What is your opinion about aliens?
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15-06-2011, 04:27 PM (This post was last modified: 15-06-2011 05:01 PM by TrainWreck.)
RE: What is your opinion about aliens?
(14-06-2011 04:38 PM)Simone Wrote:  Do they exist? Are they here?
Probably not - we would have recognized some astrophysics' unique radio pattern message by now.

The only space aliens are going to be the ones we are responsible for having deployed.


(14-06-2011 07:45 PM)lucradis Wrote:  I believe in intelligent aliens, and I believe personally that they have been here. I won't go to far into that for fear of becoming an outcast. I have seen things throughout my whole life that currently can not be explained, that I would love to believe are aliens, but I of course have not deemed it so. I don't think I'd be a very good walking teapot if I just assumed that's what I'd seen, but I do sway that way in my personal opinion. If only I could prove it. Or disprove it. Whatever.
Yeah, you've said enough - you're a nutjob.


(14-06-2011 10:31 PM)blasphemy fan Wrote:  If one gives it just a little thought, an alien ‘astronaut’ would appear god like to an ancient person with little or no scientific knowledge at all. Think of the ancient Sumerians of Mesopotamia seeing an astronaut from the Apollo program walking around. Think of what THEY would have written! ( in cuneiform ) They undoubtably would have believed they were seeing “gods”.

Again, just wild speculation, If these travelers knew we were developing to the point we would recognize them for what they really are, they may have elected to watch us from afar, rather than make contact with a developing specie. Or, maybe someone pissed them off by eating their apple! Tongue
Please - you are off the rocker. People made up gods, they did not experience space aliens, and decide to equate them to some supernatural garbage.

Watching us from afar - how? Please they have to use the same use of electro-magnetic radiation as us, and we have been monitoring it all for several decades now - now, how do they do it?

(15-06-2011 11:56 AM)Lilith Pride Wrote:  Currently what holds us back is our dependence on oil, which should've been done away with long ago but has persisted due to greed. I'm not sure how far we will travel, but I'm fairly certain we will eventually begin traveling beyond the few astronauts sent out to our moon and orbiting positions.
No, the problem is that space travel is extremely uncomfortable for human beings - have you any idea what it is like to urinate in zero gravity? Have you seen the Russians when they return from a year in space - they cannot walk. The Russians . . .

Quote:MOSCOW — The crew of a simulated international Mars mission took their first steps on an indoor Red Planet landscape on Monday, marking the halfway point in an ambitious 520-day isolation experiment to test the strains of interplanetary travel.

They did this a few years ago with women, fights broke out, and the woman claimed sexual assault.

The best we should expect to travel is to the Moon after the construction of a Lunar station is built by some very sophisticated machinery. Beyond that, travel is going to have to be done by robots and genetically engineered life forms that can handle zero gravity - like fish, or an octopus with a human brain and nervous system in a saline solution - big fishbowl.

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15-06-2011, 06:26 PM
RE: What is your opinion about aliens?
This reminds me of a few of the discovery channel thought experiment programs, they had one about an autonomous space probe sent from earth to a star system named Darwin to investigate a planet believe to have similar conditions to Earth. Then there was the more recent one about a space race between China and the United States, both sending their own manned space mission to mars to drill for water... If I remember correctly the USA mission got infected with some Martian bacteria or something.

As far as space craft go, I read an article(wish I remembered where) about a team of researchers who were studying the applications of submarine technology to spacecraft, more specifically, a sort of coral like organism that [insert country name here] had developed to repair small scrapes and cracks in the hulls of U-boats. This coral-like stuff was basically just seeded into the hull itself then slowly grew over it, solidifying into any crevices.

Hey brother christian, with your high and mighty errand, your actions speak so loud, I can't hear a word you're saying.

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15-06-2011, 08:01 PM
RE: What is your opinion about aliens?
Diederick said;
Quote:Aliens (as in outer space intelligent life) exist, but I don't think we'll ever find them, or that they'll ever find us. The distances we're talking about are incredible, there's no way we'll have Star Trek-like adventures with other intelligent species in the universe.

