What would it take to convince you of a conspiracy theory?
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30-11-2016, 10:43 AM
RE: What would it take to convince you of a conspiracy theory?
(30-11-2016 09:07 AM)Celestial_Wonder Wrote:  
(30-11-2016 08:57 AM)Gawdzilla Wrote:  You don't understand that word, do you.

originating, existing, or occurring outside the earth or its atmosphere <extraterrestrial life>

adjective
1.
outside, or originating outside, the limits of the earth.
noun
2.
an extraterrestrial being:
a science fiction novel about extraterrestrials conquering the earth.

adjective
originating, located, or occurring outside Earth or its atmosphere

noun
a form of life assumed to exist outside the Earth or its atmosphere

Definitions from three websites.

None of them were very specific on whether that being had to be non-human, nor did it quantify for how long they had to exist outside of earth. Ergo it would not be wrong of me to put Yuri Gagarin as the first extraterrestrial being mankind has ever encountered.

Wink

Extraterrestrial life on the other hand is more specific, but he didn't state that just extraterrestrials.
So, the point was again missed.
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30-11-2016, 10:58 AM
RE: What would it take to convince you of a conspiracy theory?
(30-11-2016 10:26 AM)adey67 Wrote:  
(30-11-2016 10:03 AM)Celestial_Wonder Wrote:  Perhaps adey, but how is it totally impossible for 9.11 to be a conspiracy? If there was so much certainty of this it would not be a topic of such great controversy. As for the evidence, well I see holes in some theories, things that are left unanswered. But for 9.11 I have never seen such a strong a case presented for any other conspiracy.

While the official story on the other hand has so many holes in it from my perspective, it could be considered the... holey bible.
Its only the subject of controversy amongst those who for whatever reason are emotionally invested in the conspiracy. There are a plethora of online articles which explain why people believe conspiracy theories all basically boil down to the fact that these theories forfil a psychological or emotional need, or relate to paradolia
There are no major holes in the official accounts, a group of terrorists got lucky and flew three planes into three buildings causing two to collapse and the collateral damage caused building seven to fall sometime later. What's more everyone saw it happen . Its all simple stuff really.

And these terrorists who committed suicide, what did they stand to gain from it? That these men succeeded in evading the CIA and the FBI, coordinating an attack simultaneously on the same day. And more importantly could fly a jet airplane, and intimidate all the people on four planes with pocket knives.

All the while at the same time Norad just so happened to be having a 'training exercise' for something very similar to what was to occur?

Further more they decided to attack the World Trade Centers instead of I don't know attacking military installations? Very susceptible military installations with low security and billions of dollars of equipment and vehicles just... sitting there... in the open... nobody really guarding them.

But if you attacked a military installation that wouldn't have caused as much of a public outcry as it does with attacking innocents. Although attacking military installations would most certainly help you in the long run because it denies your enemy of that firepower.

When the Japanese attacked the United States in WW2, they didn't attack the golden gate bridge, they went after the United States Navy particularly their Air Craft Carriers which they believed were in Pearl Harbor.

Terrorism for public outcry, subterfuge and surprise attacks for actual effect on your enemies fighting capabilities.

Air supremacy largely determines the outcome of wars these days, so why not go after the air bases?
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30-11-2016, 11:06 AM
RE: What would it take to convince you of a conspiracy theory?
(30-11-2016 09:01 AM)Celestial_Wonder Wrote:  
(30-11-2016 08:46 AM)morondog Wrote:  Yeah, we're all super dumb because we'd rather live in our evidence denying bubble. WHAT evidence. Give me ONE specific thing that you claim is evidence for ONE specific conspiracy theory and we will debate its merits. Or carry on bitching about how no one believes you.

I never said you were dumb, just that it was not in my capacity to serve your wishes as you requested.

One specific thing would not be enough, eye witness testimony, scientific experiments, news reports. I'd have to gather a lot of things to present a case if I'd hope to convince anyone. Why should I put in so much time and effort into something that has a historical success rate of 0%?

I'm sorry if you came here looking for a debate morondog, but this thread was never intended to facilitate a debate. Its primary purpose was to see if it was futile to continue things as I had previously done, and I have deemed it to be futile. So why then should I engage with you in something that has a historical success rate of 0% and that I now believe is futile?

What kind of madness do you think I possess?

Bullshit. Dodge much? You pretend like threads have some rigid set of rules, being confined to a certain topic, to avoid actually defending your bullshit. If someone made a thread titled "Celestial_Wonder: Please prove a conspiracy" would you do it then? No, you'd find some other way to dodge it.

You obviously have no good evidence to prove a conspiracy, and know that you'll be proven wrong. Just because your success rate is 0% that doesn't automatically mean it will fail here as well. There are many factors to consider. Maybe you were trying to convince stupid people? Just looks like more bullshit dodging to me.

Kind of like how Heywood (I think it was him...) claimed he had hard evidence of god but wouldn't reveal it to us because we "weren't ready".
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30-11-2016, 11:15 AM
RE: What would it take to convince you of a conspiracy theory?
(30-11-2016 10:42 AM)Deesse23 Wrote:  
(30-11-2016 08:26 AM)Celestial_Wonder Wrote:  (There is nothing I can do, just like there is nothing I can do to) convince theists that their god doesn't exist

does not equal (at all)

Quote:convince a person that your conspiracy does exist

(emphasis mine)

If you were trying to compare us here with theists, who are demonstrably irrational to believe in things they have no proof for,
then i am suggesting you overthink your statement/position/equivocation.


