What is your opinion about aliens?
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05-01-2012, 08:18 AM
RE: What is your opinion about aliens?
I like them gently braised and served as a side dish to roast baby.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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08-01-2012, 07:21 PM
RE: What is your opinion about aliens?
Speaking mathematically, I guess, aliens are practically confirmed to exist somewhere out there. As for whether or not they've ever visited to Earth, are anywhere even relatively near Earth, or will be seen within my lifetime...I highly doubt it. Even Europa's pretty damn far away.
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08-01-2012, 11:04 PM
RE: What is your opinion about aliens?
(07-11-2011 02:43 AM)bemore Wrote:  In WW2 the germans seemed to make progress with rocket technology (V2 rockets) and I believe after the war that many of the prominent scientists in the work of rockets were "captured" and given new means to further there work.

Are you implying that ETs helped the Germans? The development of rocket technology is well-document and it follows an entirely human arc of development.
After the war, the Soviets and the Western Allies raced to capture as many of the German rocket and nuclear scientists as possible. All well-documented.

Quote:A lot of art throughout time.......from beautifull works to basic caveman drawings seem to have objects that resemble UFOs in the sky.

Erich von Daniken wrote some interesting books his most famous being "chariot of the gods" were he puts (quite an interesting) arguement foward where he compares a lot of religious work to aliens......he finds a lot of comparisons. Although a lot of people have tried to debunk him saying his ideas are "fallacious" Rolleyes

People didn't try to debunk him by calling his ideas fallacious; they did debunk his ideas by demonstrating that they were fallacious.

Quote:When you look at quantum physics there is so much we dont yet understand about everything the universe is made up of...........how electrons are nowhere and everywhere until you observe them........CERN are smashing particles together and learning so much about how reality is structured......they are looking for the "god" particle.....a hypothesis that would explain kind of fit a lot of things together.....I dont think they will find it TBH as all the other experiemental results up to now are still baffling them.

I don't think you have a very clear understanding of these ideas, e.g. electrons are not "nowhere and everywhere until you observe them". The Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle has a very precise physical and mathematical formulation stating that the act of observation involves hitting the electron with a photon of light so as to determine its position, thereby changing its position and velocity. The higher the energy of the photon (i.e. the shorter the wavelength) the more accurately you can determine its position, but the more you will affect its velocity - that is, the more uncertain your knowledge of its previous velocity will be.

Quote:That doesnt mean to say though that Alien Entitys havent worked out quantum physics LONG before us.......which makes me think that if there are Aliens floating round Earth watching us and studying us like some David Attenborough documentary then our actions (suffering, war, etc etc) would make them think "yeah these peeps are not ready for the things we have to show them"

Maybe they are that far advanced that they couldnt communicate with us in a reasonable way.........I mean I can study insects........I can sit and watch and even interact (liek feeding etc etc) with them...........but can I teach them how to form a structured society more advanced than there own???

Ants aren't of sufficient intelligence to make this a valid simile.

Quote:Also we exist in the "third dimension" and can only see a very small part of the spectrum.......maybe aliens exist in the fourth....fifth and further dimension but have the Tech to look backwards like we understand that 2D objects are flat.

We exist in four dimensions.

Quote:I think ive added enough for now but I shall end on another very interesting video where Richard Dolan talks about the implications on goverment and society of the revealing of ETS.




I will try to watch the video soon. The effects on humanity if ETs do show up should be remarkable.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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11-01-2012, 03:35 AM
RE: What is your opinion about aliens?
I have personally seen something very odd indeed to the point which the closest explanation I could give to what I saw was ''A torpedo like object in the sky that had both rounded edges but a long cylinder middle tube'' that was static in the sky, but slightly rotating from left to right.

Was it an alien? I would have to say no, apart from saying it as an absolute, definately not
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16-01-2012, 06:20 AM
RE: What is your opinion about aliens?
(11-01-2012 03:35 AM)Phenakist Wrote:  I have personally seen something very odd indeed to the point which the closest explanation I could give to what I saw was ''A torpedo like object in the sky that had both rounded edges but a long cylinder middle tube'' that was static in the sky, but slightly rotating from left to right.