Blas says;
It very well depends on how far you are willing to look into the future. I'm not talking about in OUR life times, but in the very distant future, we ( our 10th or 20th generation grandchildren ) MIGHT experience joint space exploration.
Our entire concept of carrying out space travel will have to be changed massively. Rockets are not gonna get the job done, not at post light speed. What we know as wormholes MAY POSSIBLY be the next step, but most likely, we cannot even yet fathom what the answer will be. There are most likely forms of energy that we don't even know exist yet, and types of propulsion ditto. A while back, I read some theory about "folding" space to pass through it. This MAY someday become a reality.

I seriously doubt that in 1967, Bill Shatner ever thought he would one day hold an actual working folding communicator with video! Yet today's teenagers cannot imagine the world before them! 100 years ago, we had the telegraph. Today, we have hand held, portable, high definition video, and we can stream live video from anywhere, any time.

108 years ago, the Wright Brothers made the first powered flight in a 'heavier than air' craft. In 1964, the SR-71 broke the Mach 3 speed in Earth's atmosphere. On July 20, 1969, Apollo 11 landed on the moon. All these were done with primitive fossil fuels. We have come a long way in a short time, but we still have a long way to go.

In 1904, John Ambrose Fleming invented the first practical electron tube called the "Fleming Valve".On December 16, 1947, Bell Laboratories created the first working solid state transistor. On March 24, 1959, Texas Instruments revealed the first working microchip. A modern 4Core i7 Pentium has 731,000,000 transistors in it!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transistor_count (in case you don't believe me )

What will we have in another 100 years?

Lilith Pride said;
Quote:Currently what holds us back is our dependence on oil, which should've been done away with long ago but has persisted due to greed. I'm not sure how far we will travel, but I'm fairly certain we will eventually begin traveling beyond the few astronauts sent out to our moon and orbiting positions.

I, personally don't believe fossil fuels will take us out of our own solar system. We will have to invent a whole new way of conducting space travel, to get MANKIND out of the solar system. Yes, I AM aware that we have man made space probes already there, or close to it, but that's been a very long flight.

But I DO agree with you that IN TIME we will get much further than we can currently reach. Also I ( sadly ) agree that it won't be in my lifetime. I don't see it becoming possible in the 30 - 40 years I may have left. ( I'll be 50 in December)

I wish I could live to see that day, but that would take a more massive surge in technology than anyone can image, to occur within this time frame.

Lilith Pride also said;
Quote:I don't think that as star trek suggests we will be given info on aliens when we break this limitation as a reward for becoming a space faring species, but I'm sure we will eventually be a space faring species (I don't have to be alive still for it to happen).

I can't imagine a "Zefram Cochrane Redneck Country Club" out there either. But I do believe that it's possible that one day in the FAR distant future, we may find another intelligent species, or they might find us, and that we could possibly pool our resources, and explore space together.

For this to happen, we would have to curb our desire for a "Shoot first and ask questions later" way of introduction. I fear this would only place us on the way short end of the proverbial stick.

(15-06-2011 04:27 PM)TrainWreck Wrote:  
(14-06-2011 04:38 PM)Simone Wrote:  Do they exist? Are they here?
Probably not - we would have recognized some astrophysics' unique radio pattern message by now. The only space aliens are going to be the ones we are responsible for having deployed.

Blas says;
What makes you think that radio is the only form of communication? There could be way more advanced methods of communication that we have no way to detect yet.

FM radio wasn't invented until 1933, so in 1932, there would have been no way to detect it. Therefore, there could be other intelligent signals floating around us right now that we cannot detect.



(15-06-2011 04:27 PM)TrainWreck Wrote:  
(14-06-2011 07:45 PM)lucradis Wrote:  I believe in intelligent aliens, and I believe personally that they have been here. I won't go to far into that for fear of becoming an outcast. I have seen things throughout my whole life that currently can not be explained, that I would love to believe are aliens, but I of course have not deemed it so. I don't think I'd be a very good walking teapot if I just assumed that's what I'd seen, but I do sway that way in my personal opinion. If only I could prove it. Or disprove it. Whatever.
Yeah, you've said enough - you're a nutjob.
Blas says;
That's the pot calling the kettle black!

