What's 'wrong' with this forum?
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07-01-2013, 05:20 PM (This post was last modified: 07-01-2013 07:20 PM by Near.)
RE: What's 'wrong' with this forum?
Hitchens is rousing, as always. But perhaps it shouldn't be "absolute free speech at all times, and in all places'. You should have the ability to say 'I respect your right to free speech, but the forum is, as it were, private property. We have the right to say 'you are not welcome here'.' That doesn't mean we have taken away their freedom. We have firmly invited them to exercise that speech somewhere else. We shouldn't sacrifice a good community for the free speech of trolls. They can troll somewhere else. But people should also grow thicker skins.


Don't let trolls ruin the things you enjoyed about the forum.

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07-01-2013, 05:48 PM
RE: What's 'wrong' with this forum?
(07-01-2013 05:11 PM)DLJ Wrote:  
(07-01-2013 03:52 PM)Logica Humano Wrote:  ...
Ah, finally a person who does not simply voice how they don't like rules.
...

Dude! Is that not just a little dismissive of all the other people who have made constructive suggestions on this thread?

Did you read the other suggestions?

Happy to hear your opinion or suggestions for potential solutions.

Smile
Ah, sorry to dismiss your post old chap. I agree with yours as well. Drinking Beverage

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07-01-2013, 05:53 PM
RE: What's 'wrong' with this forum?
(07-01-2013 05:20 PM)Near Wrote:  Hit hens is rousing, as always. But perhaps it shouldn't be "absolute free speech at all times, and in all places'. You should have the ability to say 'I respect your right to free speech, but he forum is, as it were, private property. We have the right to say 'you are not welcome here'.' That doesn't mean we have taken away their freedom. We have firmly invited them to excercise that speech somewhere else. We shouldn't sacrifice a good community for the free speech of trolls. They can troll somewhere else. But people should also grow thicker skins.


Don't let trolls ruin the things you enjoyed about the forum.
Namiloveyou is a perfect example of a troll that does not, from what I have seen, deface anyone's character for the sake of sadistic pleasure or emotional impartiality. He/she/it does not actively seek out anyone to maliciously attack, or to willingly hurt someone.

The reasoning for the three members I have urged to be removed from the forum was either because of the previously said issue, or spam. (IandI, Bishadi, and FZUMedia)

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07-01-2013, 05:56 PM
RE: What's 'wrong' with this forum?
S/he isn't playing the divide and conquer games. So not harmful to the forum structure itself.

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07-01-2013, 05:58 PM
RE: What's 'wrong' with this forum?
(07-01-2013 05:53 PM)Logica Humano Wrote:  
(07-01-2013 05:20 PM)Near Wrote:  Hit hens is rousing, as always. But perhaps it shouldn't be "absolute free speech at all times, and in all places'. You should have the ability to say 'I respect your right to free speech, but he forum is, as it were, private property. We have the right to say 'you are not welcome here'.' That doesn't mean we have taken away their freedom. We have firmly invited them to excercise that speech somewhere else. We shouldn't sacrifice a good community for the free speech of trolls. They can troll somewhere else. But people should also grow thicker skins.


Don't let trolls ruin the things you enjoyed about the forum.
Namiloveyou is a perfect example of a troll that does not, from what I have seen, deface anyone's character for the sake of sadistic pleasure or emotional impartiality. He/she/it does not actively seek out anyone to maliciously attack, or to willingly hurt someone.
Nor does he possess the intellectual capacity to successfully do so even if he wished to.

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07-01-2013, 07:41 PM
RE: What's 'wrong' with this forum?
(07-01-2013 05:48 PM)Logica Humano Wrote:  
(07-01-2013 05:11 PM)DLJ Wrote:  Dude! Is that not just a little dismissive of all the other people who have made constructive suggestions on this thread?

Did you read the other suggestions?

Happy to hear your opinion or suggestions for potential solutions.

Smile
Ah, sorry to dismiss your post old chap. I agree with yours as well. Drinking Beverage


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08-01-2013, 07:52 PM (This post was last modified: 08-01-2013 11:37 PM by GirlyMan.)
RE: What's 'wrong' with this forum?
(07-01-2013 01:27 AM)DLJ Wrote:  I'll use the SPIN technique (Situation, Problem, Implications, Next Steps):
...
Next Steps:
Where do we go from here?

I'm going to recommend a compromise.

Compromises have a tendency to be the wrong solution for everyone but are usually something worth trying in an attempt to reach a resolution.

You clearly do this for a living as some sort of professional management consultant. So I'm gonna respond to these posts one at a time without reading the whole thread first. ... For my own curiosity and personal edification if nothing else.

(07-01-2013 01:27 AM)DLJ Wrote:  Option 1: Self-categorisation (unenforceable by mods)
Each time we post, we self-tag our posts and new threads with an indicator of what kind of response we are hoping for e.g.:
a) I'm having a rant!
b) I welcome your opinions
c) help me!
etc.

Fuck that. If another member lacks sufficient empathy to understand which of those the OP intended, Girly'll be happy to help them out. No fucking labeling required.

(07-01-2013 01:27 AM)DLJ Wrote:  Option 2: Pre-categorisation (enforceable by mods)
Each time we start a new thread, a pop-up asks if we welcome debate or not:
a) Message Board only
b) Submitting for debate
c) Message Board and open to challenges.
etc.