Was it an alien? I would have to say no, apart from saying it as an absolute, definately not

If you seen something that is unexplained then we can only speculate. That still leads to be unexplained.

As much as I believe that the sighting that the "locals" talk about in some states that they've seen upright walking creatures with no photographic evidence claiming it may or may not have been bigfoot.

That said...

Do aliens exist? Perhaps. Do we know? Not with certainty..... yet.

However. On a cosmic roll of the dice level, it's possible. With Keplar 22b - maybe? Depends too on your definition of aliens. Simply organisms on another planet that exist? Or does it have to be a race of intelligent life?

I think if we did find life on other planets (intelligent life or not) that it very well may end up entirely changing the perspective of many within organized religion.
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16-01-2012, 05:25 PM (This post was last modified: 16-01-2012 05:28 PM by Luminon.)
RE: What is your opinion about aliens?
My opinion on aliens is in some aspects original. I too think that life must be out there on any other habitable planet. And I am quite fascinated by some Sumerian and Biblical references that totally look like alien technology and ancient astronauts. (though there is no sign of their arrival or departure or why they ignored neolithic humanity)

But my actual opinion is based on the world of dark matter or etheric matter. (see my extremely long posts, conversations, arguments and links) The etheric biosphere must be much larger and friendly to life, than our thin atmospheric layer.
We are life forms composed of biologic and etheric body. Our etheric body is more like a solar-powered/pneumatic appliance, connected to nerve and endocrine system. It doesn't survive for long without the biology. However, this should be no obstacle for fully etheric life to exist.

It would be absolutely fascinating to study the etheric biota. I suspect that due to plentiful solar and cosmic energy such life probably would not evolve many predatory habits, which is just as well for us. Still, a direct interaction might be dangerous, if only because of the concentrated energy they gather and consume. And for the most part, as unaware ground dwellers running mostly on scarce chemical energy, we should be beyond their attention.

Many esotericists think that the unexplained and unexplainable occurences of UFO (and many of the "explained" ones) are vehicles of etheric beings that evolved sentience and achieved technology. Given right technology, etheric matter can be (usually temporarily) "densified" or converted to our matter. There should be no great difference between the two, only in the size and configuration and overlap of their respective atoms and electron orbitals. (that are responsible for tangibility of the matter) No fancy inter-dimensional transitions or anything like that. But from our point of view it is a very characteristic materialization and dematerialization.

This gives us some interesting possibilities. Many skeptics complain, why are photographs and footages of UFO so blurry. It may be just that photographing a half-materialized object that sometimes glows and has no definite outer shape is something our camera manufacturers didn't think of.
Except maybe that they did.
The film by Joe Escamilla, UFO - The Greatest Story Ever Denied (based on the Disclosure Project) shows how frequent and clear UFO footages you can get if you use infra-red (or night vision) camera and hi-speed recording. Anyway, recording in the infrared and near-ultraviolet spectra is bound to show something interesting. The NASA footages of astronaut missions look more like divers on National Geographic recording plankton at night. Except that this "space plankton" is about 4 goddamn kilometers in diameter Undecided

Please take a look at this if you can and comment, I'd really like to know your opinion. Not the "rods", they're probably just insects. If you notice the grooves on top and bottom side of the "rod", they don't move along as the "rod" moves. They make a pattern like one pair of flapping insect wings under over-exposure. Unless of couse I'm wrong and the "rods" are measured too large and fast to be insects. Maybe etheric insects Smile

My opinion is, that the public opinion on UFO observations and records comes from a less innocent time, when political superpowers were hell-bent on total domination over their air space and secrecy. Acknowledging something that treats your air territory (defended for a price of billions and billions of dollars) like a pigeon loft is very bad for public relations. And every information that the Commies didn't know of was more valuable for that very reason. After Cold war the relations might be more friendly, but lies are like a running train full of manure. You can't just suddenly stop lying to the public, or shit would hit the fan. There would be retrospective blaming for lying or not stopping the lies earlier and a general mass extinction of political careers. Plus, everyone knows UFOs are harmless and ignoring them is safe. So why not do it a while longer, as long as my military/political career lasts. When I retire, I'll just go relieve my conscience publically on the Disclosure Project.