(15-06-2011 04:27 PM)TrainWreck Wrote:  
(14-06-2011 10:31 PM)blasphemy fan Wrote:  If one gives it just a little thought, an alien ‘astronaut’ would appear god like to an ancient person with little or no scientific knowledge at all. Think of the ancient Sumerians of Mesopotamia seeing an astronaut from the Apollo program walking around. Think of what THEY would have written! ( in cuneiform ) They undoubtably would have believed they were seeing “gods”.


Again, just wild speculation, If these travelers knew we were developing to the point we would recognize them for what they really are, they may have elected to watch us from afar, rather than make contact with a developing specie. Or, maybe someone pissed them off by eating their apple! Tongue

(15-06-2011 04:27 PM)TrainWreck Wrote:  Please - you are off the rocker. People made up gods, they did not experience space aliens, and decide to equate them to some supernatural garbage.

Blas says;
Reading is fundamental, but comprehension is crucial! I never said that were made up by anyone other than our ancestors. I simply implied the possibility that they could have gotten the idea by seeing something they could not explain, in the form of an E.T., but never said that WAS the case! I just left the door of possibility open...

(15-06-2011 04:27 PM)TrainWreck Wrote:  Watching us from afar - how? Please they have to use the same use of electro-magnetic radiation as us, and we have been monitoring it all for several decades now - now, how do they do it?

Blas says;
If they have the technology for such distant travel, I'd say that it's safe to say their technology accedes ours.
(15-06-2011 04:27 PM)TrainWreck Wrote:  
(15-06-2011 11:56 AM)Lilith Pride Wrote:  Currently what holds us back is our dependence on oil, which should've been done away with long ago but has persisted due to greed. I'm not sure how far we will travel, but I'm fairly certain we will eventually begin traveling beyond the few astronauts sent out to our moon and orbiting positions.
No, the problem is that space travel is extremely uncomfortable for human beings - have you any idea what it is like to urinate in zero gravity? Have you seen the Russians when they return from a year in space - they cannot walk. The Russians . . .

Quote:MOSCOW — The crew of a simulated international Mars mission took their first steps on an indoor Red Planet landscape on Monday, marking the halfway point in an ambitious 520-day isolation experiment to test the strains of interplanetary travel.


They did this a few years ago with women, fights broke out, and the woman claimed sexual assault.




Blas says;
Hey Train, have you ever heard of "Artificial Gravity"? I also believe that it's only a matter of time before we cross that threshold.

(15-06-2011 04:27 PM)TrainWreck Wrote:  The best we should expect to travel is to the Moon after the construction of a Lunar station is built by some very sophisticated machinery. Beyond that, travel is going to have to be done by robots and genetically engineered life forms that can handle zero gravity - like fish, or an octopus with a human brain and nervous system in a saline solution - big fishbowl.

Blas says;
And YOU think WE are off our rockers? !!! Undecided

Oh, on that note...
(15-06-2011 04:27 PM)TrainWreck Wrote:  Please - you are off the rocker.
I'm only 49.5 years old. I'm not in my rocker Yet! Tongue

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15-06-2011, 09:46 PM
RE: What is your opinion about aliens?
Hey Blasphemy Fan, just to make my point clear I wasn't suggesting fossil fuels could get us anywhere. I was discussing that we have been caught up on them when we could've been seeking better fuels. Many people attempted alternatives to oil, but were quieted by the money behind the oil industry. If they had been allowed to work and research I'm sure we would be much further in terms of renewable energy sources at this point. Despite the severe drawbacks of fossil fuels though, we do still have limited space travel. That to me makes it clear that we will have a burst of innovation once viable renewable energy sources are discovered.

