What's with the hate?
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08-10-2013, 12:16 AM
RE: What's with the hate?
(08-10-2013 12:06 AM)englishrose Wrote:  But isn't it also fear?
These people are terrified that science will burst their 'God Bubble' and their whole world will come crashing around their ears and then what will they do?

Well, that's the reason they hate science so much.

Fear, denial and pride... I'm sure pride has a lot to do with it. People very often hang onto an argument long after everyone (including themselves) knows it's stupid, all because they're too proud to admit they're wrong.

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08-10-2013, 01:07 AM (This post was last modified: 08-10-2013 01:10 AM by amyb.)
RE: What's with the hate?
(08-10-2013 12:16 AM)Paranoidsam Wrote:  
(08-10-2013 12:06 AM)englishrose Wrote:  But isn't it also fear?
These people are terrified that science will burst their 'God Bubble' and their whole world will come crashing around their ears and then what will they do?

Well, that's the reason they hate science so much.

Fear, denial and pride... I'm sure pride has a lot to do with it. People very often hang onto an argument long after everyone (including themselves) knows it's stupid, all because they're too proud to admit they're wrong.
Agreed. They have so much time and energy invested in their religion, that admitting it might be wrong or even privately questioning it is unthinkable for them. So when faced with something that might conflict with their worldview, they sort of resemble a small child, fingers in ears, screaming "LALALALA can't hear you!" as well as parroting the same old shit they heard from their pastor or whomever. And because it's such a huge part of their life, questioning it would fuck up their entire worldview. I have relatives who are doctors and engineers and science teachers and supposedly not stupid, and yet that just makes them try harder to make reality conform to their religion. And then I have admittedly dumb relatives who just think that faith is more important than knowledge, and very straightforwardly reject knowledge because they think that thinking/learning about things will send them to hell.
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08-10-2013, 08:04 AM
RE: What's with the hate?
I have been curious about atheism in the applied sciences such as engineering. I know there are no fundies in my classes but skeptics and believers seem to split the class.
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08-10-2013, 08:47 AM
RE: What's with the hate?
What a mess, I have yet to see creationists and othe literalist outside the media and books. I'm truly thankful for that. Well then again I do get Jehovah's witnesses that my mom invites inside. All they want is to save our souls and fire and brimstone just doesn't cut it. They should just keep it private to themselves and those who come to them. I don't want my face shoved into it. Shoot..I never even heard of a door to door Buddhist, jew, or muslim. Do only Christian denominations do this?

"I don't have to have faith, I have experience." Joseph Campbell
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08-10-2013, 08:52 AM
RE: What's with the hate?
(08-10-2013 12:16 AM)Paranoidsam Wrote:  
(08-10-2013 12:06 AM)englishrose Wrote:  But isn't it also fear?
These people are terrified that science will burst their 'God Bubble' and their whole world will come crashing around their ears and then what will they do?

Well, that's the reason they hate science so much.

Fear, denial and pride... I'm sure pride has a lot to do with it. People very often hang onto an argument long after everyone (including themselves) knows it's stupid, all because they're too proud to admit they're wrong.

I don't think that's it. That might be the cultural root of it, but I don't think it's the individual motive. I don't think they're afraid because they understand that science represents a danger to their world view. I don't think they comprehend it's even a threat, much less the nature of the threat. It's simpler than that. They've been told that science is the enemy, so they attack. Us versus Them. Onward Christian Soldiers. That simple.
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08-10-2013, 09:09 AM
RE: What's with the hate?
(07-10-2013 08:14 PM)natachan Wrote:  I'm going through YT and I'm finding a bunch of videos with really nasty comments. Now, when the topic is blatantly anti-theistic I can see the point. That's an attack and they feel the need to respond. I don't support what they say or how, but I understand and expect it to a certain extent.

What baffles me is when the issue isn't inflammatory or contentious. There's a video that has an interview and short bio of Stephen Hawking. The video contains no reference to religion or theistic belief, only to his scientific work and his view on the prospects of science in the future. And yet the comments were appallingly hateful, including personal attacks and implications that his ILS was some sort of punishment for blasphemy.

This isn't the only place I've seen it. A video on Gauss's law and one on isothermic expansion also had nasty comments following them. Please note these were videos where the guy was doing the math to show examples and clarify the concepts involved. These are not attacking anyone, they're aids for students. So why the ire? And unprovoked ire at that.

I do get it when aimed at atheist videos, though not the tone (spelling too, but that's beside the point. I mean really, my phone has spell check). If we're wrong, God will take care of it. And simply attacking and slurring the video or its creator does nothing to refute an argument. But with these I expect it.

It is in those videos that do NOT mention religion that the hate baffles me. I even got hateful messages on an online post for history class about how religion was used to justify Spanish Imperialim and conquest in the new world. How is that warranting hate? I really am confused.

