Who do you support, Israel or the Palistinians?
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30-01-2013, 06:25 AM (This post was last modified: 30-01-2013 06:44 AM by Luminon.)
RE: Who do you support, Israel or the Palistinians?
(28-01-2013 03:25 PM)That Icelandic Wrote:  I can get the israelies protecting themselves and everything, but ya gotta see West Banks side of the argument too. The western countries created a country for foreign people on the lamd the palistinians had been living on for generations and they were just kicked out.
Exactly. What remained of their original territory after the war in 70's, no sensible nation would be content with that. Nobody would put up with that, it's ludicrous.

Land grab is a crime and must be punished internationally. Where's a difference between conquest of Palestine and anschluss of Austria and Poland? It's the same thinking, might makes right and the chosen nation needs a lebensraum. Nobody would give it a second thought 150 years ago. Yes, it worked for thousand years. And so did black plague.

As for Earmuffs and others, discriminating against Palestinians because of Islam leads nowhere. The more oppressed they are, the more extreme they'll become. Christianity and Islam originate from Judaism. All three religions are or were a scourge of the continents. I wouldn't consider nationalistic Jews any nicer than Islamic extremists - just better armed.

All the vapid, one-sided hateful arguments basically say we can discriminate against a chosen group of people and favor another, that we can afford to be unfair and escalate violence and then possibly what, commit a genocide and feel justified about it like about putting down a rabid dog? I smell hypocrisy. And I regret it comes from common people, because the only ones who have an interest in Israel are weapon, oil and religious lobbyists.
This lobby has an influence in mass media that makes us side with Israel, which is like siding with Spanish conquistadors because they're white and greedy like us. Very well, Jews and Muslims may be uncivilized. But for institutions like Security Council of the UN to be dominated by American lobby, that's a shame. I'm glad the Palestinians finally got a vote in the General assembly - and the vote proved almost all the world is on their side, except USA and a few islands. My country voted against too - but out of some misguided principle, on other votes it supported the Palestinian cause.

No, I'm not enthusiastic about extreme Muslims, I think they'd lock me up and torture or behead me for being a disbeliever if I was at a wrong place and wrong time. Israeli army would just lock me up and torture without stating a reason, they're the good guys here.
But I believe their children can be freed, educated, empowered and eventually form a modern, peaceful nation. Even if I gave up on all the bloodthirsty adults, I refuse to deny the children a future. Maybe when American atheists can see past the media fog of war, you'll try to contact young closet atheists on both sides and work out some solutions. You might as well start at similar situation, the union of Putin and Orthodox Church leaders in Russia. There's so much work for you in this world!

If you claim there are nuances to principles, there are no nuances to getting arrested or shot for disobeying the power.
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30-01-2013, 08:11 AM
RE: Who do you support, Israel or the Palistinians?
(29-01-2013 10:58 PM)Nappa Wrote:  
(29-01-2013 10:20 PM)That Icelandic Wrote:  Earmuffs, þú virðist eins og viðkunnanlegur strákur. Ég er ekki að reyna að vera erfitt eða eitthvað svoleiðis, og ég vil ekki fá á slæma hlið, það er á hreinu. Ég vil bara að þú vitir að ég er ekki fáfróður eða heimskur, og ekki lokað hugarfar heldur. Við erum öll trúleysingjar hér, og við ættum að reyna að fara af stað.

Earmuffs, you seem like a likeable guy. I am not trying to be difficult or anything like that, and I do not want to get on your bad side, that is for sure. I just want you to know that I am not ignorant or stupid, and not closed minded either. We are all atheists here, and we should try to get along.
Unlikely to get along if your opinion differ from theirs. I can get along with anybody. Even these schmucks if I wanted to. Their attitudes I don't like though.


Then go elsewhere.

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30-01-2013, 03:39 PM
RE: Who do you support, Israel or the Palistinians?
I don't support either. Let them figure it out themselves. Until a threat is posed against the United States, I see no reason to take a side.

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30-01-2013, 07:10 PM
RE: Who do you support, Israel or the Palistinians?
(30-01-2013 03:39 PM)Generation Why? Wrote:  I don't support either. Let them figure it out themselves. Until a threat is posed against the United States, I see no reason to take a side.
Couldn't agree more.

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30-01-2013, 07:31 PM
RE: Who do you support, Israel or the Palistinians?
(30-01-2013 07:10 PM)Dark Light Wrote:  
(30-01-2013 03:39 PM)Generation Why? Wrote:  I don't support either. Let them figure it out themselves. Until a threat is posed against the United States, I see no reason to take a side.
Couldn't agree more.
Let's rephrase the question, how would you like the United States to vote (veto)?

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30-01-2013, 07:43 PM
RE: Who do you support, Israel or the Palistinians?
(30-01-2013 07:31 PM)Luminon Wrote:  
(30-01-2013 07:10 PM)Dark Light Wrote:  Couldn't agree more.
Let's rephrase the question, how would you like the United States to vote (veto)?
There was a question? I missed it. Are you asking if the U.S. should vote for support of one or the other? Pull funding? Not sure, but...

The U.S. shouldn't be funding either, and shouldn't be voting on supporting one or the other. I consider the UN as big of a failure as the League of Nations excepting its longevity. The UN is funded by money, a lot of which comes from America who has more power. Ideally all nations should have equal power, but mankind is flawed, and greedy for power which corrupts the intentions of the congress. I would like to see friendly, open, peaceful debate based on reason and not fueled by greed, but I am not sure if that's possible...now I am rambling again. If I missed the mark can you pose the full question?

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30-01-2013, 10:26 PM
RE: Who do you support, Israel or the Palistinians?
(30-01-2013 07:43 PM)Dark Light Wrote:  
(30-01-2013 07:31 PM)Luminon Wrote:  Let's rephrase the question, how would you like the United States to vote (veto)?
There was a question? I missed it. Are you asking if the U.S. should vote for support of one or the other? Pull funding? Not sure, but...

The U.S. shouldn't be funding either, and shouldn't be voting on supporting one or the other. I consider the UN as big of a failure as the League of Nations excepting its longevity. The UN is funded by money, a lot of which comes from America who has more power. Ideally all nations should have equal power, but mankind is flawed, and greedy for power which corrupts the intentions of the congress. I would like to see friendly, open, peaceful debate based on reason and not fueled by greed, but I am not sure if that's possible...now I am rambling again. If I missed the mark can you pose the full question?

I like Thomas Jefferson's view on international relations.

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30-01-2013, 11:49 PM
RE: Who do you support, Israel or the Palistinians?
Muslims are a scourge and should be wiped from the face of the planet that is my opinion and I would gladly help.
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31-01-2013, 12:07 AM
RE: Who do you support, Israel or the Palistinians?
(30-01-2013 11:49 PM)panterasr9 Wrote:  Muslims are a scourge and should be wiped from the face of the planet that is my opinion and I would gladly help.


What an uneducated and biased opinion.

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31-01-2013, 12:16 AM
RE: Who do you support, Israel or the Palistinians?
(30-01-2013 11:49 PM)panterasr9 Wrote:  Muslims are a scourge and should be wiped from the face of the planet that is my opinion and I would gladly help.
Replace Muslim with your personal belief label. There you go, you are what you hate.

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