What's this faith nonsense?
Post Reply
 
Thread Rating:
  • 0 Votes - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
05-12-2014, 11:45 AM
What's this faith nonsense?
One concept that has always bothered me even back when I was a theist is the idea of having faith. Seriously, what's up with that? Why would a god expect us to believe instead of allowing us to know it exists? Worse yet, it's not even as simple as that.

Here are some Bible verses that indicate faith is a good thing without necessarily saying lacking faith is a guaranteed bad thing:

Acts 16:31
And they said, “Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved, you and your household.

John 3:16
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.

John 5:24
Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life. He does not come into judgment, but has passed from death to life.

John 6:47
Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever believes has eternal life.



This verse actually seems to be saying faith is better than knowing:

John 20:29
Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed.



Then we have these verses that indicate faith is a requirement, unless of course you like the sound of going to hell:

Hebrews 11:6
And without faith it is impossible to please him, for whoever would draw near to God must believe that he exists and that he rewards those who seek him.

Mark 16:16
Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned.

John 3:18
Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God.



But...
Faith isn't a choice. It's a gift.

Ephesians 2:8-9
For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may boast.


Cuz gawd can't stand that atrocious boasting stuff, ya know. Dodgy You may rape, enslave, murder, stone, and eat the flesh of your sons and daughters, but no boasting!


Now, if all that isn't ridiculous enough, it gets worse. The bible seems to indicate that faith is not only good, but necessary in order to be "saved". From that perspective, knowledge of gawd's existence is a bad thing. So we wouldn't want anyone to know this god exists because that would make faith impossible.

So then, those poor people who all saw Jesus' miracles! And witnessed his resurrection. And Moses might be famous, but he be must looking at a lot more burning than just a bush by now. Adam and Eve? They were damned the moment they were created and gawd spoke to them to tell them not to eat from that tree - no wonder they did so anyway! (Talking snake, my ass!) Noah? He was only saved while here on earth.

And why does Mary and various saints keep appearing to people trying to impart the knowledge of gawd's existence? Geez, do they want us all to go to hell or something? And why does gawd allow this? In fact, why did gawd himself appear to Noah knowing that Noah would simply pass on his knowledge of gawd to... well everyone since everyone was either a relative with him then or a descendant.

It seems gawd sure can't make up its mind whether it wants us to know about him. It should either show itself so we will know or stop dropping so many hints - ya know, quit beating around those burning bushes. Dodgy

I am not accountable to any God. I am accountable to myself - and not because I think I am God as some theists would try to assert - but because, no matter what actions I take, thoughts I think, or words I utter, I have to be able to live with myself.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 4 users Like Impulse's post
05-12-2014, 03:25 PM
RE: What's this faith nonsense?
Impulse,
Stop asking reasonable questions! You might scare away the remaining theists in the forum.

Look, Hebrews 11:6 says it best, "And without faith it is impossible to please him, for whoever would draw near to God must believe that he exists and that he rewards those who seek him." In other words, you must already believe before you believe. Make sense?

Doc
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes docskeptic's post
05-12-2014, 03:33 PM (This post was last modified: 05-12-2014 06:54 PM by Full Circle.)
RE: What's this faith nonsense?
We need a T-shirt with this

God didn't give me faith...
and I’m OK with that.
ATHEIST

Ephesians 2:8-9

“I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man’s reasoning powers are not above the monkey’s.”~Mark Twain
“Ocean: A body of water occupying about two-thirds of a world made for man - who has no gills.”~ Ambrose Bierce
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 4 users Like Full Circle's post
05-12-2014, 03:34 PM
RE: What's this faith nonsense?
Christian faith is given a ridiculous veneer of respectability, if not absolute necessity by some.
Unthinking belief in some cases is seen as a virtue, while the experiencing of life and creative input may be deemed sinful.
Laziness, in a mature addressing of life, can lead to issues being placed in the too hard basket or even more dangerously in the hands of a so called enlightened clergy.
The notion of a perfect God operating within the Universe, from which we can leech some direction and hopefully eternal bliss.......less hopefully eternal torture, reflects an infantile slave mentality.
We need to glean from our own personal experience of life as social beings, open to change and new insights, to grow, not a passive acceptance of vague and contradictory demands made thousands of years ago.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 2 users Like Mr Woof's post
05-12-2014, 03:40 PM
RE: What's this faith nonsense?
It's such a con game, if the bible asserted that there is a definitive way to KNOW that god existed and told you how to come to this knowledge, then it would be immediately disproved because something non-existent can never manifest itself in the natural world.

The writers of this faith nonsense must have been fully aware of this fact, they devised this faith stuff so they could control people without a shred of evidence to back it up, they just have to convince you of the threat/reward in the afterlife.

The rest is coercive psychology at work......

Gods derive their power from post-hoc rationalizations. -The Inquisition

Using the supernatural to explain events in your life is a failure of the intellect to comprehend the world around you. -The Inquisition
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes TheInquisition's post
05-12-2014, 04:15 PM
RE: What's this faith nonsense?
The people who invented Christianity had no choice but to require faith since none of it stands to reason.

Do not lose your knowledge that man's proper estate is an upright posture, an intransigent mind and a step that travels unlimited roads. - Ayn Rand.

Don't sacrifice for me, live for yourself! - Me

The only alternative to Objectivism is some form of Subjectivism. - Dawson Bethrick
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 3 users Like true scotsman's post
05-12-2014, 05:37 PM
RE: What's this faith nonsense?
My t-shirt would read "I have faith you can fly. Let me throw you off a building."

Insanity - doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 3 users Like Rahn127's post
Post Reply
Forum Jump: