atheism is faith based again my head will pop.

My atheism is faith based. Angel

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