There is only one certain difference between a theist and an atheist Deesse, and that is their belief in a god. Being a theist does not necessarily make one rational and obviously being an atheist doesn't necessarily make one irrational. For in your terms it is either I or you who is being irrational in the belief of a conspiracy.

While I prefer to think that you are being just as rational as I am on the topic. I really don't like calling people irrational.
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30-11-2016, 11:23 AM (This post was last modified: 30-11-2016 11:30 AM by adey67.)
RE: What would it take to convince you of a conspiracy theory?
(30-11-2016 10:58 AM)Celestial_Wonder Wrote:  
(30-11-2016 10:26 AM)adey67 Wrote:  Its only the subject of controversy amongst those who for whatever reason are emotionally invested in the conspiracy. There are a plethora of online articles which explain why people believe conspiracy theories all basically boil down to the fact that these theories forfil a psychological or emotional need, or relate to paradolia
There are no major holes in the official accounts, a group of terrorists got lucky and flew three planes into three buildings causing two to collapse and the collateral damage caused building seven to fall sometime later. What's more everyone saw it happen . Its all simple stuff really.

And these terrorists who committed suicide, what did they stand to gain from it? That these men succeeded in evading the CIA and the FBI, coordinating an attack simultaneously on the same day. And more importantly could fly a jet airplane, and intimidate all the people on four planes with pocket knives.

All the while at the same time Norad just so happened to be having a 'training exercise' for something very similar to what was to occur?

Further more they decided to attack the World Trade Centers instead of I don't know attacking military installations? Very susceptible military installations with low security and billions of dollars of equipment and vehicles just... sitting there... in the open... nobody really guarding them.

But if you attacked a military installation that wouldn't have caused as much of a public outcry as it does with attacking innocents. Although attacking military installations would most certainly help you in the long run because it denies your enemy of that firepower.

When the Japanese attacked the United States in WW2, they didn't attack the golden gate bridge, they went after the United States Navy particularly their Air Craft Carriers which they believed were in Pearl Harbor.

Terrorism for public outcry, subterfuge and surprise attacks for actual effect on your enemies fighting capabilities.

Air supremacy largely determines the outcome of wars these days, so why not go after the air bases?
Plenty of suicide attacks since 9/11, pretty much the rest of your post can be summed up as the need for people to have the magnitude of an event equal to the magnitude of the cause, people find it frightening to deal with the fact that isn't always so. Also most military installations are dispersed facilities, if you want to create terror and kill more people choose a target rich environment ie two tower blocks. I have to say Celestial that these are some of the most dreadfully flawed arguments for a 9/11 conspiracy I have encountered.
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30-11-2016, 11:40 AM
RE: What would it take to convince you of a conspiracy theory?
(30-11-2016 11:06 AM)Dark Wanderer Wrote:  Bullshit. Dodge much? You pretend like threads have some rigid set of rules, being confined to a certain topic, to avoid actually defending your bullshit. If someone made a thread titled "Celestial_Wonder: Please prove a conspiracy" would you do it then? No, you'd find some other way to dodge it.

You obviously have no good evidence to prove a conspiracy, and know that you'll be proven wrong. Just because your success rate is 0% that doesn't automatically mean it will fail here as well. There are many factors to consider. Maybe you were trying to convince stupid people? Just looks like more bullshit dodging to me.

Kind of like how Heywood (I think it was him...) claimed he had hard evidence of god but wouldn't reveal it to us because we "weren't ready".

I don't think they were stupid people at all. If there is one stupid person in this thread its me, I can't think of a way to prove this to you. I've tried evidence before (not with you fellows in particular) and it didn't work. I don't know what I can say dark wanderer except that I'm sorry. I'm sorry I can't prove it to you, and I'm sorry I've lost the will to try.
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30-11-2016, 11:46 AM
RE: What would it take to convince you of a conspiracy theory?
(30-11-2016 11:23 AM)adey67 Wrote:  Plenty of suicide attacks since 9/11, pretty much the rest of your post can be summed up as the need for people to have the magnitude of an event equal to the magnitude of the cause, people find it frightening to deal with the fact that isn't always so.

Perhaps people also find it frightening to deal with the fact that sometimes, it is so?
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30-11-2016, 11:49 AM
RE: What would it take to convince you of a conspiracy theory?
Hold on a minute while I find a good eye rolling gif.

'Murican Canadian
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30-11-2016, 11:50 AM
RE: What would it take to convince you of a conspiracy theory?
(30-11-2016 11:49 AM)yakherder Wrote:  Hold on a minute while I find a good eye rolling gif.

[Image: af684ead77725bfd926093c63f0e281a.gif]

Here you go.
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30-11-2016, 11:52 AM
RE: What would it take to convince you of a conspiracy theory?
Meh, this'll do.

[Image: hsop.gif]

'Murican Canadian
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