Seems to me that the answer to your question revolves around religion....
E.G.: Sunis vs Sheites, N. Ireland Catholics vs Protestants, Christians vs Jews, Christians vs Gays, Mormons vs Muslims, Muslims vs Jews, Christians vs Muslims, East vs West Catholics, and lots more. Hate speech (and sometimes action) usually follows these open disagreements.
The only open conflict I can't seem to find is one particular group of Atheist vs another.

"People don't go to heaven when they die; they're taken to a special room and burned!" Evil_monster
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08-10-2013, 09:11 AM
RE: What's with the hate?
(08-10-2013 09:09 AM)RaisdCath Wrote:  
(07-10-2013 08:14 PM)natachan Wrote:  I'm going through YT and I'm finding a bunch of videos with really nasty comments. Now, when the topic is blatantly anti-theistic I can see the point. That's an attack and they feel the need to respond. I don't support what they say or how, but I understand and expect it to a certain extent.

What baffles me is when the issue isn't inflammatory or contentious. There's a video that has an interview and short bio of Stephen Hawking. The video contains no reference to religion or theistic belief, only to his scientific work and his view on the prospects of science in the future. And yet the comments were appallingly hateful, including personal attacks and implications that his ILS was some sort of punishment for blasphemy.

This isn't the only place I've seen it. A video on Gauss's law and one on isothermic expansion also had nasty comments following them. Please note these were videos where the guy was doing the math to show examples and clarify the concepts involved. These are not attacking anyone, they're aids for students. So why the ire? And unprovoked ire at that.

I do get it when aimed at atheist videos, though not the tone (spelling too, but that's beside the point. I mean really, my phone has spell check). If we're wrong, God will take care of it. And simply attacking and slurring the video or its creator does nothing to refute an argument. But with these I expect it.

It is in those videos that do NOT mention religion that the hate baffles me. I even got hateful messages on an online post for history class about how religion was used to justify Spanish Imperialim and conquest in the new world. How is that warranting hate? I really am confused.

Seems to me that the answer to your question revolves around religion....
E.G.: Sunis vs Sheites, N. Ireland Catholics vs Protestants, Christians vs Jews, Christians vs Gays, Mormons vs Muslims, Muslims vs Jews, Christians vs Muslims, East vs West Catholics, and lots more. Hate speech (and sometimes action) usually follows these open disagreements.
The only open conflict I can't seem to find is one particular group of Atheist vs another.

You must have overlooked Atheism+. Drinking Beverage

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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08-10-2013, 09:13 AM
RE: What's with the hate?
(08-10-2013 09:11 AM)Chas Wrote:  
(08-10-2013 09:09 AM)RaisdCath Wrote:  Seems to me that the answer to your question revolves around religion....
E.G.: Sunis vs Sheites, N. Ireland Catholics vs Protestants, Christians vs Jews, Christians vs Gays, Mormons vs Muslims, Muslims vs Jews, Christians vs Muslims, East vs West Catholics, and lots more. Hate speech (and sometimes action) usually follows these open disagreements.
The only open conflict I can't seem to find is one particular group of Atheist vs another.

You must have overlooked Atheism+. Drinking Beverage

You're right! I'll add it here..... Christians, Jews, Muslims vs Atheists!

OK??

"People don't go to heaven when they die; they're taken to a special room and burned!" Evil_monster
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08-10-2013, 09:16 AM
RE: What's with the hate?
(08-10-2013 08:52 AM)Reltzik Wrote:  
(08-10-2013 12:16 AM)Paranoidsam Wrote:  Well, that's the reason they hate science so much.

Fear, denial and pride... I'm sure pride has a lot to do with it. People very often hang onto an argument long after everyone (including themselves) knows it's stupid, all because they're too proud to admit they're wrong.

I don't think that's it. That might be the cultural root of it, but I don't think it's the individual motive. I don't think they're afraid because they understand that science represents a danger to their world view. I don't think they comprehend it's even a threat, much less the nature of the threat. It's simpler than that. They've been told that science is the enemy, so they attack. Us versus Them. Onward Christian Soldiers. That simple.

I'm sure they do. Evolution ultimately undermines the foundation of Christianity.

If there was no Genesis, no Garden of Eden etc... then there was no original sin, and therefore, no reason for Jesus to be the messiah.

Have you ever seen the look on creationist's face when their ideas are really tested? It's borderline panic...

It's the reason Ray Comfort won't release the unedited footage of that film...

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08-10-2013, 09:31 AM
RE: What's with the hate?
(08-10-2013 09:13 AM)RaisdCath Wrote:  
(08-10-2013 09:11 AM)Chas Wrote:  You must have overlooked Atheism+. Drinking Beverage

You're right! I'll add it here..... Christians, Jews, Muslims vs Atheists!

OK??

Mmmm, not exactly. They think they are the only True Atheists™ and look down on mere atheists.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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