What would prove gods malevolence?
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20-02-2014, 05:19 PM
RE: What would prove gods malevolence?
(20-02-2014 05:09 PM)donotwant Wrote:  So taking away free will is the ONLY thing god could do to be malevolent? Oh come on now.

To a lot of apologists, free will is the defense against the problem of evil. If you take that away... you're left with the problem of evil.

Personally, I don't think it's a very good defense, but that's a different topic.
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20-02-2014, 05:21 PM
RE: What would prove gods malevolence?
(20-02-2014 04:08 PM)donotwant Wrote:  If a god exists what does he have to do for you to think he is the evil one?

If bible god existed in the form that a great deal of christians believe, given what the bible says, I think the course of human history and current state of affairs in any number of places on the globe is sufficient to suggest at least gross negligence if not out right malevolence. But then it wouldn't be the god they believe in. Hmmm....
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20-02-2014, 06:05 PM
RE: What would prove gods malevolence?
(20-02-2014 04:41 PM)donotwant Wrote:  
(20-02-2014 04:32 PM)Alla Wrote:  to take away from me moral agency.

What do you mean by that?
It means that God would force me to do what ever He wants. It means that I am His slave. It means that I can not to anything(good or evil) on my own.

English is not my native language.
that awkward moment between the Premortal Existence and your Resurrection
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20-02-2014, 06:08 PM
RE: What would prove gods malevolence?
(20-02-2014 05:09 PM)donotwant Wrote:  So taking away free will is the ONLY thing god could do to be malevolent? Oh come on now.
taking away moral agency means this:
he wants me to be his slave
he doesn't want me to progress
he doesn't want me to be happy/he wants me to be miserable
Is this enough?

English is not my native language.
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20-02-2014, 06:16 PM
RE: What would prove gods malevolence?
(20-02-2014 06:05 PM)Alla Wrote:  It means that God would force me to do what ever He wants. It means that I am His slave. It means that I can not to anything(good or evil) on my own.

Do you believe that god has a plan and everything that happens, happens according to his plan?

Can anything happen that is not part of god's plan?
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20-02-2014, 06:30 PM
RE: What would prove gods malevolence?
(20-02-2014 06:16 PM)Simon Moon Wrote:  
(20-02-2014 06:05 PM)Alla Wrote:  It means that God would force me to do what ever He wants. It means that I am His slave. It means that I can not to anything(good or evil) on my own.

Do you believe that god has a plan
Yes, I believe that God has a plan

(20-02-2014 06:16 PM)Simon Moon Wrote:  and everything that happens, happens according to his plan?
yes.
(20-02-2014 06:16 PM)Simon Moon Wrote:  Can anything happen that is not part of god's plan?
I don't think so.

English is not my native language.
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20-02-2014, 06:37 PM
RE: What would prove gods malevolence?
(20-02-2014 06:30 PM)Alla Wrote:  
(20-02-2014 06:16 PM)Simon Moon Wrote:  Do you believe that god has a plan
Yes, I believe that God has a plan

(20-02-2014 06:16 PM)Simon Moon Wrote:  and everything that happens, happens according to his plan?
yes.
(20-02-2014 06:16 PM)Simon Moon Wrote:  Can anything happen that is not part of god's plan?
I don't think so.

Then, you are already his slave.

In your theology, you are just living your life according to the plan God had already created for you. You are unable to do anything different than his plan for you. He already knows every decision, choice and every action you will ever make.

Explain how you have free choice in this universe God has created.
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20-02-2014, 06:47 PM
RE: What would prove gods malevolence?
(20-02-2014 06:37 PM)Simon Moon Wrote:  
(20-02-2014 06:30 PM)Alla Wrote:  Yes, I believe that God has a plan

yes.
I don't think so.

Then, you are already his slave.

In your theology, you are just living your life according to the plan God had already created for you. You are unable to do anything different than his plan for you. He already knows every decision, choice and every action you will ever make.
Not at all. I can reject His plan for me any time I want. Part of His plan that I can make this choice any time I want. If I follow His plan for me it is not because He is forcing me but because I want to.
Part of His plan is that He doesn't know every decision, choice, action I WILL make in the future. Part of His plan that I either disappoint Him or pleasantly surprise Him. Part of His plan that I am creator of my will. He is NOT creator of my will.
And I had an opportunity to accept His plan for me before I came on Earth.
(20-02-2014 06:37 PM)Simon Moon Wrote:  Explain how you have free choice in this universe God has created.
I have MORAL AGENCY. It means that I can choose to do what is right no matter what circumstances I am in. Or I can choose what is wrong.

English is not my native language.
that awkward moment between the Premortal Existence and your Resurrection
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20-02-2014, 06:53 PM (This post was last modified: 20-02-2014 07:31 PM by sporehux.)
RE: What would prove gods malevolence?
(20-02-2014 04:08 PM)donotwant Wrote:  If a god exists what does he have to do for you to think he is the evil one?
Your question is wrong, the evidence is already for Malevolence, and it is the literal mother of all malevolence.
No other fictional malevolent character is comparable to GOD.

Creates beings imperfectly,
Has a tantrum when they messup, creates the "fall"
Sentences all their offspring to eternal hell upon death, this after a life of disease/cancer/genetic disorders.
Geneocide here genocide there, every where genocide.

Rapes one if his "daughters" and births himself out of her.then creates a situation resulting in a snuff fetish for his own guilt/amusement.

Offerers salvation from hell if you believe in snuffajesus, but recreates the universe/earth to show a naturalistic origin, rather then the bible account. so only the people who can't think rationally can be saved from hell.

[Image: God-watches-TV.jpg]

Theism is to believe what other people claim, Atheism is to ask "why should I".
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20-02-2014, 07:12 PM
RE: What would prove gods malevolence?
If a god that is capable of ending all suffering wishes not to, then he seems pretty evil to me.

It would be akin to someone with the ability to cure all hunger, who openly and publicly does not have the wish to do so, who we would consider an evil bastard.
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