This seems kinda like what polls are for. Feels redundant.

(07-01-2013 01:27 AM)DLJ Wrote:  The self policing rules can still apply when the occasional dickhead wants to get nasty on a 'personal' / message board kinda thread.
But what this means is that we can have much more specific rules and expectations are set up front.

More specific rules?!? Fuck that. Means even more shit subject to interpretation and legalistic wrangling.

(07-01-2013 01:27 AM)DLJ Wrote:  Essentially this means that there can be two sets of rules:
1) the existing free-speech rules for debate threads
2) 'no bullying' rules for the personal threads

Fuck that. When FuzzyMarbles first questioned Anjele's credibility the response I wanted to give was "Keep this up fuckturd and I will twist your scrawny ass into a pretzel with your head up your ass drowning in your own shit until you agree to stop. You get me bitchfuck?" Instead I had to fallback to suggesting a public beatdown. Why? 'Cause the former is against the goddam useless counterproductive piece of shit rules and the latter is not threatening violence, it's merely inciting it.

(07-01-2013 06:30 AM)DLJ Wrote:  If you come here to enjoy the warmth, friendship and support of like-minded individuals as part of a community (that undoubtedly exists here) it is best to preface your posts with carefully chosen words that indicate what you are hoping to gain from fellow members (i.e. raucous debate vs. help, advice, sympathy)

Or words to that effect.

Bah, if the community can't immediately discern what you're here for without careful consideration of chosen words, the community ain't worth a shit.

(07-01-2013 06:33 AM)Chas Wrote:  But this forum is not now, nor has it ever been, a safe haven.

Pfffft ... ain't that hard to create de facto safe enclaves. Unless you unnecessarily limit the bouncers and doormen.

(07-01-2013 01:30 PM)Dom Wrote:  However, I do not disagree with the ban of FZUMedia. In fact, I may have been the first to explicitly call for it as I recognized him as the poisonous wacko he proved to be. I feel sorry for him, but ...

If the rules had permitted me to properly admonish him, he might have corrected his course and become a proper productive member. ... Dude ain't stupid. ... Guess we'll never know now.

(07-01-2013 05:20 PM)Near Wrote:  Don't let trolls ruin the things you enjoyed about the forum.

Ha, ain't gonna happen.

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09-01-2013, 06:13 PM
RE: What's 'wrong' with this forum?
Alright, since I have to explain why I have left and why the whole FZU situation is tied into it is because I am of the opinion that we SHOULDN'T ban trolls or assholes. Believe it or not, I have actually talked to Frazer (FZU) on many different occasions and I personally believe that he is not a bad guy.

Having Buddy ban FZU was the straw that set me on the way. Now I get people wanting to protect other people and wanting to ban trolls, but it still doesn't make it right. You have a right not to listen to anything trolls or undesirables say on the forum, just use the ignore function. If you want to take action against him, tell him off and then comfort the victims. There is no need to ban people for being dicks. There was no need for FZU to be banned. He did not break any rules. What he did was bad, yes, but he should not be banned as it was not AGAINST the rules at the time.

I love how some of the people are using their free speech on the forum to advocate a position which takes away that very right for some people.

Now to log off.

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09-01-2013, 06:17 PM
RE: What's 'wrong' with this forum?
(09-01-2013 06:13 PM)Atothetheist Wrote:  Alright, since I have to explain why I have left and why the whole FZU situation is tied into it is because I am of the opinion that we SHOULDN'T ban trolls or assholes. Believe it or not, I have actually talked to Frazer (FZU) on many different occasions and I personally believe that he is not a bad guy.

Having Buddy ban FZU was the straw that set me on the way. Now I get people wanting to protect other people and wanting to ban trolls, but it still doesn't make it right. You have a right not to listen to anything trolls or undesirables say on the forum, just use the ignore function. If you want to take action against him, tell him off and then comfort the victims. There is no need to ban people for being dicks. There was no need for FZU to be banned. He did not break any rules. What he did was bad, yes, but he should not be banned as it was not AGAINST the rules at the time.

I love how some of the people are using their free speech on the forum to advocate a position which takes away that very right for some people.

Now to log off.
Free speech is not absolute. Disruptive people should be banned.

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09-01-2013, 06:19 PM
RE: What's 'wrong' with this forum?
(09-01-2013 06:17 PM)Chas Wrote:  
(09-01-2013 06:13 PM)Atothetheist Wrote:  Alright, since I have to explain why I have left and why the whole FZU situation is tied into it is because I am of the opinion that we SHOULDN'T ban trolls or assholes. Believe it or not, I have actually talked to Frazer (FZU) on many different occasions and I personally believe that he is not a bad guy.

Having Buddy ban FZU was the straw that set me on the way. Now I get people wanting to protect other people and wanting to ban trolls, but it still doesn't make it right. You have a right not to listen to anything trolls or undesirables say on the forum, just use the ignore function. If you want to take action against him, tell him off and then comfort the victims. There is no need to ban people for being dicks. There was no need for FZU to be banned. He did not break any rules. What he did was bad, yes, but he should not be banned as it was not AGAINST the rules at the time.

I love how some of the people are using their free speech on the forum to advocate a position which takes away that very right for some people.

Now to log off.
Free speech is not absolute. Disruptive people should be banned.
And I am of the opinion that they shouldn't.

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