I'm not a non believer, I believe in the possibility of anything. I just don't let the actuality of something be determined by a 3rd party.
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15-06-2011, 10:21 PM (This post was last modified: 15-06-2011 10:36 PM by ghostexorcist.)
RE: What is your opinion about aliens?
I am open to the idea of life on other planets. Like the old saying goes: "where there is water, there is life." There are bound to be a myriad of planets and moons with water out there. As for "visitors," I'm not so sure. I've heard of several people who wholeheartedly believe that the pyramids were built by aliens. If I happen to meet such a person, I always ask them the following question: "What is more likely, that aliens traveled trillions of miles, possibly via warping the space time continue, to design and build the pyramids, or humans did it?" I think it is a slap in the face of human ingenuity and muscle to think otherwise. I've never seen a UFO, and honestly I would have to think vehicles capable of interstellar travel would come in more variates than the highly reported saucer-shape. And why come all this way to study us for hundreds or thousands of years without making themselves definitively known?

I think a lot of people's concepts of aliens have been molded by what they have seen in TV and movies. No matter how fugly they may be (yes, fugly), they always come in "humanoid" shapes with hands and feet and speak through their mouths. If they exist, they are no doubt more different than us than ever could be imagined. Their concept of intelligent life might be much different than our own.
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15-06-2011, 11:19 PM (This post was last modified: 16-06-2011 12:08 AM by blasphemy fan.)
RE: What is your opinion about aliens?
(15-06-2011 09:46 PM)Lilith Pride Wrote:  Hey Blasphemy Fan, just to make my point clear I wasn't suggesting fossil fuels could get us anywhere. I was discussing that we have been caught up on them when we could've been seeking better fuels. Many people attempted alternatives to oil, but were quieted by the money behind the oil industry. If they had been allowed to work and research I'm sure we would be much further in terms of renewable energy sources at this point. Despite the severe drawbacks of fossil fuels though, we do still have limited space travel. That to me makes it clear that we will have a burst of innovation once viable renewable energy sources are discovered.

I agree 100% with you on that. The oil companies' greed has held back a long overdue search for a better and renewable energy. I see dams and steam (solar heated ) as two good options here on Earth, but virtually useless in space.

Maybe one day we will develop the photo electric cell's potential to the point where it would be cost efficient, but at this time, I don't see it being cost effective. Wind mills are too dependent on uncontrollable weather. Nuclear power is far too dangerous, and we have no long term solution for the waste. In my mind, fossil fuels should be an absolute no - no.

Hoover Dam's Lake Mead is being sucked dry by Las Vegas, which was foolish from the git - go. They should have built another dam downstream from Hoover, and retained the water there to supply Vegas and other area towns after flowing through the dam..

As or space, perhaps one day in the distant future, nuclear fusion propulsion could be an answer for space exploration. Or maybe someday, 'folding' space.
http://www.slais.ubc.ca/courses/libr500/...e_fold.htm
(15-06-2011 10:21 PM)ghostexorcist Wrote:  I am open to the idea of life on other planets. Like the old saying goes: "where there is water, there is life."

What if life from another planet does not depend on water. Life as WE know it depends on water. What if life somewhere else is an ion cloud, or some compound vapor? Or, just for giggles, a pet rock that breaths mustard gas may be a living pet! Life as WE know it MAY only exist here.

(15-06-2011 10:21 PM)ghostexorcist Wrote:  I always ask them the following question: "What is more likely, that aliens traveled trillions of miles, possibly via warping the space time continue, to design and build the pyramids, or humans did it?" I think it is a slap in the face of human ingenuity and muscle to think otherwise.

What if the pyramids were dual purpose. One purpose, a necropolis for 4th dynasty pharaohs, royals, and engineers, and the other, a marker on a 3d map of space?
I'm not saying it was, just throwing ideas that keep getting accused of being statements. I'll play devil's advocate here...
But how did the pyramids all get faced so perfectly north without the benefit of a compass?

(15-06-2011 10:21 PM)ghostexorcist Wrote:  I've never seen a UFO, and honestly I would have to think vehicles capable of interstellar travel would come in more variates than the highly reported saucer-shape.

A "Flying Saucer" is as fake as the cross. I cannot imagine any civilization travelling in one of those. Nor would a deep space vehicle require wings, because they would be useless in space. A vapor or ion cloud may not even require a vehicle to travel in. They may be able to survive space naked. And how long would one live? Who knows. To travel across the universe at 10 MPH may still afford them countless visits here, if they live long lives.

(15-06-2011 10:21 PM)ghostexorcist Wrote:  And why come all this way to study us for hundreds or thousands of years without making themselves definitively known?

