What's left of religion?
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04-11-2014, 06:03 PM
RE: What's left of religion?
(04-11-2014 10:26 AM)WhatWasIThinking Wrote:  
(02-11-2014 02:19 AM)corfou73 Wrote:  For those of you who once had a religious beleif or affiliation: tell me what do you feel is left of it
  • in your worldview?
  • in your psychology?
  • in your social habits?
  • in your morals?
  • in your political positions?
  • else?

I started to reply to this..then realized I dont know yet. Im at a point of pondering what I read a long time ago..dont recall who said it, but it went "Id rather believe in a god and find out there isnt one, than not believe and find out there is"

Thats kinda a slop shot at existing,..and shallow reason to have faith

So I will leave a TBD to the list above

That is Paschal's wager, a philosophically weak perspective in which to induce faith in non-believers.

Pascal's Wager - It is a "safe bet" to believe in God just in case he is real. What's the harm? If you believe and he doesn't exist, you don't lose anything, but if you don't believe and he does exist, you lose big time.

One cannot pretend to believe, one either does or does not. I surmise that a large percentage of "christians" go through the motions under this pretense. If there is a god, I am sure he can see through the pretending..the greatest problem with the wager is its suggestion that a rational person can knowingly will himself to believe a proposition for which he has no evidence. A person can profess any creed he likes, of course, but to really believe something, he must also believe that the belief under consideration is true.

"Belief is so often the death of reason" - Qyburn, Game of Thrones

"The Christian community continues to exist because the conclusions of the critical study of the Bible are largely withheld from them." -Hans Conzelmann (1915-1989)
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04-11-2014, 06:58 PM (This post was last modified: 04-11-2014 07:16 PM by Stuffed_Assumption_Meringue.)
RE: What's left of religion?
You'll find most political positions are left of religion. *Boom*

I was raised catholic; went to a catholic school, was in the choir, filled in for a friend who was unable to make it to church as alter-boy and my extended family largely believes. So I was certainly raised with "christian values" or something like that.

Father Drinkwater and Father Daily were good guys but they never seemed to show insight that was any greater than any of the other old people I knew, they seemed less well informed than my teachers and I never trusted them in confession. I prayed when I was in trouble but I don't think I ever believed it would do anything. I remember thinking that Jesus did exist and was the son of god but I had no firm idea as to who god was or what it wanted. Everything seemed nebulous and I didn't understand much of it.

So I don't know how much faith I had and it was almost certainly gone by the time I hit high school but I do think that I had faith and I can't really parse that out from who I am now. Sorry.

Edit: More thought applied to the subject: Saying "I don't know" is dishonest.

It's certainly effected my political views and social circles: I wouldn't be here if I didn't in some way care about that experience. It's why I've engaged with a couple of street preachers and Jehovah's Witnesses when I've come across them and I find the various political figures who tout their religious beliefs and how that informs policy with inherent suspicion because I think it's a mistake to say that religion is the source of anybodies understanding of ethics or their behaviour so they're already being dishonest.

Religion makes more sense to me as a way of providing context to what their social upbringing tells them to be moral behaviour and it certainly has nothing to do with good economic and diplomatic policy. (It's off topic and I'm not sure I'm equipped to discuss at the moment anyway so I'm leaving that thought there.)

Soulless mutants of muscle and intent. There are billions of us; hardy, smart and dangerous. Shaped by millions of years of death. We are the definitive alpha predator. We build monsters of fire and stone. We bottled the sun. We nailed our god to a stick.

In man's struggle against the world, bet on the man.
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