What is the explaination for everything?
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08-02-2014, 11:13 PM
RE: What is the explaination for everything?
(08-02-2014 11:07 PM)WillHopp Wrote:  While I appreciate your ability to copy and paste from an Internet dictionary, I didn't ask for a definition of atheism. I told you to look up religion and faith, and then when you do, revisit the statements you made using those terms.

Me speaking; I believe that is taking us off track; she is simply asserting that there is a God and not any specific religious doctrine.

Her: There is a God.

Atheists: There is no God.

And this is what the dictionary defines as atheism. So now to say we need to look up a specific form of religion and the specifics of faith is taking us off track.
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08-02-2014, 11:18 PM
RE: What is the explaination for everything?
Again, you have this wrong. Atheists don't say there is no god. Agnostic and atheistic aren't mutually exclusive, in fact there are agnostic theists. One of our mods is one.

And feel free to look up those terms on your own time if you want. But it would help if you understood the terminology before you threw it around a forum that deals heavily in critiquing said terms.

Check out my atheism blog. It's just a blog, no ads, no revenue, no gods.
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Atheism promotes critical thinking; theism promotes hypocritical thinking. -- Me
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08-02-2014, 11:35 PM
RE: What is the explaination for everything?
(08-02-2014 11:06 PM)fmudd Wrote:  
(08-02-2014 11:01 PM)DLJ Wrote:  ... and if your friend is not sure of the difference, think about...

Guilty vs. Not Guilty
as opposed to:
Guilty vs. Innocent.

Wink

I am speaking and not my friend; it seems you are changing the definition of atheism as posted before. Atheism is an assertion. Agnosticism would be what you describe.

Nope. 'Gnost'... relates to knowledge and not belief.

Some dictionaries have yet to catch up with this.

Samuel Johnson described his efforts to create the first English language dictionary as an attempt to "lash the wind". A dictionary is not a 'standard' but a chronicle.

This might help...
[Image: Agnostic%2Bv%2BGnostic%2Bv%2BAtheist%2Bv%2BTheist.png]

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08-02-2014, 11:38 PM
RE: What is the explaination for everything?
(08-02-2014 11:13 PM)fmudd Wrote:  
(08-02-2014 11:07 PM)WillHopp Wrote:  While I appreciate your ability to copy and paste from an Internet dictionary, I didn't ask for a definition of atheism. I told you to look up religion and faith, and then when you do, revisit the statements you made using those terms.

Me speaking; I believe that is taking us off track; she is simply asserting that there is a God and not any specific religious doctrine.

Her: There is a God.

Atheists: There is no God.

And this is what the dictionary defines as atheism. So now to say we need to look up a specific form of religion and the specifics of faith is taking us off track.

Fine. So, she has taken a 'deist' position.

Let's hear the evidence that this is true and if it is convincing enough, we will be compelled to believe.

Go for it.

Thumbsup

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08-02-2014, 11:39 PM
RE: What is the explaination for everything?
(08-02-2014 11:18 PM)WillHopp Wrote:  Again, you have this wrong. Atheists don't say there is no god. Agnostic and atheistic aren't mutually exclusive, in fact there are agnostic theists. One of our mods is one.

And feel free to look up those terms on your own time if you want. But it would help if you understood the terminology before you threw it around a forum that deals heavily in critiquing said terms.

I understand if you would like to say there is an impasse here; but I don't feel the problem is regarding terms.

My friend's essential point is this, which people have alluded to here:

The various faiths of the world all assert that there is a God since man has came unto this Earth. There has been an infinite number of claims to what exactly is this higher power but virtually all claims points to a higher power of some kind.

The atheist then comes along and says there is no God, but then expects only the people who are religious to defend their faith and the atheist just get's to sit back and claim the position of the Null Hypothesis?

We come down to BOTH sides making a claim of faith at some point; where the religious people claim there is a God on faith and the atheist claiming there is no God.

At some point the atheist is claiming there is no God based on faith and lack of evidence as well. To now claim the realm of agnosticism is unfair because that isn't what atheism expounds upon.
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08-02-2014, 11:41 PM
RE: What is the explaination for everything?
(08-02-2014 11:38 PM)DLJ Wrote:  Fine. So, she has taken a 'deist' position.

Let's hear the evidence that this is true and if it is convincing enough, we will be compelled to believe.

Go for it.

Thumbsup

Her assertion for belief is that we are here. That is her proof.

What she wants to hear is the opposite; what evidence is that there is no God? The Null Hypothesis position she feels is invalid if you believe there is no God.

What are you basing your lack of belief of God on?
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08-02-2014, 11:42 PM
RE: What is the explaination for everything?
Nope.

We are not saying that there IS NO GOD.

We are saying that we do not believe the claims.

Same goes for alien abductions, Big Foot, Father Christmas and the Tooth Fairy.

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08-02-2014, 11:44 PM
RE: What is the explaination for everything?
(08-02-2014 11:35 PM)DLJ Wrote:  
(08-02-2014 11:06 PM)fmudd Wrote:  I am speaking and not my friend; it seems you are changing the definition of atheism as posted before. Atheism is an assertion. Agnosticism would be what you describe.

Nope. 'Gnost'... relates to knowledge and not belief.

Some dictionaries have yet to catch up with this.

Samuel Johnson described his efforts to create the first English language dictionary as an attempt to "lash the wind". A dictionary is not a 'standard' but a chronicle.

This might help...

Me here; but at the end of the day you are making a leap of faith if you say God doesn't exist.

There is no proof that God doesn't exist either.
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08-02-2014, 11:44 PM
RE: What is the explaination for everything?
The claimant has the burden of proof.

What are her claims?

The more specific the claims, the more evidence is required.

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08-02-2014, 11:45 PM
RE: What is the explaination for everything?
(08-02-2014 11:39 PM)fmudd Wrote:  I understand if you would like to say there is an impasse here; but I don't feel the problem is regarding terms.

My friend's essential point is this, which people have alluded to here:

The various faiths of the world all assert that there is a God since man has came unto this Earth. There has been an infinite number of claims to what exactly is this higher power but virtually all claims points to a higher power of some kind.

The atheist then comes along and says there is no God, but then expects only the people who are religious to defend their faith and the atheist just get's to sit back and claim the position of the Null Hypothesis?

We come down to BOTH sides making a claim of faith at some point; where the religious people claim there is a God on faith and the atheist claiming there is no God.

At some point the atheist is claiming there is no God based on faith and lack of evidence as well. To now claim the realm of agnosticism is unfair because that isn't what atheism expounds upon.
Which atheist here has claimed that there is no God? Consider

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