Where are Gnostics coming from?
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01-06-2014, 07:17 PM
RE: Where are Gnostics coming from?
Vaginas, almost exclusively.

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01-06-2014, 07:59 PM
RE: Where are Gnostics coming from?
(01-06-2014 07:17 PM)WhiskeyDebates Wrote:  Vaginas, almost exclusively.

You are welcome.Drinking Beverage

Who the fuck are you calling a vagina? That's Mr. Cunt to you, bub.

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01-06-2014, 10:14 PM
RE: Where are Gnostics coming from?
(01-06-2014 07:58 AM)Hafnof Wrote:  It depends on what it means to know. I know the Christian God doesn't exist as surely as I know my wife is faithful. Am I gnostic?

No just naive Laughat

Just kidding

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02-06-2014, 01:19 AM
RE: Where are Gnostics coming from?
(01-06-2014 10:14 PM)djkamilo Wrote:  
(01-06-2014 07:58 AM)Hafnof Wrote:  It depends on what it means to know. I know the Christian God doesn't exist as surely as I know my wife is faithful. Am I gnostic?

No just naive Laughat

Just kidding



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02-06-2014, 01:53 AM
RE: Where are Gnostics coming from?
Is this about the term added to a religious position (atheist/theist) to indicate certainty of one's position, or just non-specific gnosticism? I'll assume it's the latter, seeing as how almost nobody addressed the former, but I have an argument for both. This one is much longer than the argument for gnostic atheism. The argument for gnostic atheism can be summed up in two sentences, in fact, that are actually shorter than the sentence you are reading now.


If nobody can know anything with 100% certainty... how do you know with 100% certainty that nobody can know anything with 100% certainty? Is that the only thing that one can know with 100% certainty? Why is that the exception?
In fact, how do you even live? Do you see someone getting stabbed and think "Well, that's totally not real."? Do you see your parents and think "Nope. Not real."? Do you see yourself in the mirror and think "I'm not real.". And note that "I think, therefore I am." is just as based on real-world data as virtually any conclusion you can or will ever reach. Or do you do what is logical and rational and assume that (some) things are real, regardless of the fact that you have no objective evidence for their existence? Because, let's face it, you have no evidence of anything. You will never have any evidence of anything; not even if you had lived from the beginning of the Universe to its end. Even if you had lived before and after that (if such a thing were even possible), you would still not have any evidence of anything that can or will ever exist... At least not if you assume that "evidence" has to be verifiable without sensory input (which is the only way it can be verified without interference from our flawed brains; in other words, it can't).
If you allow for sensory input, then, suddenly, you can know a lot of things. (Everything from this point on is assuming you have what is commonly known as a "healthy" and "normal" brain and don't lack sensory input.) You can know the approximate shape of an object. You can know the approximate smoothness of an object. You can know the approximate color of an object, if that object has a color within a certain range of frequencies. (From now on I'll be omitting "approximate", but these are all approximations.) You can know one or more languages. You can know how to write. You can know how to read. You can know how your brain works. You can know what happens in outer space. You can know the genesis of the stars, planets, solar systems, galaxies, black holes, quasars, nebulae, and Universe. You can know what happens during nuclear fusion and fission. You can know several (over 9, IIRC) states of matter. You can know relativity. You can know quantum mechanics. You can know (...).

The (observable) Universe is nearly infinite (I once saw an approximation that the Universe had a diameter of 96 billion light-years). In fact, it might as well be infinite, given our very limited lifespans, the finite speed of light, and its expansion. Yet everything we can or will ever observe can be explained logically, rationally, and scientifically. This means that there's nearly infinite things for you to know. Don't squander/downplay that fact by saying "We can never know anything with 100% certainty.".

The truth is absolute. Life forms are specks of specks (...) of specks of dust in the universe.
Why settle for normal, when you can be so much more? Why settle for something, when you can have everything?
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02-06-2014, 02:16 AM
RE: Where are Gnostics coming from?
(01-06-2014 08:24 AM)Rahn127 Wrote:  ...
I haven't a clue how capitalizing a word in the middle of a sentence changes its meaning.

Ain't that the Truth.

Yes

(01-06-2014 07:58 AM)Hafnof Wrote:  It depends on what it means to know. I know the Christian God doesn't exist as surely as I know my wife is faithful. Am I gnostic?

Oh! I've been meaning to mention... can you do something about your wife's snoring?

Thanks.

Angel

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02-06-2014, 10:00 AM
Re: RE: Where are Gnostics coming from?
(01-06-2014 08:24 AM)Rahn127 Wrote:  Most everything in life in known 100%.
I know a chair is a chair. I know my laptop is a laptop. There are very rare occasions when I don't know what something is at least in the general sense and definition of that something.

There are nearly just as many things that I am clueless about, but saying that nothing can be known with 100% accuracy is just wrong because we define things. We give a rock the title of rock because we said so.

It doesn't mean that we can't be fooled by forgery, so we have to be skeptical. When we add evidence to our general understanding we can support our ideas. Our understanding of complex issues will most probably never be 100% but each fact concerning the complex idea can be known 100%

Its like having every part of a motorcycle stripped down on your living room floor. A stranger can walk in and know with 100% accuracy what every part is but not have a clue how they all work together.

It all depends on what you are claiming you are Gnostic about. I am gnot Gnostic about grammar but I do make the attempt. I haven't a clue how capitalizing a word in the middle of a sentence changes its meaning.

Do you really know a chair is a chair? How do you distinguish from the concept and the form creates? is Howe something is made to be or it's use the disguising factor in a product? To what regard does knowing how to build a deconstructed motorcycle mean you know it's that motorcycle again?

I don't actual prescribe to these quasi-plato views, but I state it to demonstrate there's varying ways people have thought of the concept of knowing.

Mainly people I've seem with gnostic views don't pertain to this stern 100% view of knowledge... Some theists you see do use it, but it's not the only way people think of the concept of knowing.

"Allow there to be a spectrum in all that you see" - Neil Degrasse Tyson
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