If you claim there are nuances to principles, there are no nuances to getting arrested or shot for disobeying the power.
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16-01-2012, 05:31 PM
RE: What is your opinion about aliens?
Well, now you've combined this etheric woo with conspiracy theory. Congratulations, you just broke the weirdness meter.

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17-01-2012, 12:40 AM
RE: What is your opinion about aliens?
(16-01-2012 05:31 PM)Chas Wrote:  Well, now you've combined this etheric woo with conspiracy theory. Congratulations, you just broke the weirdness meter.
Does it have to be a conspiracy every time anyone acts in their self-interest?

It's not an idea invented by me, many other esotericists thought of it earlier. But it would solve many problems that make the idea of alien presence unlikely.
Where do they come from, crawling at light speed between stars for centuries? Nope, they were here all along, on the etheric counterparts of planets and bigger moons of our solar system.

Why aren't we already raided by superior force, what do they want or need from us? Nothing. Nothing government-related, certainly. Just a neighbourly visit and perhaps saving our asses a little, to rewind ecologic clock a little and give us time in global crisis.

Anyway, if UFO can appear, disappear or change speeds and directions rapidly in thousands of km/h, then there is something weird about its mass, inertia, solidity and other material aspects.

If you claim there are nuances to principles, there are no nuances to getting arrested or shot for disobeying the power.
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17-01-2012, 08:17 AM
RE: What is your opinion about aliens?
(17-01-2012 12:40 AM)Luminon Wrote:  
(16-01-2012 05:31 PM)Chas Wrote:  Well, now you've combined this etheric woo with conspiracy theory. Congratulations, you just broke the weirdness meter.
Does it have to be a conspiracy every time anyone acts in their self-interest?

It's not an idea invented by me, many other esotericists thought of it earlier. But it would solve many problems that make the idea of alien presence unlikely.
Where do they come from, crawling at light speed between stars for centuries? Nope, they were here all along, on the etheric counterparts of planets and bigger moons of our solar system.

Why aren't we already raided by superior force, what do they want or need from us? Nothing. Nothing government-related, certainly. Just a neighbourly visit and perhaps saving our asses a little, to rewind ecologic clock a little and give us time in global crisis.

Anyway, if UFO can appear, disappear or change speeds and directions rapidly in thousands of km/h, then there is something weird about its mass, inertia, solidity and other material aspects.

OK, now it's two woo and a conspiracy. You are making the assumption that there really are aliens among us, as well as etheric stuff; and your conspiracy is that governments have been keeping the knowledge of aliens a secret.

There is no evidence for anything you are saying. It's just make-believe.

You seem to be a True Believer, especially with the Sumerian and Biblical alien tie-in; very von Daniken. You seem to have replaced religion with this other made-up crap.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
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17-01-2012, 12:50 PM (This post was last modified: 17-01-2012 02:04 PM by Luminon.)
RE: What is your opinion about aliens?
(17-01-2012 08:17 AM)Chas Wrote:  OK, now it's two woo and a conspiracy. You are making the assumption that there really are aliens among us, as well as etheric stuff; and your conspiracy is that governments have been keeping the knowledge of aliens a secret.

There is no evidence for anything you are saying. It's just make-believe.
I feel like I must study your psychology to get the point across. Or just make you know that there is no intended point.
Looks like every time I say something you assume that I 100% believe it and expect everyone to get 100% convinced. I don't think like that, I hold many ideas simultaneously in my mind and let them grow high or wither down, branch their treetops into many possibilities or support each other as one, or fall down as superfluous to hold the idea. My jungle of ideas grows in the life-giving rain of new information and experience or gets devoured by atta ants of internal consistency, external non-contradiction and other critters of thought.