Ancient Egypt was roughly 5000 years ago, not 100's of thousands. However, it is possible that a long lived, well advanced species may well hold interest in us for a long period of time. By their definition, 5000 of our years may be 5 minutes or less to them.
Window peepers rarely knock on the windows their peeping through.
I doubt that a private eye would introduce himself to his quarry at the beginning of the chase either.

(15-06-2011 10:21 PM)ghostexorcist Wrote:  I think a lot of people's concepts of aliens have been molded by what they have seen in TV and movies.

True, in my opinion. What about microbial lifeforms, perhaps intelligent ones. Or clouds or gasses as I earlier mentioned. Or, pet rocks?

(15-06-2011 10:21 PM)ghostexorcist Wrote:  Their concept of intelligent life might be much different than our own.

Bingo, my point exactly! Tongue They may not even view us as life forms, instead, short term chemical reactions.

It seems as if some are taking my "What Ifs" as real beliefs, instead of silly, yet remotely possible options to be considered, which was all I intended them to be.

Ironically, I fear that I have been mislabeled a "crack pot" here, when I was just tossing alternative thinking around.

It's 3 hours past my bedtime, and 4 till I get back up.

And to all...Good Night! Smile

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16-06-2011, 03:29 AM
RE: What is your opinion about aliens?
Don't worry blasphemy fan, trainwreck is just here to insult, using his "vast intelligence" to stump us at every turn.

Hey brother christian, with your high and mighty errand, your actions speak so loud, I can't hear a word you're saying.

"This machine kills fascists..."

"Well this machine kills commies!"
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16-06-2011, 06:03 AM
RE: What is your opinion about aliens?
(16-06-2011 03:29 AM)UnderTheMicroscope Wrote:  Don't worry blasphemy fan, trainwreck is just here to insult, using his "vast intelligence" to stump us at every turn.

I get a kick out of him. What he sees in simple straight forward sentences, is equal to what an accomplished braille reader sees in a stucco wall! When it comes to finding the obvious meaning in someones words, well, ...he couldn't find his own ass with both hands and a dog. Lets face it, there are some people here whose only reason for existence seemingly is to prove that not all evolution is a forward process. That's what makes them so entertaining. Smile

His "vast intelligence" serves only to stump himself, which is very entertaining to the rest of us. Every forum, it seems, must have a flamer. At least, at his own expense, he IS amusing.

Oxymoron: "Religious teaching"
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16-06-2011, 09:49 AM
RE: What is your opinion about aliens?
Trainwreck, relax, take your shoes off and have a little fun.


To think that we're alone in the universe seems to be idiotic. The numbers are just too large for us to be alone. Though I don't think that they have been here, or they would have gotten very lucky finding us.

That being said, I really like listening to the other ideas out there: Aliens seeded Earth. UFO stories, they helped our ancestors/were the basis of religion, etc. They're all fun to listen too, even if I think some of them are out there.

But for now, I'll settle for finding any hint of life elsewhere. I was really excited when I heard NASA has an announcement a few months ago, but it wasn't aliens or life on other planets, it was a bacteria that replaces Phosphorus with Arsenic in its DNA (maybe, there's still debate about it). Still really cool, but not what I was expecting.

Of all the ideas put forth by science, it is the principle of Superposition that can undo any power of the gods. For the accumulation of smaller actions has the ability to create, destroy, and move the world.

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16-06-2011, 03:11 PM (This post was last modified: 16-06-2011 03:19 PM by Observer.)
RE: What is your opinion about aliens?
Does alien life exist? a full yes! (But let's first come up with a definition of life)
Does Intelligent alien life exist? Hmm... (how about a definition for "intelligent" as well)
Is intelligent alien life among us? I seriously doubt that!

(16-06-2011 06:03 AM)blasphemy fan Wrote:  What he sees in simple straight forward sentences, is equal to what an accomplished braille reader sees in a stucco wall!
Mind if I borrow that now and then? Wink

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Disclaimer: Don’t mix the personal opinion above with the absolute and objective truth. Remember to think for yourself. Thank you.
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