To me it looks like you don't perceive anything else but bare forest ground and trees of 100 meters and above, nothing in between. And there is hell a lot in between. I don't know what you mean by evidence. But there are photographs, videos, all sorts of witnesses (from soldiers to presidents), written records and personal observations of mine truly. I don't expect anyone to be convinced, but I believe there is such a thing as half-convinced, quarter-convinced or three-quarters convinced. None of this evidence (or however you call it) is tall enough on its own, but stacked together it's more than tall enough. Conscience would gnaw at me like a bullet ant, because I'd feel really really intellectually dishonest if I'd ignore the everything in between.

Excuse my sudden artistic inspiration, but if there is poetry of science, then why not poetry of pseudoscience? Tongue
My poetic gut Wrote:In the land of ideas, there was a country called Sparta, ruled by the mighty warrior Chassius. The Spartan custom was to test all the baby ideas. Each newborn baby idea was taken from its mother and was placed in a plain space, where there was nothing but nothing and the idea. And the mighty Chassius. No other idea to help it. The baby idea alone was judged by Chassius if it's strong enough to stand on its own. Most of them weren't. Hell, almost none were. When the baby idea wasn't strong enough to stand alone, Chassius took it and threw it from a tall cliff. A couple hundred kilometers away, in the city-state of Lumenes, local philosophers wondered at this spartan Spartan custom and pondered. "How many of these ideas would be able to stand and grow, given a little support, more time and a loving, nurturing mother?" bearded men asked. "For Fuckeus' sake, why are even the baby ideas required each to stand on their own? Don't we all depend on each other?" others murmured quietly, for Spartans not to overhear. "Weren't many of the mightiest ideas supported in their infancy by dozens, hundreds like them?" the bravest yelled from shadows.
Suddenly, a deep voice rumbled over the shaky walls of the city of Lumenes. Mighty Chassius himself snuck upon the unsuspecting city and made all its dwellers jump: "That shall not be so! For among the baby ideas the fearsome monsters lurk in disguise. The hydra of credulity, who's one head you cut and two grow in its place. The gorgon of superstition, who's gaze turns your brain into stone. The chimera of fraud, who's teeth sink deep into the flesh of funding. Only one weakness they have, they can not prove themselves by themselves alone. So I shall be as the future king Herod, for whom there shall be no historical evidence, and all baby ideas that don't prove themselves by themselves shall be put to death." So Chassius spoke and the bearded men of Lumenes furiously scribbled on their parchments, lest Chassius would return and repeat the message by practical demonstration. Only a an echo of his voice rolled over the city like a distant thunder, "...and silent ye be, lest I convict you of the vile practice of necromancy, raising long-dead ideas back to life!"


(17-01-2012 08:17 AM)Chas Wrote:  You seem to be a True Believer, especially with the Sumerian and Biblical alien tie-in; very von Daniken. You seem to have replaced religion with this other made-up crap.
Seriously, I don't know what to think about the ancient astronauts. They seem like a superfluous chapter in history of humanity. They didn't have anything to do with neolithic and earlier history and they're obviously nowehere in the modern history. All we have left are just several really weird myths that give a technologic impression.
For example, if some desert folks would get their hands on a capacitor device charged through radioactive materials inside, powering a radio with arc loudspeaker on the top (the two cherubs) the resulting description would be pretty much like the Ark of Covenant. Including how lots of them (Philistines) died on tumors, probably from all the radiation leaking from the inside.

I don't think I 100% believe this story, but when the topic is right I might share it around for the fun of it. This is how it looks like when I suspend my judgement on something. I think of it as a lonely middle-sized tree in a clearing of my jungle of ideas that didn't grow an inch for many years and probably won't. The only thing I am sure of is, that the Stargate series was inspired by such legends, but the authors didn't have the Baalls to include Yahweh as one of the Goauld Big Grin

If you claim there are nuances to principles, there are no nuances to getting arrested or shot for disobeying the power.
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